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  1. #1

    About Warlock pvp problems

    It's just that I see ghostcrawler making threads asking people what they think warlock's arena problems are. I don't know how much simpler I can put it than this.

    Now I have 520 resilience which I don't think is terrible with season 5 not being out yet. So I'm doing this wsg game today and this rogue waltzes up to me and cheap shots me. I save my trinket for kidney shot and watch my health bar. I kid you not, two 3k hemmorages followed by a 13.4k eviscerate. Cheap shot hadn't even worn off and this wasn't even with zerker buff.

    I realize there will be more resilience on season 5 gear but please. That's 12.5k instead of 13.4k. That just means I get to watch my health bar through kidney shot before dying.


  2. #2

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    /sarcasm

    boy, i sure am looking forward to jumping into some pvp action in lichking!

    /endsarcasm

  3. #3

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Ofmanv
    It's just that I see ghostcrawler making threads asking people what they think warlock's arena problems are. I don't know how much simpler I can put it than this.

    Now I have 520 resilience which I don't think is terrible with season 5 not being out yet. So I'm doing this wsg game today and this rogue waltzes up to me and cheap shots me. I save my trinket for kidney shot and watch my health bar. I kid you not, two 3k hemmorages followed by a 13.4k eviscerate. Cheap shot hadn't even worn off and this wasn't even with zerker buff.

    I realize there will be more resilience on season 5 gear but please. That's 12.5k instead of 13.4k. That just means I get to watch my health bar through kidney shot before dying.


    give me an screen shot

  4. #4

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Padraigo
    Ok, for starters is this at 80 or 70? because 520 resil means pretty much nothing at 80 with scaling. Secondly with alot more resil, you wont be getting crit so often. Thirdly, I dont beleive you on that 13.4k eviscerate.

    and forthly, Warlocks do have problems in PVP, but making false numbers to improve this wont help. If you dont have a screenshot well then, dont expect anyone to beleive you.
    http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/3...lanced2xw6.jpg

    And that's not even a very good warrior. These numbers are possible.

    And 520 resil isn't "nothing." Many people have 0 resil atm. And that's at least halfway to the cap.
    Originally Posted by Ghostcrawler (Blue Tracker)
    We don't think burst is a problem in PvP right now.

  5. #5

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    I feel your pain, but i think right now, you have to live with it.

    11k lava lash, 10k starfires, 12-13k ambush are the things ive experienced.

    Some classes are a lot weaker without pvp gear, some are completely fine. rogues have never relied upon resilience, they run away and hide and avoid damage, so the lack of resilience just gives them an extra edge.

    Warlocks on the other hand, cant do that. We stand there, we tank and attempt to get away if possible, but 9/10 we are in face to face combat. Seeing as dots cant crit, lack of resilience means very little to us (besides a small damage reduce), whereas the rogue is heavily crit based, and will literally eat you up with his 30% crit.

    Coupled with a few problems warlocks are having at the moment, its nothing to worry about.

    We need pvp gear to pvp, rogues/warriors etc, can get away without it, we cant.

    Just hold on till s5 when the items give us a big pool of HP, plenty of resilience, and hopefully a few warlock changes to help us out

  6. #6

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Quote Originally Posted by stupid11
    http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/3...lanced2xw6.jpg

    And that's not even a very good warrior. These numbers are possible.

    And 520 resil isn't "nothing." Many people have 0 resil atm. And that's at least halfway to the cap.
    Lol its execicut. Always been hitting for much. And it is just a finishing skill. At lvl 20 when u get it it will crit for like 1500 so that it its for 11k now is not strenge.

  7. #7

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    It wouldn't be a problem with an 11k execute if they didn't get to use it with a 30% chance at any hp level and retain 10 rage. if you had say 18k hp before the first crit to allow executes use, and that dmg was 7k + 11k from the execute crit, you pretty much just got 2 shot. With 18k hp and over 500 resil, even though it's not near cap at lv80, that is still pretty 'strenge.'

