1. #1

    Hope for Holy Priests

    A lovely statement from the old crawler today. That's exactly what I've been missing in holy - some synergy between all those healing spells.

    Holy Concentration and Surge of Light are very good, but I also think that they are a little bit annoying (as I'm sure I've written somewhere else around here). The annoyance comes from not being able to react to them in time when they proc in stressful situations and hence feeling that you can't make optimal use of them.

    "What the heck happened there? Oh, SoL procced and made my Flash Heal that I had already decided to cast instant."

    "Oh, I have Holy Concentration. But I'm already casting a Flash Heal. What a waste. Is it worth aborting it?"

    Ah well, enough ranting. There is hope again!

  2. #2
    Mechagnome
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    England
    Posts
    595

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    My concern for Holy Priests (remember, I'm Disc, so if I'm innacurate please correct me) is that GC seems to forget mana management. 'What if spamming FH charges up GH' is more like saying 'what if we make you spend mana on a few FH's to get the GH you want straight off the bat'. Same with his renew idea, having to renew 5 people to improve CoH is just burning into mana and preventing the priest getting outside the 5SR.

    I dont know what Holy Priests need, I leave that to Holy Priests. Just my thoughts on GC's comments

    Armory Link
    Life's like a salmon swimming upstream - Hard work, and sometimes you get eaten by bears.

  3. #3

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Holy priests need a niche. No, jack of all trades is not a niche.


  4. #4

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    My main spec is shadow so my holy gear isn't that great... but even so, when I heal as holy I find it pretty difficult to go oom... i get outside the FSR from SoL procs often enough and if for some reason the encounter takes longer than it should and I start to go oom there is always an innervate in the raid to give me a full mana bar...

    I kinda of find the mana management isn't so awful we should be complaining about needing more mana regen. It's something you need to be mindful of but it's hardly so bad you need to stop casting in order to heal at the end of the fight.

    I also have no problem with the holy tree being the jack of all trades... if you want a niche spec you have the disc tree to MT or single target heal. Problem is everyone thinks CoH is so fantastic it's a must have... it's a great spell but I don't find it half as good or necessary as people make out. Penance is a fantastic healing spell and perhaps most holy priests should go spec disc for awhile and see how decent that tree actually is.

    Lastly, too many people rely on healing meters as way of evaluating how good someone is at healing. Thats why half the priests are having a QQ about the CoH CD, because it's going to be difficult to top the meters... who cares... you're far better off evaluating heals on how many deaths your raid gets and then evaluting how the healers reacted to them taking damage. Disc for example will never be high on the meters coz a decent portion of their healing comes from reducing damage... it's time people realises healing meters are misleading at best.

  5. #5

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Quote Originally Posted by Neeklus
    Holy priests need a niche. No, jack of all trades is not a niche.
    We can heal when we are dead, that's our niche.

  6. #6

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests


    OMG! They nerfed our deaths! But but but! That was the strong point of my class!
    They took my manaregen. Fine. They took my CoH. Okay. But now they want to take my dying. This means war!
    Give me freedom, and give me death!

    (yeah, tongue-in-cheek :P )

    Non-discipline since 2006. Also: fails. "Chakra, when the walls fell"

  7. #7

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    I don't mind the mana issues holy has. It's just that certain other healing specs never ever go oom so it's natural to get a bit jealous. Okay, some priest spells need to get more efficient, but in general paladins etc are the broken ones and I'm pretty damn sure that something will be done about that.

  8. #8

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    it's pretty much the way you itemize and enchant/gem yourself that determines if you go oom or not, I'm currently decent geared (mostly 10M epics and a blue trinket and hood) and i never go oom, this is mainly due to the fact I gemmed for int/spirit and also enchanted like that, in my semi-ok gear I now got 17.5k mana and 930/350 mp5 (mixed with 1750 SP), for me personally these stats are the level to start gemming for raw SP as I find myself roughly never having mana issues.

    What GC said btw would be a pretty awesome thing, I mainly use flash heals to be honest, except on pure tank/spank fights (IE patch) where my greater heal accounts for the largest portion of my healing then. as for mana concerns with spamming flash of light, he did say the healing tree would not really change, apart from some faster GH casting if you do some FH's before (as an option, not definite) this does not mean you have to, you can stay in the same *rotation* you're always using if you find that more effective, so it's pretty much a win-win situation imo.

