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  1. #41

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Nezoia
    I was talking, live ;-)
    But you're right about that part. I still think 2/3 will do, atleast for now.

    My idea for a 70 build looks like this: http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent=bcZZGcfVRrzfiqfzio
    See my build above this quote.

    Anyway, since we're working on Kil'jaeden (the ultimative pushback fight) I'll need both Improved Shadowform and Dispersion. And due to how we run our raids, I'll also need 2/2 in Imp. VE.

    I CANNOT understand how you can miss out on 5/5 Mind Blast, don't you use spellhaste?

    Also, you won't be able to keep your mana up without Vielded Shadows, since Potion Sickness goes live with 3.0. So uhm yeah...
    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?priest is updated to latest.

    I just copied my wowhead url from my guild forum
    Hmm. So, you're now saying that You will need Imp Shadowform AND Dispersion to Down Kil'Jaeden. Despite the fact that no one else has needed these to kill him in the past? Plus with the Nerf to boss Health and all the rest of it. Hmm. I wouldn't think so.

    Yes I use 5/5 MB on live however the extra 2% spell dmg from spirit, Plus the extra 2% dmg to MF (which can now crit remember) and MB I think will more than make up for the 0.5 seconds extra CD on my MB.

    Finally.. Velled Shadows I still don't see much use for at the moment. I don't have mana issues in BT and I usually only go through 1 stack of mana pots in a full clear of BT so the CD reduction of Shadowfiend again isn't something I'd like to spend 2 points in. With the changes to VT I may find it required, but on Beta at 70 i'm not seeing a big Mana return difference the only down side would be the fact I can't guarantee replenishment on myself, but with another SP in the raid I should have it up most of the time anyway.

  2. #42

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    @ Nezoia
    I can see where you're coming from and mostly agree, dispersion does have situations where it is useful. What I would prefer is imp shadowform be moved up to the same tier as shadowform (still an offshoot obviously) and have dispersion be an offshoot of imp shadowform on the next tier. Since you won't *need* dispersion until you're in situations where you'll need imp shadowform it would make sense imo. Then we could get a 51pt talent that feels more in line with the rest of the overall tree.

  3. #43

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Ya know what, as a quick thought i'd much rather have had dispersion as a trainable spell and Mind Sear as our 51 point talent. I could justify spending a 51 point talent on an AoE quite happily!

  4. #44
    I am Murloc!
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    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Hmm. So, you're now saying that You will need Imp Shadowform AND Dispersion to Down Kil'Jaeden. Despite the fact that no one else has needed these to kill him in the past? Plus with the Nerf to boss Health and all the rest of it. Hmm. I wouldn't think so.
    C'mon, don't read it wrong on purpose

    I'm saying it'll be alot bigger advantage to have 70% pushback resistance than the other things you could get for the same points. Missing out 30-60% of the damage from Mind Flay is alot more costy than other talents. Special when I also have to shoot down orbs.

    Finally.. Velled Shadows I still don't see much use for at the moment. I don't have mana issues in BT
    Out of context note, is BT on farm status for you?
    Atleast iknow I spend less consumables on BT farmraids, than I do on Sunwell farm&progressive raids. How I experience it, is it's a big improvement.

    Also, it'll allow me to use a Haste potion for the DO-ALOT-OF-DAMAGE-NOW peaks in the Kil'jaeden fight.

    I'm not saying it's ultimative nessary for everybody, but I think my reasoning for taking the talents are allright.

    Ya know what, as a quick thought i'd much rather have had dispersion as a trainable spell and Mind Sear as our 51 point talent. I could justify spending a 51 point talent on an AoE quite happily!
    I think the reason for this to not happend, would be that Dispersion is slightly to overpowered for a Disciplin priest in PvP.

    And that they wish healer priests can contribute to the AoE (Holy Nova is also a base ability now), in situations where nobody else can. (Heroic MGT, prime example)

  5. #45

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Nezoia
    C'mon, don't read it wrong on purpose
    Couldn't resist :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Nezoia
    I'm saying it'll be alot bigger advantage to have 70% pushback resistance than the other things you could get for the same points. Missing out 30-60% of the damage from Mind Flay is alot more costy than other talents. Special when I also have to shoot down orbs.
    Out of context note, is BT on farm status for you?
    Atleast iknow I spend less consumables on BT farmraids, than I do on Sunwell farm&progressive raids. How I experience it, is it's a big improvement.

