Seal of Command and Haste Rating

[The Man]

I seem to remember reading that Seal of Command scales well with haste rating... but this doesn't make sense to me as more haste would seem to be unbeneficial to the 7 PPM that goes with seal of command.
The exorbitant amounts of haste rating on paladin designed gear seems to confirm this rumour... if anyone could offer an explanation as to how this works and whether or not it's correct.
Thanks

[Skiball]

Great question, let me answer by saying I am not too sure.

See Martyr is the Alliance version of blood, but after hit capping and getting some solid gear I found myself killing myself with martyr, and the healers had to focus so much on the Rets in the raids the tanks were biting it, so we decided to research command as well, incluidng using the glyph for it.

Sadly even glyphed it dosen't do damage as well as martyr, and haste makes martyr do even more damage. That is just my research on target dummies, a more detailed analysis might prove otherwise.

[Farook]

This might help a bit:
http://www.retpaladin.com/warcraft/2...seal-of-blood/

[LrdPhoenix]

Great question, let me answer by saying I am not too sure.

See Martyr is the Alliance version of blood, but after hit capping and getting some solid gear I found myself killing myself with martyr, and the healers had to focus so much on the Rets in the raids the tanks were biting it, so we decided to research command as well, incluidng using the glyph for it.

Sadly even glyphed it dosen't do damage as well as martyr, and haste makes martyr do even more damage. That is just my research on target dummies, a more detailed analysis might prove otherwise.

I have the same problem, I kill myself really quickly when using Martyr, too fast for my instant FoLs to keep up with. I find it kinda stupid that a baseline seal is designed to be the best dps seal instead of a talented one.

[The Man]

Thanks for the replies

However, I was more asking from a Seal of Command usage in PVP angle rather than Seal of Blood in PVE, as I know in PVE Seal of Blood is the optimal seal to use, and that haste scales magnificently with Seal of Blood.

The main question being, if I'm going to use Seal of Command, should I try to get haste rating or should I avoid it like the plague? Because there are many great Ret/Arms Warrior etc. items that have lots of haste on them and I wasn't sure if that was beneficial or actually counter beneficial

[LrdPhoenix]

Thanks for the replies

However, I was more asking from a Seal of Command usage in PVP angle rather than Seal of Blood in PVE, as I know in PVE Seal of Blood is the optimal seal to use, and that haste scales magnificently with Seal of Blood.

The main question being, if I'm going to use Seal of Command, should I try to get haste rating or should I avoid it like the plague? Because there are many great Ret/Arms Warrior etc. items that have lots of haste on them and I wasn't sure if that was beneficial or actually counter beneficial

Since haste doesn't lower weapon damage like getting a faster weapon does, I'd say that any haste is good regardless of the seal being used.

I believe haste would help with Seal of Command, as SoC has a chance to do damage based on unmodified weapon speed, which carries over without change into whatever the haste increased weapon speed is, so you'd have a faster weapon with a slower weapon's higher proc chance.

Of course, Martyr wins out because when it comes to things like this, damage being applied every hit compared to a chance for extra damage every hit will always win out, unless that SoC damage is so big that it eclipses the damage caused by Martyr in the average number of hits required to get the extra SoC damage.

[belfpala]

So, to un-complicate what i just overcomplicated,
Take haste. Any you can get. take it with crit. Take it while flying-mounted. take it with hit. Take it in 5mans. take it with AP. Take it in raids. take it in battlegrounds. take it with stam. take all the haste you can get, sam-i-facking-am.

/bow.

Don't forget, take it to the arcane mage's face. Take it to the druid's secret place. Take it to the warrior's unholy. Take it to the death knight's holy molly. Take it to the warlock's fear spam. Take it there because sam i am.

[The Man]

Old Way
% chance to proc is calc's by attack speed (i.e. after haste is factored in)

New Way
% chance to proc is calc'd by weapon speed (i.e. unaltered by haste; the speed on the item description)

Ahhh this makes a lot of sense. I must've missed this announcement, but I'm glad they did it this way. Thanks.

Take haste. Any you can get. take it with crit. Take it while flying-mounted. take it with hit. Take it in 5mans. take it with AP. Take it in raids. take it in battlegrounds. take it with stam. take all the haste you can get, sam-i-facking-am.

/bow

Don't forget, take it to the arcane mage's face. Take it to the druid's secret place. Take it to the warrior's unholy. Take it to the death knight's holy molly. Take it to the warlock's fear spam. Take it there because sam i am.

That was just too cool
*applause*

Edit: cause I fucked up the quote. :-X

[Mysmere]

for pvp i'd grab it close to last.
its all about front end unloading.

ap and crit are more useful for the 5 seconds you'll be in contact with someone.

[Aloysius]

I don't have a problem killing myself with SoM at all...your healers must not be great if you're dying cause I'm in mostly sunwell and T6 gear. I use SoM for leveling and JoL and also have no problems and never have to stop to drink. If I need healing, HL + divine plea and keep going.

For PvE, take Str over everything. See the questions about ret stats thread in this forum for the theorycrafted order.

For PvP, again, Str is king with AP since they nerfed burst, although crit is more useful since you are using SoC. Your best bet is to get the highest dps gear available to you and gem it with Str, Hit, and AP and enjoy any haste you get as a bonus.