Welfare raiding.

[Advent]

Actually is is quite true. I've seen and joined countless "raiding" guilds that advertised in this manner, and every single one of them turned out to be just what sd78 pointed out. Wiping excessively on trash in ZA, SSC, Tk & Hyjal for months. Over and over again.

[Cobrakai]

For me when somebody says "I'm a Casual player" I usually think "Alright... somebody level headed who realizes this is a game. Probably will be fun to group with them."

For me when sobody says "Yeah Im hardcore" I usually think "Alright... somebody whose probably an a$$&*% and thinks he knows everything because this game is his everything because its his life. This is going to suck grouping with them..."

Casuals are usually nice people while Hardcores are usually the pricks.

For instance:
www.elitistjerks.com

These people have made a Dynasty off being jerks to other people.

how many people do you meet routinely that say "im a hardcore?" i really doubt that people are running around saying that to everyone they meet.

and whats wrong with ej? its a great site for people who are interested in class mechanics, raiding, addons, etc. they've made a dynasty off of being knowledgeable about wow. sure its a game, but whats wrong with that? maybe you dont know everything there is to know about your class, why get on ej's case about helping people who would like to?

[Cobrakai]

Actually is is quite true. I've seen and joined countless "raiding" guilds that advertised in this manner, and every single one of them turned out to be just what sd78 pointed out. Wiping excessively on trash in ZA, SSC, Tk & Hyjal for months. Over and over again.

and they are the same that are on these boards spamming "down with the elitist pricks who post on ej and enjoy a challenge!"

[pixartist]

Redundant means quoting your second post here, AND calling you an idiot, even though you already illustrated it yourself.

pwned ^^

[Deleted]

the problem here is the term casual is getting confused with the term noob. a casual player does not discribe skill it discribes how long or much you put into the game. the term noob on the other hand discribes a player that has no clue how to play, what talents to choose, or even what is expected to win, they are also normally only after one thing EPEEN.

so maybe that is where this whole conversation and the mentality needs to start from, it is ok to be casual, but it is not ok to be a noob. my guild is a casual guild. we raid when we can what we can. while we have a few dedicated raiders 30% are rotational members. we clear kara, za, ssc, tk, and do well in hyjal and bt. while yes we have not seen swp we do raid we do have fun, and we don't agree with some nerfs but do like the option to see all the content.

No, the term noob means a newbie; a new player. It has nothing to do with skills. I've met some of these "noobs" who just dinged 70 and yet play better than some casuals who have been playing since vanilla.

It's ok to be casual. It's also ok to be noob, you were one too. It's not ok to be a shit player.

[Lucky_]

Casual is someone who raids a few times a week or/and generally doesn't take the game too seriously. Casual guild is one that raids fairly rarely and not "all in" style.
They are usually fairly successful, only slightly behind "hardcore" guilds in terms of progression. Example would be my guild that was working on twins when nerf came, only a month and a half after having a total guild resurrection post summer vacation.

Then there is what many "hardcore" like to think of as casual, but what is in reality a "noob" guild - guild that collects players who play a lot, but have a little clue about the actual game. That is the type of guild that can only wipe on trash and down a handful of bosses.


Notably most of the "hardcore" people who think that "casual = noob" are usually the ones who are quite bad at social networking, and in fact do struggle in both real life and in-game if they ever get separated from their main guild for some reason due to lack of social skills and acceptance.

The real hardcore, ones that actually pull the weight in whatever guild they are in rather then ride their handful of friends know the difference. Then again, they're usually not the ones whining and trolling on the forums.

[arel00]

It's ok to be casual. It's also ok to be noob, you were one too. It's not ok to be a shit player.

This.

[wisher]

How do you expect beta testers to test the heroics if they cant even make it through them in the first place? blizzard makes them easy mode in beta for a reason, makes for quicker testing, they did it with BC they will do it again.

If I want something to be tested, I let people test the final product, and not something that is easier or
changed in any other way. Because that's not testing, that's guessing.

[Lucky_]

If I want something to be tested, I let people test the final product, and not something that is easier or
changed in any other way. Because that's not testing, that's guessing.

And that would be the reason why you're not the one earning a paycheck from designing how the beta should work, but someone who actually knows what he's doing.

And good lord, if someone does hire you to design QC tests, good luck to that company. They'll need it.

[HeyMonkeyFace]

^ That.
They tune it down to get a larger number of people testing the same content. More data is better.

[Advent]

ANYWAY.... I just got done reading the most hilarious post. Did people really think Kara was hard when it first hit? It wasn't. Mind, I had NO experience Pre-BC, I've never been carried by any group or guild, and I had a phenomenally easy time in Karazhan ALL the way through, before all the nerfs.

Who the hell thought it was hard? o.O ?

[wisher]

And that would be the reason why you're not the one earning a paycheck from designing how the beta should work, but someone who actually knows what he's doing.

And good lord, if someone does hire you to design QC tests, good luck to that company. They'll need it.

Well, if Blizzard would do their job right in the first place, they wouldn't need their players to test their
game in the first place. I can understand that you need x-thousand players to test the servers, but why
don't they do what they are payed for, test the actual content themselves and just release a finished product. Can't be that hard if you are willing to do it and not crap at what you do.

[Wiltron]

ANYWAY.... I just got done reading the most hilarious post. Did people really think Kara was hard when it first hit? It wasn't. Mind, I had NO experience Pre-BC, I've never been carried by any group or guild, and I had a phenomenally easy time in Karazhan ALL the way through, before all the nerfs.

Who the hell thought it was hard? o.O ?

I remember back when T5 content was what Kil'Jaeden was at the beginning of summer, 2-3 guilds max have seen him, and no one beat him yet.

My guild had trouble on Curator, that enrage F'ed us over every time

[Advent]

My guild had trouble on Curator, that enrage F'ed us over every time

That is a shame. I'm still laughing at that poster. Kara...hard... LOL!!!

If gearing becomes a hassle to the point where my server starts min/maxing, I'm quitting this game. Just throwing that out there. JOIN THE COALITION!!!

[Blooddeity]

Well, if Blizzard would do their job right in the first place, they wouldn't need their players to test their
game in the first place. I can understand that you need x-thousand players to test the servers, but why
don't they do what they are payed for, test the actual content themselves and just release a finished product. Can't be that hard if you are willing to do it and not crap at what you do.

This is not true. When you develop/create software you will always need an independent group to test it. Testing you own stuff will always be worse then letting an independent group who has no or little knowledge test it.

Good companies always have extensive beta testing and/or testing by a "hired" testing company which is not part of their own.

The problem with testing you own product is that because of internal pressure to finish a product things can be skipped, overlooked or only ideal testing situation can be made that will leave a lot of bugs after.

[Jasyn]

Games that are released without having a beta or consumer trial fail. Period.

[Rageudder]

For me when somebody says "I'm a Casual player" I usually think "Alright... somebody level headed who realizes this is a game. Probably will be fun to group with them."

For me when sobody says "Yeah Im hardcore" I usually think "Alright... somebody whose probably an a$$&*% and thinks he knows everything because this game is his everything because its his life. This is going to suck grouping with them..."

Casuals are usually nice people while Hardcores are usually the pricks.

For instance:
www.elitistjerks.com

These people have made a Dynasty off being jerks to other people.

Incorrect. They are not jerks, and never rude.

They are however painstalkingly correct, and will tell you if you are wrong. Having lurked on EJ for the majority of TBC (although i rarely post, I just report people who break the rules), I have never ever seen anyone out of line (except fresh members who siddle into their domain from sites like this one).

[Bronwynn]

Incorrect. They are not jerks, and never rude.

They are however painstalkingly correct, and will tell you if you are wrong. Having lurked on EJ for the majority of TBC (although i rarely post, I just report people who break the rules), I have never ever seen anyone out of line (except fresh members who siddle into their domain from sites like this one).

I second that. EJ is actually one of the most mature, grounded and honest forums about WoW that I know. Its just not a place where you can just blurt out crap and expect people to let you get away with it.

So, did we get any new information yet about the difficulty of heroics etc. being tuned down for beta? Or is it still guesswork at this point?

[Fenixdown]

Yeah I <3 EJ. I go to their priest forums many times to see what they feel healing will be like in the expansion, what gear setups are best for Discipline and for Holy (btw yes, there is a difference on their optimal stats according to the site), ect. None of it comes off as condescending or negative towards others. It's well thought out and extremely informative. Which is more than I can say for about 75-80% of the stuff spewed here. :P

[Coronel]

Translation:

"I tink im da uber l337 and me no wan deez NOOB playerz tu get me epix!"

"I meanz id iz lik wellfair, dey juzt giv dem away?!?!"

"GG Blizz I go Kancel my account nuw k thx bai."

If you had a business (thank god you don't) would you cater to 98% of your customers or 2%? Answer me honestly, then stfu.

This.