seal nerfing (again)

[Darkeningsky]

lol more nerfs to our damage? word? are they trying to make our dps lower then any other dps class? if that is the case, unfortunatly they are gonna suceed. terrible, oh well, bye bye raid spot lol

[venom1234]

I haven't done any prolonged PvE damage but it is barely noticeable in PvP, SoC procs for a bit less but the insane burst is still there.

[Rambobarbq]

they nerfed burst and buffed substancial dps.... stop qqing like an idiot overall its the same you just wont see the same high yellow number, your world must be falling over......

[Shuji1987]

Krekko piss off with your 'we are not a pure dps class' mentallity. That concept has been scrapped at the beginning of this beta.

[cynicalj]

I must have missed something here but since when did seals proc off our special attacks (crusader strike, divine storm)?

[Rambobarbq]

you have to count since last build and its Beta your dmg will always yo-yo until they find it fine for them, you have nothing to say and at least be happy they didnt Fucked your whole talent tree like they did to warrior.

[Straten]

well, it looks to me like the took out the nerf bat with all of our seals as target practice...
and judgments nolonger refresh on hitting, which im not sure why...
with Crusader strike nolonger refreshing judgments either means were going to have to keep dropping judgements on bosses everytime it comes off cooldown it seams...
no more ret keeping the holy judges up and looks like holy is going to have to stop healing to put theres back up when it falls off

[b37x]

and judgments nolonger refresh on hitting, which im not sure why...
with Crusader strike nolonger refreshing judgments either means were going to have to keep dropping judegments on bosses everytime it comes off cooldown it seams...

1) Ret - Will have no problem keeping Judgments up, it's a big part of their dps.
2) Prot - Will have no problem keeping Judgments up, it's a big part of their tps.
3) Holy - Deep holy tree gives them Enlightened Judgments, so they can judge from a distance. Judgments of the Pure makes it so that they needn't worry about losing a GCD to keep up their Judgment.

Since every pally spec has a way to keep up their Judgments, we don't need Crusader Strike or melee attacks refreshing them.

[Hawkmight]

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...=2&sid=2000#32

Quote from Blizzard staffWith the changes to the way raid buffs work, we are blurring the lines a lot more between “pure” dps classes and hybrids that have the potential to respec if their dps doesn’t work out. But we don’t penalize classes for having awesome buffs the way we used to. Also remember that one of Ret’s big limitations before was just getting in the group with the good melee buffs. That problem is solved. If you’re good and know your stuff cold, you should be able to be up there with the rogues and hunters. Maybe not every fight, but not 500 dps below them either. - GC

We (ret) are a DPS build. please leave outdated thoughts for conversations only dealing with live.

We'll i wish there were more numbers coming out of Beta or post from folks who are playing 80 lvl content to give feedback.

[PalliesThrowStuff]

They still never gave us those 'cool' new talents in Ret and Prot that they said they wanted to add.

Hopefully they'll be a noteworthy sustained damage buff with little impact on our burst.

[Requital]

The change that made will help prevent 10K gibbing it's a move in the right direction specially since they gave us back 2h and fanat damage.

[MortuariusBC]

lol more nerfs to our damage? word? are they trying to make our dps lower then any other dps class? if that is the case, unfortunatly they are gonna suceed. terrible, oh well, bye bye raid spot lol

relax the same thing is happening to almost every class... look at spriest... lol more nerfs to damage. theres a lot of raid balancing going on now that more ppl in beta are hitting these 10 and 25man raids.

the burst damage was a little over the top. most paladins didnt want to admit it or tried to hide behind the "1v1 doesnt count" but it was true none the less. If you think more burst and less sustained is better you are crazy or just want to be OP in duels and 2v2.

Balance druids just got the spells rebalanced, DKs got huge nerfs and then got rebalanced. be patient ppl, no class is gonna be left behind in terms of damage/utility with the normalization of raid buffs/debuffs now.

[Ariakas]

though i sadly didn't get into beta i've been playing my 70 ret pally on the PTR and have come to wonder what people are freaking out about judgments not refreshing on melee hit?

as I'm sure a few have said, judging something causes damage, even doing light and wisdom, you don't have to reseal and even if you see it as a downside to using your GCD (i judge almost every chance i get for the extra damage) the fact things like divine storm among other things will effect seals, i think that more then makes up for it. i cheered when i used seal of wisdom and light and watched divine storm proc at times off each hit (light gave me over 400ish from each mob plus around 400 from the damage doing it solo).

i'm sure playing some more, especially when it comes to live will ground some of my excitement, but thus far this overhaul of the seal/judge system and the changes they've made to it since is still far better then the old system.

also, noticed divine storm with seal of vengeance has a chance to put a dot on all targets you hit! yay!

[yiptastic]

I think people who got panic over the dmg reduction should relax.

cos, just about every dps are getting dps "nerf". If this is the case, this is not called a nerf, it's called a FIX.


it doesn't matter how much your dps get nerfed. As long as your damage is comparable with others, there's no impact to your overall raid dps output. (the raid might take longer to down a said boss, but big deal?)

[Omatre]

I'll give up some burst potential for more sustained DPS. Its a PVP downed but a PVE booster. Its not so much a trade off, as its a normalization of DPS talents for ret at least.

For prot, as long as your TPS is ahead of the DPS, the end result your damage is secondary. I don't see the seal damage reduction being so major in relation to that area that it overall causes issues with tanking. Solo'ing might take longer, but its still a substantial buff over what TBC/70 solo work was IMO.

Having the buff to SoTR and HoTR will compensate for that. They realize that to really make you want the 51 point talent, they really gotta keep it up there and buffed to make you WANT to use it. Its a change in mechanics and concepts from how we tanked TBC (consecrate spam + holy shield + 8 second judgement). The cycle is more in depth and more skills are available to fill those GCD's.

For Holy. I dunno what to say, I heal as an offset/offheal, and it will never be a spec I go into primarily, for raid needs fine, but I don't like raid healing, and I never see myself doing so (at least with a paladin)

[MCxPmoney]

Correction, they nerfed burst damage, then nerfed "substantial dps" then nerfed burst damage again and reverted our "substantial" dps nerf. U R SO SMRT

EDIT: They nerfed our substantial dps via sob,som,sov,soc.

I have to agree with ungrateful, blizzard kind of screwed paladins over with this nerf, in live we use to be the laughing stock of all the classes with jokes like, "OMG A PALADIN ALMOST BROKE MY POWER WORD SHIELD!!!!!!" etc etc. But before this recent build, we were able to receive the top damage in any bg by at least 100k, even more. With this nerf we are only subject to more humiliation and jokes.