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  1. #21

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    some buffs are still better.

    fury warriors give 5% crit
    ferals give the same 5% crit AND healing when you crit

  2. #22

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    And fury warriors give an ap buff ...
    LoTP is one talent, rampage is one talent: no need to compare more than the actual talent.
    By that reasoning the moonkin aura is better than elemental oath because it also gives 3% to all haste, too bad they are seperate talents and give buffs that have nothing to do with eachother.

  3. #23

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    I'm starting to see the downside of the buff changes.

    Asinine arguments...

  4. #24

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Asinine arguments...

  5. #25

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Bah and here I hoped someone was posting actual values from actual ingame tests the elitist jerks one is ok, but those guys are WAY to focused on theory sometimes, and I find that chart, to be decent but nothing close to conclusive information.... Gief beta raid dps tests pl0x.. =S

  6. #26

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    I'm just saying you should either compare all the utility both classes bring or compare a single part of the utility that they both bring. You're saying that the heal on crit part makes lotp better than rampage, well it doesn't.
    First of all the heal on crit part is a seperate talent, it doesn't come with lotp.
    Second of all you're comparing the crit bonus, it has nothing to do with heals on crit.

    The only difference you can notice between those two talents is lotp being superior because it also give ranged crit chance, while rampage doesn't.

  7. #27

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Its clear to me that on Wrath every class will bring utility, then again as far as i can understand the developers want to make classes equal at utility and DPS, in that case the most skilled player will be topping the meters.

    Disclaimer: Thats just my point of view, i am not into beta so i might be talking bullsh*t.
    [size=20pt][move][size=20pt]Falcon Punch![/size][/move]

  8. #28

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    the beta isn't tuned. So numbers from the beta don't mean much in terms of class DPS balance

    @Panoramixe

    read my post and respond to it, keyword: buff. Yes I could look at all the feral utility vs all the fury utility, but I was trying to keep things simple as to not do half page posts.

    or if you really want to dive in: http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=14986.0



  9. #29
    Stood in the Fire Ägallar's Avatar
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    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    The laughable part of this whole thing is...

    Talented players usually make up most of the non-elitist guilds already, rather than the players an elitist guild would stack. In the "end of the end" game guilds, sure, there will be stacking of certain classes, but, in the guilds most people are in (yes, even the ones that progress at a decent rate) this whole "who's gonna be the best" question really doesn't matter. If you're good at what you do now, and can mirror that in the expansion, chances are, you won't have much to worry about come time to fill the raid. If you aren't good, don't expect to be handed your raid spot. Learn your class, excell, and find a group that fits your style. That's really going to determine what you do in the game anyhow, not having the appropriate "top" dps.

  10. #30

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Agree, if you're good, why worry? It's not like your old guild leader is gonna kick you just because someone else can give your buff in WOTLK, unless you're a horrible player, in which case you should have been kicked already --> justice

    About DPS rankings, I think the single target DPS between all classes will actually be really small. Even rogues get some buff/deuff use now. Basically all classes have some kind of raidbuffing and/or misc ability pack in WOTLK. I think a difference of 20% DPS with same gear and fully talented should be the max.

  11. #31

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Personaly when a rogue, mage , lock(well he can heal in a way) , hunter or even a fury war can heal themselfs on par with a ret pal, balanced druid, elemental sham, or a spriest then those classes can deal the damage the others do. When people (pure dd classses) get upest its more geared toword pvp then pve but both are concerns

    PVP: for the first group to kill any in the second group 1 has to greatly outdamage them. yes there are ways to stop them from healing BUT if both do the same damage then one heal is enough for a win.

    PVE: Given the group B would not be able to tank or heal like someone geared for it. But a ret pal could take a hit better then a rogue. A boomkin can be hit on more then a mage. a elemental shamman can heal themselfs better then a fury war.

    To me if they want all damage the same, then why not everyone heal the same or tank the same? Why not have a mage tank or healer? or a rogue tank or healer?




