1. #1

    Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Glyph of Felhunter - When your felhunter uses Devour Magic, you will also be healed for that amount. (Old - Increases the critical strike chance of your Felhunter's Shadow Bite ability by 6%.)

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=31072.0


    Keep them coming these kind of glyphs Blizz! These kind of glyphs are what we need right now, not some senseless ones like the old Glyph of Felhunter.

    Now, if only they'd scale our pets with Spell Pen like they SAID during BETA. Wait, do they scale now?

  2. #2

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by lrs078
    ...Betcha the healing is reduced by MS/poison so don't count on it saving you vs the 5k/10K per second bladestorm hits, the eviscerates, the...well you get the picture. Can't see using it anywhere outside of PVP though.
    Do you honestly expect a glyph to heal you through getting bursted as a clothie? Its extra healing, its not 5k or anything, but its extra healing. I think you need learn what glyphs do...
    And its clearly a pvp glyph.

  3. #3

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    devour magic heals felhound for almost 2k crits and has an 8 second cooldown >_< i can see this happening maybe twice

  4. #4

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater
    Do you honestly expect a glyph to heal you through getting bursted as a clothie? Its extra healing, its not 5k or anything, but its extra healing. I think you need learn what glyphs do...
    And its clearly a pvp glyph.
    No I dont. However you are obviously unable to grasp the dire need warlocks have to last more than 5 seconds in an arena match. Please open your mind before posting mindless drill
    Definition of useless -

    Q. Any plans for an untalented spell to help warlocks deal with stuns?
    A. Possibly. It’s also possible we may take a look at stuns in general. But overall stuns will feel less impacting in an environment where players have significantly more health than they do today.

  5. #5

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by TerryBogard
    No I dont. However you are obviously unable to grasp the dire need warlocks have to last more than 5 seconds in an arena match. Please open your mind before posting mindless drill
    Please understand that increased survivability will not come in the form of a glyph. If it heals for 2k (because 2k damage) on an 8 second CD (shadow bite's) then it's more healing than I was expecting.

    You said "don't count on it saving you", its not. It just extra healing because that's a major part of warlock, self healing and control of life. (Drain life, siphon life, life tap, haunt's heal).

    Now this is day two of arenas. Most classes are having trouble lasting more than 5 seconds because dps has scaled more than survivability and healing. PvE gear with a damage focus is what's majorly in play because pvp gear has not been readily available. As pvp gear increases (more health, more resil) classes will last longer, healers will become more important and things will even out.

    Warlocks aren't in "dire need" of survivability. Things have changed because of the state of the game (more dps gear than pvp gear). Besides, warlocks were survivability in BC.

    Also, as i view it, glyph of corruption is a more than decent warlock glyph.

  6. #6

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater
    Do you honestly expect a glyph to heal you through getting bursted as a clothie? Its extra healing, its not 5k or anything, but its extra healing. I think you need learn what glyphs do...
    And its clearly a pvp glyph.
    ^^
    This is what i was responding to. And...

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater
    You said "don't count on it saving you", its not. It just extra healing because that's a major part of warlock, self healing and control of life. (Drain life, siphon life, life tap, haunt's heal).
    ^^
    I never said that. And...

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater

    Warlocks aren't in "dire need" of survivability. Things have changed because of the state of the game (more dps gear than pvp gear). Besides, warlocks were survivability in BC.

    Also, as i view it, glyph of corruption is a more than decent warlock glyph.
    1) Warlocks are currently the least represented class in arenas. Maybe for a reason.
    2) Glyph of corruption is amazing for PVE. For PvP it either doesnt get off, or it isnt on long enough before the lock dies for us to use the procc.

    Please have knowledge in some aspect of the game before you talk. Statements like these are not well thought out and have no backing internally in WoW. Its a talking point (ie it has zero substance).
    Definition of useless -

    Q. Any plans for an untalented spell to help warlocks deal with stuns?
    A. Possibly. It’s also possible we may take a look at stuns in general. But overall stuns will feel less impacting in an environment where players have significantly more health than they do today.

  7. #7

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by TerryBogard
    ^^
    This is what i was responding to. And...

    ^^
    I never said that. And...

    1) Warlocks are currently the least represented class in arenas. Maybe for a reason.
    2) Glyph of corruption is amazing for PVE. For PvP it either doesnt get off, or it isnt on long enough before the lock dies for us to use the procc.

    Please have knowledge in some aspect of the game before you talk. Statements like these are not well thought out and have no backing internally in WoW. Its a talking point (ie it has zero substance).
    Wait a second...
    I was pointing out to the second poster, lrs078, how his idea on what a glyph was, is, and does, is wrong. However, if you would like to discuss warlocks in the arena, we can.

