[My] New Balance Tree

[mgp84]

Using elemental shamans as a comparison against Balance druids speccing into resto is bad. Ele shamans actually get something for damage from their resto tree. True, not every talent helps it but it's more than a boomkin gets.

Concerning active talents; have you even looked at ANY of the Death Knight trees? Blood has 7 and Frost has 6. 7 "active" talents is not a problem as far as I can tell.

Last I heard DKs aren't casters. While true that deathknights do have several "Active" talents, most of these are Essences or abilities that are enabled passively through other spells.
Lunar Flare and Inject are not examples of something you may find in a Deathknight tree (function-wise).
While I admit that those abilities would be fun to use in theory; I can see them being introduced as baseline or substituting other abilities in their stead. IMO, every druid should have treants OR typhoon; make a less attractive version trainable and put these abilities in.
To sum up my argument, Boomkins are casters. Other casters don't have 7 actives in their trees, I don't know why we should. What we DO need is less bloat and more multipliers on our main nukes, maybe even a little upgrade to our AoE damage.

[Wildhorn2]

mgp84, we dont need more damage increase to our main nuke spell. We are bloated with them already. What we need is more flavor talent. Stuff that happen when we cast X spells.

[Chrysanthemum]

Last I heard DKs aren't casters. While true that deathknights do have several "Active" talents, most of these are Essences or abilities that are enabled passively through other spells.
Lunar Flare and Inject are not examples of something you may find in a Deathknight tree (function-wise).
While I admit that those abilities would be fun to use in theory; I can see them being introduced as baseline or substituting other abilities in their stead. IMO, every druid should have treants OR typhoon; make a less attractive version trainable and put these abilities in.
To sum up my argument, Boomkins are casters. Other casters don't have 7 actives in their trees, I don't know why we should. What we DO need is less bloat and more multipliers on our main nukes, maybe even a little upgrade to our AoE damage.

What difference does it make as to whether a DK is a caster or not? I fail to see why this has any bearing whatsoever on why we should have fewer active talents.

And why are you arguing AGAINST having more buttons to push? Balance still plays little different than a simplified mage so a few extra things to do would be nice.

My point is that having more "active" talents is not necessarily a bad thing. Why you list it as one is beyond me.

We don't need more AoE damage. Between Typhoon, No CD hurricane, and SF you should be doing as much or more AoE damage than most classes out there atm.

[mgp84]

mgp84, we dont need more damage increase to our main nuke spell. We are bloated with them already. What we need is more flavor talent. Stuff that happen when we cast X spells.

Have you checked out how low the spec has been in WWS Reports? We are WAYYY below mages and warlocks in our caster division. Casting procs are always nice, but I do feel there is a need to buff multiplies a bit and unbloat trees.

What difference does it make as to whether a DK is a caster or not? I fail to see why this has any bearing whatsoever on why we should have fewer active talents.

And why are you arguing AGAINST having more buttons to push? Balance still plays little different than a simplified mage so a few extra things to do would be nice.

My point is that having more "active" talents is not necessarily a bad thing. Why you list it as one is beyond me.

We don't need more AoE damage. Between Typhoon, No CD hurricane, and SF you should be doing as much or more AoE damage than most classes out there atm.

Not arguing against pushing more buttons, but I am arguing about them being tide down to our talent trees. Having some of these abilities as base would better the class. As to our AoE damage, Typhoon is a wild AoE which can't be controlled; therefore bad in CC situations. SF is not putting up the numbers it should (where I stand to say it should be upped), and well... TBH I have no complaints on Hurricane.
Just my opinion though.

[Wildhorn2]

Have you checked out how low the spec has been in WWS Reports? We are WAYYY below mages and warlocks in our caster division. Casting procs are always nice, but I do feel there is a need to buff multiplies a bit and unbloat trees.

I dont recall seeing any WoW Beta WWS last time i checked it. So how can you tell that? And last time I checked about the beta, people are just starting 25 Naxx and are not in full raid gears.

So i wonder where you get your numbers.

[mgp84]

I dont recall seeing any WoW Beta WWS last time i checked it. So how can you tell that? And last time I checked about the beta, people are just starting 25 Naxx and are not in full raid gears.

So i wonder where you get your numbers.

True, I that is a mistake. My data is gathered from Moonkin discussions in Elitist Jerks and several DPS meters from the beta ingame.
PS Don't know if you've noticed, but the base spell damage for starfire and wrath has been upped. Don't know if this should fix this problem. We shall see.

[Wildhorn2]

Im still waiting for links

[mgp84]

Currently @ Work and my bookmarks are elsewhere but here's a quicklink of caster DPS-comparison according to beta information:
http://dwarfpriest.com/2008/09/07/wo...s-comparision/

[mgp84]

Im still waiting for links

I'm still waiting for answers.

[Wildhorn2]

Oh yeah. This Simulationcraft thing that everybody take for God's speak. Check at this: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

Suddently moonkins are no more at bottom.

[mgp84]

My information is out-dated. Since then, Balance nukers have been buffed (base-damage wise). I am just hoping that they will scale well now.