  12. #32

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    This is what I would like to see:
    1: Rogues/Hunters/Locks/Mages 100%
    2: Ret Pallies/ DPS Wars/ Moonkins/Feral/etc 95%
    3: Tanks 60-70%


    That is what would be most fun to me

  13. #33

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Pure DPS classes 100%
    Hubrid classes 90-95%
    Tanks >50%

  14. #34

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    They alrdy stated that there will be no 'pure' DPS classes in WOTLK.
    Classes that spec for DPS will share comparable DPS.
    This means that, for example, rogues will not always beat Feral druids in DPS in equal gear and skill.
    This is a good change imo, as a lot of people are sick and tired of being beaten by another class in DPS even though they are equally skilled/ geared.

    At least in WOTLK all classes bring raid buffs, and the nr. 1 damage dealer is now determined by skill and gear, and not the class he plays.

    So the list will be:

    100% - Damage specced classes
    80% - The 'off-damage' specs (Hemo/ Arcane etc.)
    60% - Tanks

  15. #35

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkharlequin
    100% - Damage specced classes
    80% - The 'off-damage' specs (Hemo/ Arcane etc.)
    60% - Tanks
    Arcane isn't actually an 'off-damage' spec. In BC it was very competitive, if not better than fire for much of the game.

    It certainly shouldn't be doing 20% less damage.

    Or why would anyone ever spec arcane? Frost is the main pvp spec. What would arcane be used for?

    I'm glad you're not a dev.

  16. #36

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkharlequin
    They alrdy stated that there will be no 'pure' DPS classes in WOTLK.
    Classes that spec for DPS will share comparable DPS.
    This means that, for example, rogues will not always beat Feral druids in DPS in equal gear and skill.
    This is a good change imo, as a lot of people are sick and tired of being beaten by another class in DPS even though they are equally skilled/ geared.

    At least in WOTLK all classes bring raid buffs, and the nr. 1 damage dealer is now determined by skill and gear, and not the class he plays.

    So the list will be:

    100% - Damage specced classes
    80% - The 'off-damage' specs (Hemo/ Arcane etc.)
    60% - Tanks


    Didn't they say we'll see pure dps with some more dps than hybrid? like 2.5k dps (rogue,mage,lock,hunt) and 2.3k dps (ret,druid,sham,warr,sp,DK). In my pov that would be perfect. If there is just a little difference between pure and hybrid. And if with = gear, pve spec, gem,etc. rogue,mage,lock,.. have same dps and ret,sham,druid,.. have same dps.

  17. #37

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Quote Originally Posted by jangkun


    Didn't they say we'll see pure dps with some more dps than hybrid? like 2.5k dps (rogue,mage,lock,hunt) and 2.3k dps (ret,druid,sham,warr,sp,DK). In my pov that would be perfect. If there is just a little difference between pure and hybrid. And if with = gear, pve spec, gem,etc. rogue,mage,lock,.. have same dps and ret,sham,druid,.. have same dps.
    Think more 3.8k rogues, and 3.6k retadins.
    I don't know who you are. I don't know what you want.* If you are looking for ransom, I can tell you I don't have money; but what I do have are a very particular set of skills, skills I've acquired over a very long career, skills that make me a nightmare for people like you.* If you let my daughter go now that will be the end of it.* I will not look for you, i will not pursue you but if you don't;* I will look for you, I will find you, and I will kill you.

  18. #38

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Quote Originally Posted by Munk
    Think more 3.8k rogues, and 3.6k retadins.



    Well if 3.8k and 3.6 ret it should be 3.8 rogue,mage,lock,hunt and 3.6 ret,sham,druid,etc

  19. #39

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Yup.

    2k ish dps was so bc.
    I don't know who you are. I don't know what you want.* If you are looking for ransom, I can tell you I don't have money; but what I do have are a very particular set of skills, skills I've acquired over a very long career, skills that make me a nightmare for people like you.* If you let my daughter go now that will be the end of it.* I will not look for you, i will not pursue you but if you don't;* I will look for you, I will find you, and I will kill you.

  20. #40

    Re: Raid DPS Rankings?

    Pretty sure that Blizz said there will be around 10% DPS difference between pure dps classes and the others. So Rogue, Hunter, Mage, Lock will be top, followed by the rest. Assuming gear, player skill, and the fight are all equal. Reality is that any of them can be on top. Gear between players is almost never equal. Same goes for skill, and different fights will give certain classes an advantage. Overall I dont think it will really matter.. Know your class, spec, stats, and the fights and you can top the DPS charts no matter what class you are.

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