    Are warlocks the least represented class in the arena? Maybe the warlocks didn't log in on the two days season five has been active. Wait it out.

    The dying fast problem will solve it self as pve gear is replaced with pvp gear. the game will become more defensive. Right now warlocks go down fast because 1) Cloth armor and 2) no IB/shield so they're the first pick to die. Just wait for resilience and health on the pvp gear.

    I don't think you understand the issue. Here it is for you.

    Right now, most armor is from PvE seeing as how the pvp gear was just released. (Ok, it dropped from vault, but its very unlikely for someone to have a full set for their spec). This PvE gear has its item points (little things that help designers decide how good a piece can be, how much +int or +spellpower to give a piece in relation to its ilevel or where it is obtained) allocated so that dps is at a maximum (for the most part, except for the terribad warlock itemization for affliction, which Blizzard seems to be pushing as the best dps spec for warlocks due to its difficulty in rotation and the general idea of warlock (dots)). So maximum dps on armor.

    As people begin to acquire pvp gear, which has its item points spent more heavily on stamina and resilience, the relative strength of damage will decrease, allowing classes to live longer. If you live longer, you'll have more time to do your great warlock things. (Fear, dot, drain, survive for a long time, etc).

    So what I'm telling you is wait. Arena's have been out two days. No one has arena points yet. PvP gear and resilience is not plentiful. Wait before you freak out, I assure that you do not understand the issue, despite your attempts to tell me I don't.

    Arena is a burst game, right now. Warlocks are not quite a burst class compared to others. Maybe that's why they're the "least represented". Or maybe its because real level 80 season five arena has been out two days.

    Edit: heading to bed, sorry, no more warlock discussion for now =P

    But i do believe warlocks will be fine in the long run. Blizzard seems not to want to leave any class behind in pvp (hunters are getting all sorts of attention, and from how BC arena went for them, they need it), so warlocks should be in good shape. If they need buffs, blizzard will give them.

  8. #8

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater

    Are warlocks the least represented class in the arena? Maybe the warlocks didn't log in on the two days season five has been active. Wait it out.
    http://www.sk-gaming.com/arena/player

    ^^
    They are. If your argument is that only 1 class (warlocks) abstained from arenas while every other class participated then you are wrong. Yes all the locks that PvE (and there are a lot) decided to not log in for two days since s5 went live. ROFL, what a dumb argument.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater

    The dying fast problem will solve it self as pve gear is replaced with pvp gear. the game will become more defensive. Right now warlocks go down fast because 1) Cloth armor and 2) no IB/shield so they're the first pick to die. Just wait for resilience and health on the pvp gear.

    I don't think you understand the issue. Here it is for you.

    Right now, most armor is from PvE seeing as how the pvp gear was just released. (Ok, it dropped from vault, but its very unlikely for someone to have a full set for their spec). This PvE gear has its item points (little things that help designers decide how good a piece can be, how much +int or +spellpower to give a piece in relation to its ilevel or where it is obtained) allocated so that dps is at a maximum (for the most part, except for the terribad warlock itemization for affliction, which Blizzard seems to be pushing as the best dps spec for warlocks due to its difficulty in rotation and the general idea of warlock (dots)). So maximum dps on armor.

    As people begin to acquire pvp gear, which has its item points spent more heavily on stamina and resilience, the relative strength of damage will decrease, allowing classes to live longer. If you live longer, you'll have more time to do your great warlock things. (Fear, dot, drain, survive for a long time, etc).

    So what I'm telling you is wait. Arena's have been out two days. No one has arena points yet. PvP gear and resilience is not plentiful. Wait before you freak out, I assure that you do not understand the issue, despite your attempts to tell me I don't.

    Arena is a burst game, right now. Warlocks are not quite a burst class compared to others. Maybe that's why they're the "least represented". Or maybe its because real level 80 season five arena has been out two days.
    ^^
    The rest of your long-winded post has been disputed since BETA. The same issues were apparent in arenas with the improved resilience gear. So no, more resilience will not be the solution to a Warlocks survivability plight.

    Oh, and for all you "OMG warlocks and druids 2's teams were impossible to kill. It was easier to down the druid than the lock!" posters... Druid healing was overpowered. That coupled with improved gains from druid heals via Fel Armor and a locks ability to drain health made for an overpowered combination. However a lock by itself was still easily bested by counter classes (ie rogues). Resto Druids OPness masked the problems locks were facing towards the end of TBC.