  9. #9

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Quote Originally Posted by Ananan
    A lovely statement from the old crawler today. That's exactly what I've been missing in holy - some synergy between all those healing spells.

    Holy Concentration and Surge of Light are very good, but I also think that they are a little bit annoying (as I'm sure I've written somewhere else around here). The annoyance comes from not being able to react to them in time when they proc in stressful situations and hence feeling that you can't make optimal use of them.

    "What the heck happened there? Oh, SoL procced and made my Flash Heal that I had already decided to cast instant."

    "Oh, I have Holy Concentration. But I'm already casting a Flash Heal. What a waste. Is it worth aborting it?"

    Ah well, enough ranting. There is hope again!
    It's too bad that Ghostcrawler routinely talks down to our class as a whole, and often forgets what spells/abilities we can/can't do. I think if more people weren't busy hoping to get on Blue's "good" side, they'd start an anti-GC movement.

    As for the "possible" good bits in the upcoming patch: I'm sure it'll be something else to enforce priests as Jack-of-all-trades/master-of-none. Still, holding out the hope for the circle of renewal...man, they're such teases. They'll never do it: it would step on Droo toes (onoes- a MASTER of HoT's), and it can't be something AoEish b/c that would step on the toes of Shammies (onoes- a MASTER of AoE healing, albeit facerolls).

    As someone else said in this thread- they took our mana-regen, took our CoH (funny tho b/c using it every CD still produces nutty results), give us, then nerfed PoM (which I'm still waiting for them to re-nerf it's so OP). The only thing left is to let us use swords/axes/fists, DW, and have a melee specc.

    lawls.

  10. #10
    greenmasheen
    Guest

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Quote Originally Posted by Ananan
    A lovely statement from the old crawler today. That's exactly what I've been missing in holy - some synergy between all those healing spells.

    Holy Concentration and Surge of Light are very good, but I also think that they are a little bit annoying (as I'm sure I've written somewhere else around here). The annoyance comes from not being able to react to them in time when they proc in stressful situations and hence feeling that you can't make optimal use of them.

    "What the heck happened there? Oh, SoL procced and made my Flash Heal that I had already decided to cast instant."

    "Oh, I have Holy Concentration. But I'm already casting a Flash Heal. What a waste. Is it worth aborting it?"

    Ah well, enough ranting. There is hope again!
    simple problem... simple solution. get a 3rd party combat text.

  11. #11

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Blizzards third party combat text accomadates for surge of light, you simply have to remain calm enough to pay attention.

    Ghost Crawler doesn't hit on our class anymore or less really then others, if anything he gets a better view of the pitfalls of our class then others might think because of the fact that he himself has stated he plays a priest. As well as a couple other classes so unless his priest is only level 19 still or something them I'm sure he has seen the issues we are stuggling with.

  12. #12

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    I use a mod called EventAlert to track SoL and Holy conc. procs.

    This mod displays the spell icon in the middle of the screen (just over your character) when any procc-able talant procs, and works for all classes. I highly recommend it to anyone that feels like they are not using their procc-able talents to the fullest extent.

    The only downside of this mod is a slight added visual clutter, though I believe that it is worth it and the improvements to my healing output far outweigh the annoyance.

    http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-a...ent-alert.aspx

  13. #13

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    PowerAuras can also be set up to do this for any proc, even trinkets. And it is less clutter than having the full icon appearing.
    I shall die here. Every inch of me shall perish. Every inch, but one. An inch. It is small and it is fragile and it is the only thing in the world worth having. We must never lose it or give it away. We must never let them take it from us.

  14. #14

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Quote Originally Posted by jgnoel86
    Ghost Crawler doesn't hit on our class anymore or less really then others, if anything he gets a better view of the pitfalls of our class then others might think because of the fact that he himself has stated he plays a priest. As well as a couple other classes so unless his priest is only level 19 still or something them I'm sure he has seen the issues we are stuggling with.
    ...provided he doesn't think we're tanks, shammies, or druids. True story. GC= massive fail/suffers from ADD.

    I'm sure *at one time* he was on top of the scene, but from what I've seen pouring out of him since I've leveled this toon: not impressed.