  8. #8

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Haha, your corruption ticks for 800 and you are complaining about other classes making too much damage. Damn, l2p and gtfo! What I want to say: Wait for S5-gear

  9. #9

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    I'm so glad some people know internet lingo. Let's see 800dmg every 3 secs for 18 secs. means something like 4800 dmg. Maybe a little less than a normal crit for the arms war. I can see how thats pretty amazing dmg. Especially when it can be cleansed off or removed many other ways or healed through. While the lock gets owned in 2 swings.

  10. #10

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    actually stomping around in meta form with 28k armor , 20k+ health and a felguard taking 20% of your dmg isn't so bad. Seriously I used to play a rogue, do you know how shitty it is in a BG to baisicly sit around n wait for someone to hopefully stray into your range while your stealthed? And versus a warrior? if you are full demo , theres not a warrior out there that can take u if meta is up, seriously, 3 dots on them, felguard on them, life draining them and u have 28k armor...oh and your AOE'ing immolation which is unchanneled for 600-700 a second while you run around. And if your really feeling sadistic you can nuke or fear them...so whats the problem?

  11. #11

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    theres another problem, lack of movility, at least if circle could be used while stunned...
    www.xaximbo.blogspot.com Warlock Theorycrafting mostly focused to PvP, i want to know your opinion!

  12. #12

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Quote Originally Posted by direlock
    actually stomping around in meta form with 28k armor , 20k+ health and a felguard taking 20% of your dmg isn't so bad. Seriously I used to play a rogue, do you know how shitty it is in a BG to baisicly sit around n wait for someone to hopefully stray into your range while your stealthed? And versus a warrior? if you are full demo , theres not a warrior out there that can take u if meta is up, seriously, 3 dots on them, felguard on them, life draining them and u have 28k armor...oh and your AOE'ing immolation which is unchanneled for 600-700 a second while you run around. And if your really feeling sadistic you can nuke or fear them...so whats the problem?
    In arena, they will just run from you while your meta wears off.

  13. #13

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Quote Originally Posted by direlock
    do you know how shitty it is in a BG to baisicly sit around n wait for someone to hopefully stray into your range while your stealthed?
    ;D That must be the alt of a wl
    U made my day!

    --

    @whiteeagle: Well, it's instant, you can use it in range and you have some more dots. The problem is that wls get better chances to win a 1v1 when the fight is taking longer. ATM fights are short. So with S5 u get more hp and more res => profit!
    I made some duels vs a well skilled wl (haunt) with my warrior. When he death coiled me and I couldn't trinket I lost. Else he lost. Yeah, the fights really were not long

    ---

    edit: @Mogs: When they run away you can take control over the match. So it's not bad as all. WLs got good talents. Even/Especially Demonic Circle is awesome as it is.

  14. #14

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Actually there is some validity to the complaint.

    Rogue DPS is a higher base than other classes because Blizzard factored it for PvE. Read the Blue Posts but to summarize Blizzard said that because rogues need to move in and out during boss fights, they raised overall DPS to be comparative to ranged DPS classes. That means that for PvP, where rogues move and are stationary as much as any other class, they do way more DPS than ranged classes.

    I do have to say though, that I hate how locks need to use Soul Link in order to be PvP viable. Every other class can use multiple talent specs and still be used in PvP. Locks are the only class that is forced to be 1 tree only. Just seems silly IMO. Especially since there is no way you can be competitive in PvE if you want to PvP without respeccing. How is it that Blizzard can focus on druids making all 3 trees viable for everything when that class was already OP and leave other classes (locks, spriests, shaman, etc) in the dust. Just amazes me.
    Definition of useless -

    Q. Any plans for an untalented spell to help warlocks deal with stuns?
    A. Possibly. It’s also possible we may take a look at stuns in general. But overall stuns will feel less impacting in an environment where players have significantly more health than they do today.

  15. #15

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    The problem is simple: DPS is scaled out of proportion to survivability to an extreme level.

    If anyone thinks 13k eviscerates and 14k FBs are impossible, than they haven't been testing much PvP.

    As an illustration and a "for fun" test, we tried to see how fast everyone could kill a 25-man geared feral tanking druid, with 40k HP.

    Results? Took awhile for me as affliction, but once my DoTs were up it was only a matter of seconds. For our rogue? He was dead one second after the KS. Similar results for the hunter and mage. The only person who took reasonable time to kill him was the ret paladin.