    Still I would rather be back in the end of season 4 than the beginning of season 5
    Definition of useless -

    Q. Any plans for an untalented spell to help warlocks deal with stuns?
    A. Possibly. It’s also possible we may take a look at stuns in general. But overall stuns will feel less impacting in an environment where players have significantly more health than they do today.

  9. #9

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    last post, then bed.

    Quote Originally Posted by TerryBogard
    http://www.sk-gaming.com/arena/player

    ^^
    They are. If your argument is that only 1 class (warlocks) abstained from arenas while every other class participated then you are wrong. Yes all the locks that PvE (and there are a lot) decided to not log in for two days since s5 went live. ROFL, what a dumb argument.
    I think you need to purchase a sarcasm detector. I'm saying the arenas have been out two days. You are over reacting by claiming that warlocks are already under represented. Maybe you should learn to read deeper into text rather than just the written words. Think about it. Could i have meant that all the warlocks didn't log in for two days to do arena? Maybe, but probably not. Two days is way to short of a time to draw conclusions and freak out.

    Quote Originally Posted by TerryBogard
    The rest of your long-winded post has been disputed since BETA. The same issues were apparent in arenas with the improved resilience gear. So no, more resilience will not be the solution to a Warlocks survivability plight.

    Oh, and for all you "OMG warlocks and druids 2's teams were impossible to kill. It was easier to down the druid than the lock!" posters... Druid healing was overpowered. That coupled with improved gains from druid heals via Fel Armor and a locks ability to drain health made for an overpowered combination. However a lock by itself was still easily bested by counter classes (ie rogues). Resto Druids OPness masked the problems locks were facing towards the end of TBC.

    Still I would rather be back in the end of season 4 than the beginning of season 5

    Quotes? Data? And facts to prove your claim that improved resil gear did no help? We'll see in a few months. Things have changed from the beta and will be ever changing.

    About warlock and druid 2s... First, I wouldn't say druid healing was OP, it was exactly what was required for arena (and maybe that makes it OP, but its not that they have bigger green numbers). Hots and instant cast heals are ideal. Druids were largely immune to Tounges (though they could remove it) and mind numbing poison (i think, the one that makes casts take longer) because their heals were instant.

    Instant heals combined with great mobility and CC made them perfect for 2v2 and 3v3, but not quite there for 5s. They did have the sheilds, the big number heals, the other utilities that other healers had.

    Warlocks also had it going for them in terms of CC, having a pet (hindering drinking), mitagation (20% less damage to pet, awesome), less LoS issue (dots). Rogues however were, are, and always will be a problem for warlocks.

    I too would rather be at season four. Games that lasted longer than 10 seconds were fun. Right now its burst mania. But i think we will return to that and warlocks will ultimately be fine. Blizzard is trying harder for balance.

    Class design is what will keep warlocks good in pvp. They have a great CC spell (fear is a good mechanic for warlocks, their damage can keep going, they create distance between the lock and the target), a long lasting mana pool (life tap is great, with a healer, life is cheap so long as you aren't getting bursted, easy mana), as well as access to +20% healing (demon armor will probably be better for pvp, as a lot of the bonus armor on gear was stripped and +20% healing is powerful).

    Trust me, warlocks will be fine.

  10. #10

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater
    About warlock and druid 2s... First, I wouldn't say druid healing was OP
    Stopped reading there, you obviously were playing in different arenas/game/universe to everyone else.

    On topic though:

    very pleased with the glyphs, finally some help for locks. The heal is pretty nice, coupled with fel armour and siphon life, youve got really nice self healing.

    The felguard improvement is nice for PvE also, another 10% power will give me that bit more dps

  11. #11

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater
    Quotes? Data? And facts to prove your claim that improved resil gear did no help? We'll see in a few months. Things have changed from the beta and will be ever changing.

    ^^
    I really thought me saying
    Quote Originally Posted by TerryBogard
    The rest of your long-winded post has been disputed since BETA. The same issues were apparent in arenas with the improved resilience gear. So no, more resilience will not be the solution to a Warlocks survivability plight.
    .... would be enough of a FACT for you but I guess not. If you would like you can look at WWS numbers from Beta that support and prove my above statement. I dont know if you are asking for someone to hold your hand and walk you through every fact and piece of data that proves you wrong or if you are just trying to be ignorant but I dont have the time for either.

    I dont advocate for locks to be overpowered. I just want to be able to PvP with one and have a chance at winning at higher 2v2 arena ratings.
    Definition of useless -

    Q. Any plans for an untalented spell to help warlocks deal with stuns?
    A. Possibly. It’s also possible we may take a look at stuns in general. But overall stuns will feel less impacting in an environment where players have significantly more health than they do today.