    Also, it'll allow me to use a Haste potion for the DO-ALOT-OF-DAMAGE-NOW peaks in the Kil'jaeden fight.

    I'm not saying it's ultimative nessary for everybody, but I think my reasoning for taking the talents are allright.
    I think the reason for this to not happend, would be that Dispersion is slightly to overpowered for a Disciplin priest in PvP.

    And that they wish healer priests can contribute to the AoE (Holy Nova is also a base ability now), in situations where nobody else can. (Heroic MGT, prime example)
    I wouldn't consider it farm status exactly. 8/9 are farm we can still have our bad times on illidan depending on raid signups. But I am using less mana pots than when I first started (clearly) but I have never chained pots since we were mostly done with SSC and TK.

    Well I for one am sick of them nerfing my enjoyment in PvE thanks to people being OP in PvP. Meah. I don't wanna start the pvp vs war though. I don't pvp, i'm rubbish at it, I accept that! lol. Gief pvp balancing on pvp realms tbh and pve balancing on pve realms tbh. But that's a different topic

  6. #46

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Finally.. Velled Shadows I still don't see much use for at the moment. I don't have mana issues in BT
    You also have a 5% mana return for the damage you do from Vampiric Touch. You will not have that come 3.0. You will have the new replinishment which scales tremendiously well with alot of intellect... which we really do not carry alot of on Live. So I am going to assume mana will be alot harder to manage in 3.0.

    On live... Dispersion will be needed unless you do a downgrade dps spec and get meditation. In WoTLK... Dispersion can possibly be skipped. Vieled Shadows and Replenishment with a 20k mana pool along with all of the spirit taps should make up for the skippin' of a poor, poor, 51 point talent.

    @Nezoia: Please, do not compare Dispersion to Life Tap and Evocation. I expect more from my 51 point talents. I do not like my 51 point talents being compared to and being on par with abilies you learn from your trainer.

  7. #47

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by shadet
    Ya know what, as a quick thought i'd much rather have had dispersion as a trainable spell and Mind Sear as our 51 point talent. I could justify spending a 51 point talent on an AoE quite happily!
    AoE damage 51 pointers are the epitome of upsetting., you are like...wow, this is not helping me in pvp or pve(mostly).

    Also VT is getting nerfed, so there will prolly be alot more mana issues once 3.0 goes live
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  8. #48
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    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    @Nezoia: Please, do not compare Dispersion to Life Tap and Evocation. I expect more from my 51 point talents. I do not like my 51 point talents being compared to and being on par with abilies you learn from your trainer.
    Was only meant to compare the negative effect (hp loss, rooted-in-place) of a regenerating spell.

    Also VT is getting nerfed, so there will prolly be alot more mana issues once 3.0 goes live
    Alot more than the majority think. We're going on a BT funrun on Wednesday to test our new talents.

  9. #49

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Nezoia
    Was only meant to compare the negative effect (hp loss, rooted-in-place) of a regenerating spell.
    Alot more than the majority think. We're going on a BT funrun on Wednesday to test our new talents.
    While there is no such thing as a BT funrun, I understand your point of view.
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  10. #50
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    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by antidan
    While there is no such thing as a BT funrun, I understand your point of view.
    Warglaives and Skull of Gul'dan ?!?!

    And I want the staff -- for looks

  11. #51

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    I think he ment BT is kind a boring place. It`s like saying im going to do fun run in molten bore.

  12. #52
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    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Karpalo
    I think he ment BT is kind a boring place. It`s like saying im going to do fun run in molten bore.
    Iknow, just messing around

    Hyjal is still worse. Atleast I got exalted, so not planning to go back there in this expansion if I can avoid it.

