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  1. #21

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    I can't help but disagree with this post nearly entirely. As I see it, Afflictionists can, at many points during their talent setup, opt for a way to increase their damage or add to their toolbox of tricks. For example, do you want Eradication for damage, or Improved Howl of Terror? Would you care for Improved Fear or Fel Concentration, or would you rather Improved Curse of Agony? And in effect, isn't this creating the exact kind of decision-making talent trees were designed to do?

    Personally, as the idea of raiding as an Affliction Warlock sends shivers down my spine the likes of which I've never felt, I would probably go for this talent setup. Please realise that the single point in Devastation is because that is going to be the single point in Ruin. This is also presuming that another Warlock will spec Malediction and fill in the Curse of Elements place.

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...00000000000000

    Painful as it is to lose Fel Concentration, I feel that it isn't as necessary in many raiding situations as, say, Everlasting Affliction and you can grab it by respeccing talent points out of Suppression when your gear hits the spell hit cap, and potentially Improved Curse of Agony if you feel strongly about it's damage per second upgrade. Overall, though, I think this is one of the most considered builds when Afflictionists turn their eye to pure damage.


  2. #22

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    youre kidding, right? have you seen the feral druid tree? do you realize how many points are in that tree?

  3. #23

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by xzor
    youre kidding, right? have you seen the feral druid tree? do you realize how many points are in that tree?
    the feral tree serves 2 purposes, affliction only gives dps

    your argument is flawed and stupid

  4. #24

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by Priderage
    I can't help but disagree with this post nearly entirely. As I see it, Afflictionists can, at many points during their talent setup, opt for a way to increase their damage or add to their toolbox of tricks. For example, do you want Eradication for damage, or Improved Howl of Terror? Would you care for Improved Fear or Fel Concentration, or would you rather Improved Curse of Agony? And in effect, isn't this creating the exact kind of decision-making talent trees were designed to do?

    Personally, as the idea of raiding as an Affliction Warlock sends shivers down my spine the likes of which I've never felt, I would probably go for this talent setup. Please realise that the single point in Devastation is because that is going to be the single point in Ruin. This is also presuming that another Warlock will spec Malediction and fill in the Curse of Elements place.

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...00000000000000

    Painful as it is to lose Fel Concentration, I feel that it isn't as necessary in many raiding situations as, say, Everlasting Affliction and you can grab it by respeccing talent points out of Suppression when your gear hits the spell hit cap, and potentially Improved Curse of Agony if you feel strongly about it's damage per second upgrade. Overall, though, I think this is one of the most considered builds when Afflictionists turn their eye to pure damage.

    You definitly dont need impr life tap, i probably would bother with soul siphon either.
    Supression still lowers mana cost by 6% its still worth getting, impr coa as well is something to think about if you dont plan on being malediction or there is a moonkin/unholy dk in the raid

    If you are thinking from a purely affliction raid dps spec you are crazy not to max shadow embrace and eradication. deaths embrace im still not sold on so i agree there

    If the current mana regen models dont change i dont even see using dark pact very often, but knowing blizzard they will nerf the mana regen because its insane in beta atm. If they do ill prob run with a felhunter and squeeze 2/2 imp felhunter in there somehow since it will refill your mana battery and FH adds to your dps

  5. #25

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    I personally don't believe in 5 point talents, and that they should be 3 points (maximum) for the same effects/percentages.

    Otherwise, why not open up receiving Talent Points at level 2 and onward, and allowing those extra points at end-game?

    More talent points to play with = more variety & versatility.

  6. #26
    Aerv
    Guest

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Well i don't know where u get your mana form, but a certain amount will come form lifetab and that coasts dps if u have to use it more often.
    And Death Embrace could be strong if using it together with Herosim, as mages or warriros also would benifit if its first used when obss is low hp.