    And still- I don't like being condescended to as a class, something GC does well *cough*gourmetdinnercrap*cough*

  15. #15

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Honestly, I've healed with both specs and I prefer the "jack of all trades" role that I get as Holy over Disc. The best thing that could have happened to priests was that CoH was nerfed, because it fits easily into a rotation now. As for proc-watching, that's always been something I've really enjoyed as well, but that just fits my play style.

    What I would like to see for Holy Priests is to make the use of a rotation matter more. I use one to begin with, but it would be fun if there were an ability (kinda like they said) where if X Flash Heals are applied to the target, you can cast GHeal for free on that target. Or something like the Vial of the Sunwell trinket. I dunno, really. What I feel like I'm missing most of all, especially in 25-man raiding situations, is activity aside from being told to CoH spam. It's kind of like our tools are awesome for 5 mans, brought up better by healer synergy in 10-mans and then in 25-mans, we just stand there and hit three buttons: CoH, Prayer of Healing and Prayer of Mending, with a Guardian Spirit popping up here and there. But, in my opinion, nothing matches the rush of a fight were I have to use Inner Focus, Shadowfiend,and all of my different abilities. I just wish there was more weight TO those abilities.

    Also... "jack of all trades" is a role. It's nice being able to heal the party effectively and the tanks effectively. Never have understood why people think it's so damned bad to be a general healer.

  16. #16

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Short term goal for Blizzard regarding holy priests: Buff healing slightly. - They are working on that.

    Long term goal for Blizzard regarding holy priests: Give them an actual role other than Jack of all Trades. - They are discussing how to do that.

    Sounds like the future of Holy raiding is decent.
    Originally Posted by Ghostcrawler
    But we're worried that logic might not lead to the best game.

  17. #17

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Quote Originally Posted by Silai
    We can heal when we are dead, that's our niche.
    Dieing is not a niche.


  18. #18

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests


    I was obviously being sarcastic.

    Seriously, I don't understand why blizzard tries to add more crap to our holy tree instead of fixing it.

    We went to sartharion with 3 drakes yesterday and the one thing I don't want is another proc / CD to watch for.
    We already have so much to monitor between the breath, the lava waves, the void zones, all the timers (portals, adds spawning, etc ...) and of course the life bars of the raid.
    On top of that, we need to monitor surge of light and holy concentration procs as well as trinkets.

    We've been complaining about lightwell for years and it still suck really bad, renew is weak, they could also work on holy nova and prayer of healing to make them more usefull.


  19. #19

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    Raid leader- "Hey Mr. Shaman, do you think you could heal the tank?"
    Mr Shaman- "Awww but I hate single target healing, go get the paladin to do it!"

    Raid Leader- "Hey Mr. Paladin, you think you could heal the raid?"
    Mr. Paladin- "Aw but i hate raid healing =/ go get the shaman to do it"

    Raid Leader- "Hey Mr. Holy Priest, you think you could raid heal AND heal the tank to, you got the pally and the shaman to help"
    Mr. Priest- "Sure thing..."

    Raid leader- "Hey Mr. Druid, think you could battle rez me?"
    Mr. Druid- "I didn't buy any reagents =/"



    Think for once we could just be content with being a pretty good main tank healer and a pretty good raid healer?
    I mean come on...I love my holy priest and i can do anything...Jack of all trades is kinda nice, way better than just sittin there watchin urself go oom tryin to heal the tank, or desperately flash of light healing the raid while they all slowly die.


  20. #20

    Re: Hope for Holy Priests

    I got a holy/disc priest, and I love it. I got in a raid, with paladin, druid and mage buffs and my own ofcourse and some elixirs and foodbuffs :

    (Im not at home so I cant log on right now to see, so this is what I remember)

    - 20000 till 21000 mana (Depends what food and elixir buffs I got)
    - in combat my manaregen can reach up to 525-550 mp5
    - 2100-2200 + healing

    So Im happy, BUT I notice when I heal with lets say a druid, they can go way longer then I can without going oom. But I still love my priest, I have tried out druid healing and paladin healing, not shaman yet, but I still prefer priests.
    But to get all my mana I need to use pots, trinkets, shadowfiend, if I got time the hymn.

    But as far as healing and mp5, I need some talentpoints in disc.

    Just my thoughts about priests

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