  12. #12
    The Insane Bakis's Avatar
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    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    2k healing in 8 secs
    8secs of meleecombat equals what damage?
    Anyone can do the math, better glyph than before but still utterly pointless.

    To sum warlocks up in arena, doesnt matter what changes they do, minor changes like glyphs or some small tweak untill they adress the hi-warlock-u-got-5-seconds.to.live.

    Hurray for 2k healing while the screen is already in black & white mode.
    Russia isn't afraid of US dude. That's why they are sending their bombers like 60km out of your shores. Infact they give 0 fucks. They know you wont dare to touch them.

  13. #13

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Fear is the most immune, resisted, diminishing returned, and countered CC in existence. IF it worked it might be useful but it doesn't so its not. Our escape mechanism must be precast, are visible to everyone, can't be used while cc'd, and have a cooldown longer than the catch mechanisms our opponents have.

    I keep hearing how resilience will save the day... Have you done arena, BG's, or even duels and analyzed the results via combat log, wws, etc? You will see that crits are not needed to kill you. Not even close. Plus the skill based crit increases of 50% or so on burst melee will never be reduced by resilience mathematically possible in game. However, our opponents will gain even more reduction in dmg from our dots and healers will have even longer to do something trivial to counter them.

    Ah...the stam on the gear. Have you looked at the gear and compared it? Melee will be packing about 3K to 5K more HP than we will have which represents proper scaling from 70 to 80. Ours however is not much, if any, better in defensive stats than S4 gear. For some reason our gear scaled inversely. This just widens the gap as gear becomes widespread.

    Time will tell for gear....oh, here goes...you got me. So we've had a month or more of loot pinata'ing archavon a couple times a week so the best stuff is already out there to some extent. IE not everyone has 5/5 but a couple pieces is reasonable. Then you have badge buyouts for the other two tiers which if you have had PVE on farm will have most pieces buyable right now. Then you have honor (banked from lvl 70) and cashing in marks for honor. That is good for a few more pieces. Let's not forget stonekeeper shards which most people have in abundance even after getting their mammoth. Craft up any blue items to fill gaps and you can put some significant resilience on the field already. I'm over 500 resilience and about 20K hp and am getting shredded w' the best shammy healer in the guild as my arena partner. He can't keep me up if I get focused for more than a GCD at best. If they focus him I can do very little to peel them off via fear. I'm swapping teams to a pally for 2's so I can get 15 seconds to try something but I'm hardly holding my breath. I calculated that for armor pieces even if I had best in slot it wouldn't reduce the crit chance or dmg by even 1/10th as much as it would take for me to live through another gcd/hit thus giving a healer that much more time. No way I can get the rating for weapons in its current state.

    Locks survival is based on self healing and pet mitigation but MS effects combined w' huge burst makes that pretty much moot. Our pets are glass and have zero gear scaling. We get a trickle or nibbles of life back...we can't burst heal ourselves beyond a HS. Our dmg is by definition not burst so totally at odds w' current arena dynamics. If you have done any pvp yourselves you already know that if another lock dots you up (or a SP) you can pretty well ignore it since its an easy catch for your healer and you have plenty of time to blow the poor SOB up.
    User has been banned permanently for trolling.

  14. #14
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by TerryBogard
    1) Warlocks are currently the least represented class in arenas. Maybe for a reason.
    Warlocks are currently the least represented class in WoW, at level 80. The reason is the endless "QQ Lock PVP is nerfed!", "QQ Affliction is hard", and "QQ I'm an emo warlock, I'll reroll DK" that appeared on the beta forums and still continues to this day. It gave people the incentive to move on. Same as hunters.

    I can't speak for your servers, but when I raid (PUG or otherwise) I never see more than 1 hunter, and am usually the only warlock. They aren't all busy PVP'ing so that has to say something.

    R.I.P. YARG

  15. #15

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by gherkin
    Warlocks are currently the least represented class in WoW, at level 80. The reason is the endless "QQ Lock PVP is nerfed!", "QQ Affliction is hard", and "QQ I'm an emo warlock, I'll reroll DK" that appeared on the beta forums and still continues to this day. It gave people the incentive to move on. Same as hunters.

    I can't speak for your servers, but when I raid (PUG or otherwise) I never see more than 1 hunter, and am usually the only warlock. They aren't all busy PVP'ing so that has to say something.
    I actually see alot of hunters on my server, in raids, instances, and heroics.

  16. #16
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Just checked warcraftrealms.com

    Out of 1.2 million level 80's, warlocks make up 7%, the lowest number. Hunters are at 9%, so I must be on a Hunter-free server (yay!)