  7. #27

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by Aerv
    Well i don't know where u get your mana form, but a certain amount will come form lifetab and that coasts dps if u have to use it more often.
    And Death Embrace could be strong if using it together with Herosim, as mages or warriros also would benifit if its first used when obss is low hp.
    Have you tested naxx raiding in beta? the mana regen is ridiculous, i play on my nephews account and i didnt life tap once as affliction through an entire boss fight

    plus fel armor now gives mana regen, plus our gear will all have spirit on them, plus improvements to mana battery class specs, plus the NEW dark pact is great.

    No affliction lock in their right mind will be lifetapping in raids if they play correctly i dont even know why blizzard still has imp life tap inthe affliction tree, should be moved to demo or destr

  8. #28

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by MortuariusBC
    Have you tested naxx raiding in beta? the mana regen is ridiculous, i play on my nephews account and i didnt life tap once as affliction through an entire boss fight

    plus fel armor now gives mana regen, plus our gear will all have spirit on them, plus improvements to mana battery class specs, plus the NEW dark pact is great.

    No affliction lock in their right mind will be lifetapping in raids if they play correctly i dont even know why blizzard still has imp life tap inthe affliction tree, should be moved to demo or destr
    It's an affliction spell, it's simple as that..

    It's always been in the affliction tree, and demo or destruction ALWAYS had more benefit from life tap then affliction had.

    But it always was in affliction, regardless.

    I admit, I'd kill to get access to life tap when speccing destruction.. the boost in mana it gives is HUGE.

  9. #29

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Yeah you guys are deffinately looking at this the wrong way i think. I dont beleive the tree to be bloated here is my spec and this reflects the recent posted change to ruin taking devestations spot. This is a purely raid spec build http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warlock Of course the improved COA can be swapped for frailty if ur raid finds it necessary. The improved range on affliction may/may not be necessary but i find the threat reduction of the destructive reach to be more important now that we can get ruin. I dont think the trees are bloated i think they are designed to be more stand alone and i approve. epic fail and my spec link. lemme try again http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...00000000000000


  10. #30

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanthere
    Yeah you guys are deffinately looking at this the wrong way i think. I dont beleive the tree to be bloated here is my spec and this reflects the recent posted change to ruin taking devestations spot. This is a purely raid spec build http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warlock Of course the improved COA can be swapped for frailty if ur raid finds it necessary. The improved range on affliction may/may not be necessary but i find the threat reduction of the destructive reach to be more important now that we can get ruin. I dont think the trees are bloated i think they are designed to be more stand alone and i approve.

    You linked the website instead of the build

    lawl :P
    try again

  11. #31

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    fixed sorry about that

  12. #32

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    You spoiled person.

    TBC paladin prot tree is 69 points max, in WOTLK it's 80 max.

    And what are you complaining about? We have to spend 15 points in ret to be able to tank, and then we need to skip alot of good talents

  13. #33

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by Daeren
    You spoiled person.

    TBC paladin prot tree is 69 points max, in WOTLK it's 80 max.

    And what are you complaining about? We have to spend 15 points in ret to be able to tank, and then we need to skip alot of good talents
    15 points, eh?

    sorry.. it's only 10..

    you have to make choices, and you get those choices..

    we, don't really get choices, we just get useless talents in the bottom, lowering our choices in the top

    which sucks balls, you get all good talents throughout the tree

  14. #34

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by Daeren
    You spoiled person.

    TBC paladin prot tree is 69 points max, in WOTLK it's 80 max.

    And what are you complaining about? We have to spend 15 points in ret to be able to tank, and then we need to skip alot of good talents
    you wont be dpsing with affliction without roughly 19 points in destro

  15. #35

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    firstly aren't they making ruin a 5 pointer (i.e 20/40/60/80/100% increase).

    secondly all they need to do is drop a few points from a couple talents, i.e make shadow embrace 3 points, deaths embrace 2 points and eradication 2 points, or something very similar

  16. #36

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    I see no reason to turn Affliction into a cookie cutter 51/0/20 type of build where everything is a no-brainer and you don't have to choose, it's actually fun getting to feel like you're customizing your spec. Demonology, now that's bloat. Bunches of filler talents, not too many awesome talents to get all of them.

