Page 1 of 2
1
2
LastLast
  1. #1

    Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    I had some Questions as to a Ret Paladin Rotation.

    Firstly, Do you think it's feasible to seal twist with Vengeance Blood in PvE? Since Vengeance procs on every attack now?

    Secondly, I've a Question about a potentially "out there" Rotation with this Build at 70.
    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

    Notice the 2 second judgment is not taken. The Reasoning is for GC efficiency. With the 2 sEcond concecration increase glyph... you could potentially have a 10 second cycle.

    Judgement, Concecration, Divine Storm and then use CS on demand.

    Also I think it's Macroable

    /castsequence Judgement, Concecration, Divine Storm
    /cast Crusader Strike

    Thoughts? Any Resident Retribution Experts want to theorycraft, simulate, or test it out for me?

  2. #2

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Hmm, interesting.

    For PVP this would obviously no be an option as you would have little to no control over your abilities (Consecrating around a Blinded or Repentanced target for example) but for PVE this could work fairly well.

    You'd loose out on the Judgement damage but would probably gain damage from spamming cooldowns as soon as they come off their cooldown (I often find myself bored after running an instance for the millionth time and miss an ability coming of the cooldown). It also brings some easy of play for the lazy people amongst us .

    Certainly worth delving into deeper.


    [size=14pt]Read the: Paladin - Frequently Asked Questions[/size]

  3. #3

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    the only rotation Ive been able to work into a cycle w/o losing dps is under 35%

    /castsequence reset=12 Hammer of Wrath, Divine Storm, Crusader Strike, Judgement of Wisdom, Hammer of Wrath, Consecration, Crusader Strike, Exorcism
    (it will cast exorcism once per 2 castsequences as the reset timer is 12)

    with this cycle no gcd is wasted except for one if the target isn't demon or UD

  4. #4

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rawberry
    Hmm, interesting.

    For PVP this would obviously no be an option as you would have little to no control over your abilities (Consecrating around a Blinded or Repentanced target for example) but for PVE this could work fairly well.

    You'd loose out on the Judgement damage but would probably gain damage from spamming cooldowns as soon as they come off their cooldown (I often find myself bored after running an instance for the millionth time and miss an ability coming of the cooldown). It also brings some easy of play for the lazy people amongst us .

    Certainly worth delving into deeper.
    Obviously not for PvP. I'd also be much deeper in Prot for PvP. Need the stuns and dispell resistance.

    It's purely sort of an eazymode PvE Retribution spec. My questions pertain is how does it Rank vs the more Traditional options. Is it slightly worse, Better, or just out of the question. Is to much dps lost by this sort of rotation? Is it even feasible to use a full DS Judge CS consecrate rotation and have enough mana? I tend to like trying to find a rotation because it allows me to pay attention to the environment and raid. (I raid lead, so micromanaging my rotation really isn't best. )

    I have a S4ish Ret on the PTR but the lag is just so intense, and I'm not all sure how to go about getting the Concecration glyph. I've yet to see one posted on AH.

    Anyone with better resources of connections able to test this? Or perhaps somebody willing to break down to Theorycraft hardcore?

  5. #5

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    On a side note, anyone know of a DPS mod thats working on the PTR to record dps?

  6. #6

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scorpiodrush
    On a side note, anyone know of a DPS mod thats working on the PTR to record dps?
    Recount. Be sure to tick 'Load out of date addons' though.


    [size=14pt]Read the: Paladin - Frequently Asked Questions[/size]

  7. #7

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rawberry
    Recount. Be sure to tick 'Load out of date addons' though.
    I'm going to go give it a whorl against the invulnerables at the Dark Portal. It won't provide the "best" results, but it should give us some decently accurate results, and it's something that I can attack indefinitely while watching recount.