    And as an explanation, given equal representation all classes should make up 9-11% of total players. The fact that warlocks are much lower than this (consider that 1% is twelve thousand players, so 2% is a lot) could point to several reasons:

    -Rerolls
    -Warlock Alts
    -Etc

    R.I.P. YARG

  17. #17

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by spec
    Stopped reading there, you obviously were playing in different arenas/game/universe to everyone else.

    On topic though:

    very pleased with the glyphs, finally some help for locks. The heal is pretty nice, coupled with fel armour and siphon life, youve got really nice self healing.

    The felguard improvement is nice for PvE also, another 10% power will give me that bit more dps Smiley
    You should have kept reading. The healing itself is not OP, its mechanics, mana-efficient hots, great mobility (only a big deal in 2s or 3s), incredible cc, instant cast spells (cast while moving, harder to interupt). Druid healing wasn't pumping out more HPS than other healers, they just had exactly what the arena calls for.

    And if you're using a felguard to go a dps spec, I think you're doing it wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by TerryBogard

    ^^
    I really thought me saying .... would be enough of a FACT for you but I guess not. If you would like you can look at WWS numbers from Beta that support and prove my above statement. I dont know if you are asking for someone to hold your hand and walk you through every fact and piece of data that proves you wrong or if you are just trying to be ignorant but I dont have the time for either.

    I dont advocate for locks to be overpowered. I just want to be able to PvP with one and have a chance at winning at higher 2v2 arena ratings.
    I'm not proving your argument. You have to. I don't believe this information exists, why would I look for it?

    I could claim that warlocks were doing 1M dps during beta. And you most likely wouldn't believe me, would you go and look for a WWS? No, you'd call me out and ask me to provide one. I don't have one, but they were. There was a bug when drain life refreshed corruption, it kept increasing its damage (like the affl talent should), but there was no cap. So on mobs that you must have a quest to kill, warlocks could get corruption to tick for as high as they wanted, before they got bored. It would work on a boss too.

    You honestly think i'm going to do your work? I'm not.


    I'm incredibly surprised that warlocks are so low on the list of classes played (and hunters too, there are loads of 'em). On my server, whenever i'm looking for dps for an instance, two locks whisper me first. (I turn them down, my good irl friend i instance with is a lock and he wants his gear). Warlocks are a fun class, and as powerful as they were in BC pvp (season 2 mainly?) I'm surprised they aren't more played.

    Warlocks are a good class. They did add a lot of fear negating effects, which only attests to fear's power. If warlocks are struggling, blizzard will buff them.

  18. #18

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bakis
    2k healing in 8 secs
    8secs of meleecombat equals what damage?
    Anyone can do the math, better glyph than before but still utterly pointless.

    To sum warlocks up in arena, doesnt matter what changes they do, minor changes like glyphs or some small tweak untill they adress the hi-warlock-u-got-5-seconds.to.live.

    Hurray for 2k healing while the screen is already in black & white mode.
    the waterhole is filled drip by drip
    User has been banned permanently for trolling, due to the following post:
    "- making ur pet stronger than a warrior and getting bladestorm and all those cool attacks and yea dont forget that the warlock should get 2 talent points instead of 1 every level."

  19. #19

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hipponater
    I could claim that warlocks were doing 1M dps during beta. And you most likely wouldn't believe me, would you go and look for a WWS? No, you'd call me out and ask me to provide one. I don't have one, but they were. There was a bug when drain life refreshed corruption, it kept increasing its damage (like the affl talent should), but there was no cap. So on mobs that you must have a quest to kill, warlocks could get corruption to tick for as high as they wanted, before they got bored. It would work on a boss too.
    That only worked due to a bug with 4p T5 "(4) Set: Your Shadowbolt spell hits increase the damage of Corruption by 10% and your Incinerate spell hits increase the damage of Immolate by 10%." using a low rank Sbolt and took a while to get it up very high.

    It would work on a boss? Long before it reached its damage cap, most bosses would have one-shot the lock for the threat it would have caused.
    User has been banned permanently for trolling due to the following post:
    "Anyone else really loving the new Ghost Form Warlocks were given? You’re immune to all damage, can explore ANYWHERE uninterrupted, hear creepy music and the best part is, you can stay in that form for as long as you want. Cheesy

    If you don’t know where to train “Ghost Form”, you can learn the ability for free from any melee class you encounter by clicking the “Release” confirmation window that pops up."

  20. #20

    Re: Finally a decent warlock glyph!

    Enough kittyfight
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