    Accurate for arena PvP? No. But compare the relative survivability between wrath and BC, and that's what I'm getting at. A rogue would never be able to kill a raid-geared feral druid from full to nothing that quickly in BC, and I doubt resilience and health in S5 will be enough, since the essence of a feral druid tank v. rogue is that the feral druid has a large -crit%, a lot of armor, and a lot of health.

  16. #16

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    i say u make it so that warlocks main talent.... fear.... isn't something that over 75% of people are now immune to, or have the ability to be immune to, hunters and undead and tremor totems, it just seems that my biggest evasion talent has gotten taken away from me and now when i go to fall back on it, and fear some1 off me, the fear lasts on them for less then 2 seconds before they trigger somethin to take it off, and im not even talking about trinketing out of it. Make locks fear like special make it a terrify or something where u can fear hunters and u can fear through a shamans totem, give us something that not every has a way to get around

  17. #17

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Bambi-

    True, fear is much less effective now... I think the main weakness of locks is that our ability to tank died with the fel armor and itemization changes, while our only defensive-escape mechanisms are fear, deathcoil, and demonic teleport. None of these will be useful for getting away from melee. Warriors/Feral Druids/Rogues/DKs will escape fear, deathcoil doesn't last long enough to get away from an intercept, feral step, death grip, or sprint, and demonic teleport won't remove movement impairing effects, making it easy for any melee to just run over and start wailing on us again.

  18. #18

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    Used to be we feared, dotted, drained someone to death before they could get out of it and fight back....it was soooo OP locks were OP, get the friggen torches and nerf bats. It still took us 20 or more seconds to kill someone. Plenty of time for a healer.

    Now we can't rely on fear, our pets die in 2x gcds (which our mitigation is based on), we die in about 3gcds, and are routinely stunlocked through the whole process that is so burst fast a healer can barely catch it. Our escape cant' be used while CC'd and our nemesis classes have become stronger. They get more HP than we do in S5 gear levels by about 20% or more while our armor has scaled negatively vs 70. Locks dot...by definition not a burst ability. However we have lost our ability to survive our own dmg dealing method. On top of that dots never panic a healer while direct dmg (even non crit) burst does for sure. You can't dispell direct dmg. All our direct dmg has cast times that beg interuption or LoS. Melee has more ways to snare/catch us than we do to get out. These are not new issues they have been gaining since S3 and hit imbalanced sometime in S4 and now are just broken. They can interupt/kick/pummel/etc while we have never had a disarm. Used to be we could counter casters while melee countered us but now other casters (mages mostly) are way more OP vs us than we ever were against them. The stereotype or prejudice of OP locks has fueled the devs to keep nerfing while not actually examining. They are so affraid of giving us anything useful we are doomed to be in the shitter for S5. This bugs me since we will be behind the gearing curve forever if they don't fix it early in S5.
    User has been banned permanently for trolling.

  19. #19

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    locks have the lowest burst and poorest defense. It doesn't take a lv80 in arena gear to figure it out. Just play another class and you know that they are in a pretty sad state. The developers have somewhat acknowledged the problem but i don't know how they can fix it.


    And if you really do come up against the pros, they'll simply switch to their SR gear and you are screwed no matter what.

  20. #20

    Re: About Warlock pvp problems

    totally agreed.... (still new and don't know how to quote specific sections of a post), but when u say that dotting people is no fear to healers. IDK how many times i would pvp affliction or whatever and i would put 5 dots on a druid or a priest and in turn they would just remove 3 of them (or more), and then just throw a refresh or a LB, renew, some HOT to counter act the other dots left on them. Even with the talent Contagion 5/5, i never saw a person have to try more then once to dispell or remove one of my dots, its almost like its laughable.... "HAHAHAHA 5 dots on me ill just remove 3 of them and heal through the other 2", or if u dot up a rogue COS just instantly removes this... how is it that UA gets removed by COS but has no negative effect. Every class has their class they get owned by, and every class has a class they own. IDK what locks are supposed to own now.....

    SP got crit chance on a talent that is similar to Drain life, or a dot, in mindflay, how about a lock gets crittable dots.... that would be nice.... dot u up 5 times, and each 1 ticks for their amount but over the course of the 10 ticks, they chance to crit.


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