  8. #8

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Rawberry, you noted above that you would lose damage on the judgement cycle. Thats true, but from what I've been hearing, some peopel may be passing up the 3% haste or the nerfed 3% two ahnd weapon spec. perhaps buy skippind SoC (using blood or veangence) and judgements, yyou can get the 3% two ahnd and 3% haste. it might make up for the lack of reduced duration judgements.

  9. #9
    Epic! Gracin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    BFE, USA
    Posts
    1,631

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...00000000000000

    This is probably going to be my Pve raid spec. Im so used to how my judgement GC work I still only put one point in judgements. Your rotation is very valid tho by leaving the points out and getting the consecrate glyph. I may test this to see how it looks a little later.

  10. #10

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    After Tryign to test the macro on the PTR. youc an't get CS to work on the macro with the cast rotation.. if you don't mind having 4 second lapses on CS youc an just tag it into the equasion, or hit CS everytime it's up and make the rotation "lag" 1.5 seconds for te used cooldown.

    I'm not sure of the effect this will cause. I'm Just now activated the concecration glyph. I'm going to see how much more damage it's giving me, and see how my dps comes.

  11. #11

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Ugh Server Restart but I did one test in pseudo PvP Gear ( I don't like changing gear wihtout my outfitter >.<)

    I took some Screenshots and am going to post my Data.

    Stats----
    964-1155 Damage
    3.6 swing speed
    2142 attackpower
    77 hit
    30.72% Mellee Crit
    0 Haste
    642 Spelldamage
    32.63 Spell Crit

    This is for a macro Rotation with 10second judgement and 10 second concecrate, with CS in sequence with 0 Priority.

    /castsequence reset=10 JoL, Concecration, DS, CS (written shorthand)
    ~175 second fight @ 1212 DPS
    No Buffs (not even Ret aura) or trinket pops


    This is for a Macro rotation 10 second judge and consecrate with CS being on 100% priority (clicked as soon as it's cooldown was up.)
    /castsequence reset=10 JoL, Conecration, DS
    and Manually clicking Cs as it's cooldown came up (even mid sequence)
    ~120 second fight @ 1436 DPS
    No Buffs (Not even Ret Aura) or Trinket pops








    As a byproduct of this, I have confirmed that Seal of the Martyr Procs of Melee atatcks, DS, Judgement of Light and CS. (it had 101 Procs to my 47 melee swings. Add up all my specials and it fits )

  12. #12

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    I suggest taking points out of Improve BoM and put them in E4E. (PvP)

    But other then that, you good.
    Paladins are Cool Now?
    What happen to Kalgan?

  13. #13

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Knighthonor
    I suggest taking points out of Improve BoM and put them in E4E. (PvP)

    But other then that, you good.
    It's not a PvP tree. It's PvE notice no seal of Command :P

  14. #14

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Some additional Testing. Same as above, using the first rotation with 0 CS priority. This time seal twisting to maintain 5 stacks of vengeance (no priority on keeping it up to judgment) then going back to Martyr

    ~1400dps


    As before, Melee, CS, DS, and JoL proc Vengeance dots
    ~ 200 dps increase for seal twisting with 0 cs priority..

    It was rather consuming keeping focused to switch seals. I lost vengeance twice (but 1 Rotation of judgments and melee swings basically puts the stack back up.) A faster weapon would be ideal for seal twisting (My thought anyways)

  15. #15

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Using rotation 1 with Seal twisiting in my Full PvE gear with added Trinket and AW pops with an enhancement shammy I pulled 2300 DPS. Woot for seal twisting.

  16. #16

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ugrateful
    Here's my idea. fix heroic leap make it for the paladin class and call it Leap of Faith. Make it an on demand spell base that leaps the target striking the ground stunning the target for 3 secs and procs Consecration.
    That would be awesome but will probably not happen... ever.

    I would add a range requirement though, something like you need to be 5-6 yards away from your target to use this ability? That would really make it interesting.