    As far the haste going, could keep the duration of the DoT and make them tick more frequently, essentially adding ticks. Could become much more OP than simply reducing the duration, though.

  17. #37

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Here's my talent tree of what I think will be the best (affliction) dps build in LK.

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?warl...00000000000000

    Reasoning for talent choices: None in life tap/dark pact because I belive the implementation of spirit into warlock gear will start to make up for it. Also, Haunt giving back health periodically will help when you do run out of mana (and you can just do a normal life tap). I believe Affliction is all about self-sufficiency, and a good affliction lock will not run out of mana for a while. And when you do, like I said, use life tap.

    Five in Devestation because it's a place holder for ruin.

    I've also seen some builds with one or no talent points in Death's Embrace. Too many times I've been in boss fights and the raid wiped with the boss around 20% or less. I am NOT saying this will prevent that from ever happening, but 15% crit is a LOT, and it can certainly help get that boss down. Especially since there might be some other dpsers down near the end of the fight.

    One in Improved Felhunter because I think that buff is gonna be nice for a raid. It could also go into shadowburn, but I'm not sure how useful shadowburn is. I've used it in builds, but just not sure if it's the difference between good and awesome dps...

    Lastly, 3 points in Malediction because it = awesomeness in raids.

  18. #38

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by MortuariusBC
    you wont be dpsing with affliction without roughly 19 points in destro
    actually make 17..
    bane, imp sbolt, deva (will be ruin), destructive reach..
    NONE of this point is a choice, they are pretty much mandatory to keep your affli build going...

  19. #39

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Make dots scale with haste and I would be happy. Like with more haste, you get more ticks in per duration of dots, because they would be ticking faster. Thoughts?
    This user has been banned.

  20. #40

    Re: Affli-tree needs reworking.. TOO point heavy..

    Quote Originally Posted by Varithorn1
    Make dots scale with haste and I would be happy. Like with more haste, you get more ticks in per duration of dots, because they would be ticking faster. Thoughts?
    dunno if any of you were familiar with frame//ias concept when playing diablo 2 (practically increased attack speed worked at determined number.. let's say 40//100//180.. if you had more then 100, but less then 180, you'd be in the 100 ias effect)..
    if dots' PLAIN use of haste would be too OP, make it like these..
    give each and every dot a sort of haste treshold..
    es: siphon life
    haste < 50 --> normal
    haste >=50 && <=100 --> each 2 tick, 33% 1 extra tick
    haste >=100 && <=200 --> each 2 tick, 66% 1 extra tick
    haste >=200 --> each 2 tick, 100% 1 extra tick
    and so on, with each and every other dot (maybe varying a BIT the haste treshold for each dot)..

    this would be actually GOOD for pve (most dot, except maybe auto-refreshing corru via sbolt spam+pandemic, should be able to tick two times always)..
    PLUS haste is pretty much a non-existant stat in pvp (few pieces give PLAIN haste, you'd have to gear for it), hence it wouldn't even give major problem pvp-wise..

    if there's worry about it being imbalanced or about corruption not proccing due to sbolt spam, it can be even changed to something like
    1) haste < 50 --> normal
    2) haste >=50 && <=150 --> each 1 tick, 33% 1 extra tick
    3) haste >=150 && <=250 --> each 1 tick, 66% 1 extra tick
    4) haste >=250 --> each 1 tick, 100% 1 extra tick

    or use the treshold value of haste%..
    like 50--> use 4%
    150 --> use 12%
    250 --> 20%
    this way the inital "wall" will last "more" and till most advanced raid, making most ppl staying normally in the 2nd-3rd block, reaching the fourth under special condition (illidan caster trinket, bloodlust, ecc)

    of course number are just trivial (they are here just for the sake of the concept), the concept is everything on the other hand..
    the exact/balanced treshold would/should be determined through test/number crunching in order to make it USEFUL but not OP at the same time

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