  13. #53

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Nezoia
    Who ever said that a 51 point talent should be a (personal)dps increase ?
    ohwell i must disagree here.
    warlock 51 pts
    affliction - (personal)dps increase
    destro - (personal)dps increase
    demo - (personal)dps increase

    Balance druid 51 pts -(personal)dps increase

    Mage 51 pts
    arcane -(personal)dps increase
    fire - (personal)dps increase
    frost - (personal)dps increase

    Ele shamman 51 pts - (personal)dps increase


    Shadowpriest 51 pts - defensive ability
    c'mon.... i'm going to pveDPS using this spec .... :-\
    Ceko@Al'Akir-EU
    http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Al%27Akir&cn=Ceko&gn=Voivodite

    [blizzquote author=Blizzard staff]Furthermore, it's not like there is much skill involved to that rotation ("GC SEZ RETS R FACEROLLERZ"). You hit the buttons and damage happens.* [/blizzquote]

  14. #54

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Remember that blizz said that all classes had their bread and butter abilities and they dont wanna add another move that is mandatory to their rotation. Look at all of the 51 point talents, not many of them are REQUIRED in a dps rotation. Most are situation abilities.

  15. #55
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    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    frost - (personal)dps increase
    What? It's a 5 second stun

    Look at all of the 51 point talents, not many of them are REQUIRED in a dps rotation. Most are situation abilities.
    Excactly!

    Well, except Living Bomb and Haunt, but it's correct. I doubth warlocks will even get Chaos Bolt tbh.

  16. #56

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Rockeroad
    Remember that blizz said that all classes had their bread and butter abilities and they dont wanna add another move that is mandatory to their rotation. Look at all of the 51 point talents, not many of them are REQUIRED in a dps rotation. Most are situation abilities.
    hmmm maybe you are right tho....
    maybe we should wait and see
    Ceko@Al'Akir-EU
    http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Al%27Akir&cn=Ceko&gn=Voivodite

    [blizzquote author=Blizzard staff]Furthermore, it's not like there is much skill involved to that rotation ("GC SEZ RETS R FACEROLLERZ"). You hit the buttons and damage happens.* [/blizzquote]

  17. #57

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Nezoia
    What? It's a 5 second stun
    nomatter what its offensive
    Ceko@Al'Akir-EU
    http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Al%27Akir&cn=Ceko&gn=Voivodite

    [blizzquote author=Blizzard staff]Furthermore, it's not like there is much skill involved to that rotation ("GC SEZ RETS R FACEROLLERZ"). You hit the buttons and damage happens.* [/blizzquote]

  18. #58

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Rockeroad
    your welcome =). And to the person who said i was a 12 year old who does not know how to play the game i am a 15 year old who is taking college courses and is one of the smartest of my class. EAT THAT
    While I'd agree that personal attacks are unwarrented, you're not helping your cause by adding "eat that" in caps at the end :P

    Just saying

  19. #59

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Tablemaker
    @Nezoia: Please, do not compare Dispersion to Life Tap and Evocation. I expect more from my 51 point talents. I do not like my 51 point talents being compared to and being on par with abilies you learn from your trainer.
    As Blizzard has stated in the past, talented abilities are not intended to be automatically superior to trained abilities. They don't sit down and say "Hey, Mages have to spend a Talent point on their Water Elemental, so it has to be better than the baseline Warlock/Hunter pets".

  20. #60

    Re: Dispersion Is staying as a bad 51 pt

    Quote Originally Posted by Ceko
    ohwell i must disagree here.
    warlock 51 pts
    affliction - (personal)dps increase
    destro - (personal)dps increase
    demo - (personal)dps increase

    Balance druid 51 pts -(personal)dps increase

    Mage 51 pts
    arcane -(personal)dps increase
    fire - (personal)dps increase
    frost - (personal)dps increase

    Ele shamman 51 pts - (personal)dps increase


    Shadowpriest 51 pts - defensive ability
    c'mon.... i'm going to pveDPS using this spec .... :-\
    You do realize balance gets a crappy aoe as their 51 pt talent, as does ele. While the math on chaos bolt and Metamorphosis is sketchy at best, and deep freeze isn't even a dps attack.

    Seriously dispersion's utility is way better than the ele and balance 51 pt aoes, wtf good is an AOE on those class when you still need mages and locks for good aoe anyways?
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