    See, I'm not all impossible when it comes to agreeing with peoples ideas


    [size=14pt]Read the: Paladin - Frequently Asked Questions[/size]

  17. #17

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Some Paladins will never give up asking for heroic leap, Raw. It's getting to the point that it's just amusing >.>
    Actually, Mr. Lennon, I CAN imagine a world with no hatred, religion, war, or violence.
    I can also imagine attacking such a world, because they would never see it coming.

    http://mhkeehn.tripod.com/trashcan.jpg
    http://politicalhumor.about.com/libr...s/carville.jpe

    For once, Carville was a man ahead of his time.

  18. #18

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigercat
    Some Paladins will never give up asking for heroic leap, Raw. It's getting to the point that it's just amusing >.>
    I see alot of classes asking for alot of everything, last week there was a poster on the Rogue forums saying they needed a fear mechanic.


    [size=14pt]Read the: Paladin - Frequently Asked Questions[/size]

  19. #19

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ugrateful
    Personally i really don't get seal twisting all that much. You would have to macro a 1her with a swap macro and use blood like you said after you put your 2her back on to get the full dps aspect of it because you wouldn't be judging seal Corruption/Ven because it will wipe your dots.

    For the Op i don't get having poj in pve all that much anymore. You won't be tanking a raid boss as Ret and it will be a slim chance that you will be MT in 5 mans when leveling. I do get your idea with consecration but i don't agree with it and here's why.

    Overall you will be doing more damage with Job then the total amount with consecration. You can do it but personally i won't be using it. Consecration at best imho is a tanking spell and nothing more. It's not good for pvp unless you have the target stunned and in that time you will probably would rather want to judge Soc because the nature of the mechanic. Once a player leaves the area of the damage of Consecration regardless of how much the spell will do over time it will stop.

    I would rather see it as also a proc with a spell/talent then having it as is atm. Come wotlk down ranking is gone with this spell and will not help that much with stealth.

    Pve like Rawberry said, you probably don't want to be spamming that spell all over the place do to cc'd mobs.

    Here's my idea. fix heroic leap make it for the paladin class and call it Leap of Faith. Make it an on demand spell base that leaps the target striking the ground stunning the target for 3 secs and procs Consecration.

    I know that's a bit off topic but since we are also talking about pvp or some of us are it was worth mentioning. It would imo fix the spell to be viable in pvp and maybe on some boss fights that knock you back in pve.

    This will also be good for prot paladin is it doesn't have a dead zone allowing for them to add another stun in there of trash pulls as well and get rid of how Consecration is working right now and fold it into
    Leap of faith putting it on the same cd or 2 secs more.

    Mentioned this to a few paladins on the ptr and they thought it was a cool idea.
    I've stated multiple times that this is for PvE, not for PvP. Concecrate is fine in PvE unless you have uncooperative members of your raid/ guild. there is normally ample space to dps with conecration, especially in guilds that use pally tanks.

    Seal twisting is simple. If you don't know already, our specials (judge, CS, DS) also proc our seals (blood and vengeance). If you put up seal of vengeance, and sue a special, it procs vengeance and the dot rotation is saved. at wuich ooint you can stay in vengeance auntil judgement for the strongest possible judgement, or switch back to blood. all you need is to switch bach every ten seconds or so.

    Also, based on my numbers on my own testing, with 0 buffs, Seal twisting added 200 dps more than either only using seal of blood, or only using seal of vengeance (also hitting the judge concecrate CS and DS)

    Seal twisiting is quite viable, at least at lvl 70 on the PTR.

    That aside, This post is not about PvP or becoming warriors. It was about a PvE retribution DPS spec. Thank you for your advise however.

    Why did you mention swapping to a 1handed weapon for seal switching?? that made no sense. Maybe you didn't know that specials proc our seals now?

  20. #20
    Epic! Gracin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    BFE, USA
    Posts
    1,631

    Re: Possible Ret Paladin Rotation?

    I think what he meant by switching to a 1h was incase you lose you stack of vengeance. Faster swings=faster stack...just a guess as to what he meant.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •