Nerfed JoTW to 15%. Uh, what?

[Whoopzz]

A standard ret rotation takes 25% base mana, and JoTW will only refund 15%. Where is Blizzard's reasoning in thinking that Ret wont run out of mana with the CS + DS + Judgement rotation?

Blizzard already said that its a sustainable rotation even without Divine Plea and Judgement of Wisdom. I'm really failing to see how this is, considering the replenishment effect only adds about 12 mana per 5... Am I overlooking something or should I just deal with the fact that Paladins are getting the nerf bat in EVERY sinle aspect?


Note: this post has nothing to do with damage, so leave your QQ's at the door.

[Heretushi]

You are overlooking something. Go to a training dummy and see for yourself.

BTW, mana return was hotfixed in last week, will not change at 3.0.3. And as of right now, it's ok.

[Offhand]

A "standard" ret rotation is possible to keep up for well over 6 minutes. Mana is simply not infinite like before.

[Montoya]

Then someone is overlooking something. Between blasting Judgement of Wisdom every 8 seconds, Judgements of the Wise at 3/3, and the "mana battery" effect it provides I have NEVER had a problem running out of mana in PvE.

I did a 2.5 hour Honor Grind this afternoon on level 70 Blood Elves for Scryer Rep, and not once had to stop for a drink or leave combat.

Not sure what your doing, but I'm doing something right.

[Jamster1990]

Judging Wisdom on mob gives you 15% mana + the small amount for the buff, but also causes every subsequent hit to have the possibility of returning another 2% of your mana. 8sec CD on Judgement in this time u will probably Use 1-2 CS, 1 DS, 2-3 Auto attack. meaning a possible further 8-12% mana returns. (if it cant proc on specials some one please correct me.)

In addition to these 2, you will be taking damage from Seal of Blood hits, and Also Judge of Blood. this adds up to be quite a bit of damage over the duration of a fight. whick when healed also returns mana to you through spiritual attunment. get a glyph and u can increase that further. ofc if the boss does AoE you will have even more mana to play with.

so far i have noticed no mana issues ending fights on 60-65% mana lower if i get bored and heal for a bit. I.e. Illidan P2 or Felmyst P2 etc.

[Montoya]

(if it cant proc on specials some one please correct me.)

It can, or at least from what I've seen the last few days when I've been using it. A single Crusader Strike with a Seal of Command Proc grants me two applications of mana regen. Procin' at 133 mana each time (Before 3.0.3).

[Tarbasch]

So is the jotw and soc nerfs already on live?

[Inside]

Mana is not an issue at 80 despite what the "number crunchers" say. Divine Plea every min + switch to Seal of Wisdom (glyphed) for 10 sec AFTER the 8+ min it takes you to run out of mana in a raid, even with spamming consecrate. They also negate the fact of other raid buffs and the mana you get back from other people healing you which is a huge boost as well. You do not go OOM in PvE on boss fights at all unless you are zoning out and do not keep judging wisdom.

The only mana issue we have right now is the PvP issue, and that is being mana drained in a blink of an eye. Hopefully they will fix this asap or doing arenas against a mana drain team will be impossible.

Yes the JotW was hotfixed a week ago.

[Hawkmight]

Then someone is overlooking something. Between blasting Judgement of Wisdom every 8 seconds, Judgements of the Wise at 3/3, and the "mana battery" effect it provides I have NEVER had a problem running out of mana in PvE.

I did a 2.5 hour Honor Grind this afternoon on level 70 Blood Elves for Scryer Rep, and not once had to stop for a drink or leave combat.

Not sure what your doing, but I'm doing something right.

let me guess. you were using Seal of wisdom.

[Vamonse]

A standard ret rotation takes 25% base mana, and JoTW will only refund 15%. Where is Blizzard's reasoning in thinking that Ret wont run out of mana with the CS + DS + Judgement rotation?

Because they are factoring Divine Plea into the rotation, which you get at 71. Simple as that...

[Montoya]

Because they are factoring Divine Plea into the rotation, which you get at 80. Simple as that...

71

[kommon31]

You dont have to switch to seal of wisdom for pve. If you do, you suck.


The problem is with pvp. And its not just mana burns, its the large costs of having to spam cleanse hof etc...

Mana drains/burns just make it even worse.

If you popped HoF and spammed cleanse in PvE, then you would oom quickly too.

You can't judge wisdom most of the time in PvP, its just stupid, you will be having to judge Justice on damn near everything but warriors and DK's situationally, if they are smart and kite you while your freedom is on cooldown then you are boned.


But as far as PvE goes, and even farming mobs + questing, the mana is fine. Especially when you hit lvl 71, you have MORE than enough mana for PvE.

[Swampmoose]

Does anyone not read any other threads before making new ones?

People have been stating all week (because it has been 15% since last week) including myself, that mana is perfectly fine now, and if you are running out of it you are doing something wrong.

Wisdom nerf I don't see making too much difference for anyone to care.

Oh and my rotation for the week has included, Judgment, CS, DS, consecration, Exorcism, AW at every CD, Holy Wrath (even on single targets a good bit if everything else is on cd), and I have not had a problem whatsoever with mana.

[Shakari]

let me guess. you were using Seal of wisdom.

and there is a problem there when grinding??? I don't think so lol

its pretty good as it is after the changes just because you can't just nuke the balls out of everything with zero mana concerns or having to adapt if you want to not run out of mana doesn't mean its broken lol