pvp 0/20/51

[Rothemon]

Hi there, I was just wondering what so good at 0/20/51 build ...

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-ta...gan&n=Ylandrix

I saw that some DKs in 2v2 (2200+) got it , so i got interested in. I usually play 21/0/50 but this is something which i cant understand.
Why is KM so great in this build? In only afflicts IT, so it is a waste of talents for me, oh yea it will be critting all the time (cca) but its so great?
Thx for answer :-)

[Darthstar]

with that build your IT crits for about 4.5 / 5.5k.

[Sashan]

Spec it, try it out *yourself* - if you like it = win.

Really getting annoyed in general of "of I saw this guy with his spec - why is this good?" posts.

Its like every DK in the game has had a frontal lobotomy and is incapable of either independent thought or the motivation to try stuff out themselves.

[Soops]

This is serennia's Shadowfrost build.

Nathyrra's 0/20/51 "ShadowFrost" Spec:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=jZGMxzbxZfMGI0okxcqMcsuh
This is the spec I've theorycrafted for a while ever since the 3.0.8 PTR started with the announced changes (more specifically, nerfs). Without going into it too much, this spec strengthens the weakest parts of a typical DK rotation (icy touch, blood strike), and instead turns them into extremely potent burst, utility, and control.

The premise behind this spec is to offer amazing burst that not only penetrates armor, but is also reliable at the same time with the new Killing Machine mechanics. It essentially turns your Icy Touch into a burst that can be consistently higher damage than Scourge Strike that not only has a 30 yard range, but also only costs 1F rune instead of 1F1U. It allows quick swaps with amazing burst potential, as you can see here from prelimary PTR testing:

With Rune of the Fallen Crusader:
Icy Touch - http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/3481/it2oe1.jpg
Scourge Strike - http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/7188/ss2tn1.jpg

With Rune of Cinderglacier:
Icy Touch - http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/4779/it1lk0.jpg
Scourge Strike - http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/5893/ss1ne2.jpg

I won't get into more of the finer details regarding this spec, but there's a specific reason for every point placement and I feel after testing the spec in a long night of 3v3 that it definitely has the potential that I thought it would. The synergy between the opposite ends of the talent trees used is very strong as I expected. I consider this spec extremely potent in its ability to target anyone regardless of the armor they wear, as well as being excellent for putting out enormous spread damage.

The biggest weaknesses of this spec are not having access to Bladed Armor (resulting in about 400-500 less AP) and also not having (Improved) Rune Tap which can make or break certain match ups.

There, all better now

[rathok]

Spec it, try it out *yourself* - if you like it = win.

Really getting annoyed in general of "of I saw this guy with his spec - why is this good?" posts.

Its like every DK in the game has had a frontal lobotomy and is incapable of either independent thought or the motivation to try stuff out themselves.

Actually i think that was a pretty legit question by the OP... At a glance this spec does look kinda off in left field.

In your defense there has been an aweful lot of "So what if i spec like this, would it be good" threads which are indeed really anoying but this is not one of them.

[Darthstar]

Spec it, try it out *yourself* - if you like it = win.

Really getting annoyed in general of "of I saw this guy with his spec - why is this good?" posts.

Its like every DK in the game has had a frontal lobotomy and is incapable of either independent thought or the motivation to try stuff out themselves.

that is because of many rogues rerolled dk

[pranabowjake]

icy touch hits like a brick in this spec. going blood only gives you a heal that gets cut in half by most teams you face in high rated teams. +it gives you a spam if the enemy is trying to kite you and you dont have a way to get close to them. the biggest question for this spec is wondering plague v rage of rivindare since your diseases can do good crit damage or blood boil, ghoul, and what? bone armor is what i would use, maybe icy touch would be a nice one too for this spec. and some people still stick with ams since the cd increase was removed from it. it's a really hard choice

[Cerberuz]

Blood vs Unholy

Bone Armor > Vampiric Blood
Scourge Strike > Heart Strike
Gargoyle > (i don't think blood has a counterpart for this)

Blah blah blah. UH is better than Blood. Either way, that's not the topic we're talking about here.


I've been testing the build so far, shadow frost that is. It's been great. It weakened my SS in a small extent but gave me a new 3k nuke. Sweet. x)

[Darthstar]

Blood vs Unholy

Bone Armor > Vampiric Blood
Scourge Strike > Heart Strike
Gargoyle > (i don't think blood has a counterpart for this)

Blah blah blah. UH is better than Blood. Either way, that's not the topic we're talking about here.


I've been testing the build so far, shadow frost that is. It's been great. It weakened my SS in a small extent but gave me a new 3k nuke. Sweet. x)

the tradeoff is impr rune tap+4% crit+400/500 ap (depending on gear) vs +60% IT dmg +30% FF dmg (correct me if i'm wrong here) , Lichborne and KM.

There can be some variations of it , without WP and 5/5 RoR plus deathchill , or with 3/3 WP and 3/5 RoR (which is personally the one i do prefer) , etc.

To the previous poster : no , blood won't benefit more from it as deep unholy provides also bonuses to your spell damage :
RoR 3/5 +6% , EP = 13% , blood presence (which is the presence you do pvp with as an UH build) +15% , desecration +5% , plus impurity.
That has a very nice sinergy with black ice impr icy touch and glacier rot.

Basically i guess that if your gear allows you to do that , this spech grants you same dps over classic 18 0 53 , same exceptional splash damage ,almost same damage mitigation/surv , and more burst thx to the big improvement IT gets from it.

[darkdestiny]

I tried this spec "shadowfrost" in arenas last night (my partner is a frost mage) and omg it actually owned, i had doubts but damn. I used that icy touch glyph and it was non top crits and i could actually kite not only melee but casters as well, yes I was doing the kiting. Between me and the frost mage it was alot of burst dmg. And i like the fact that i had the survival ability of unholy. We didn't get to do very many games since we had Malygos. We only did 10games but on the good side we won all 10.......bad side we didn't get very many points, this new arena system sucks.

[deafmute]

Ummm, how do you kite with Icy Touch in shadowfrost? This spec doesn't go deep enough to get the 10%-30% reduced movement speed debuff on IT?

[rathok]

^
||
Glyph. Of. Bloodboil.

[darkdestiny]

Ummm, how do you kite with Icy Touch in shadowfrost? This spec doesn't go deep enough to get the 10%-30% reduced movement speed debuff on IT?

It's called Chains of ice, and for melee sometimes desecration helps. I also have the hateful gloves which refreshes my frost rune.

[Xiaz89]

The shadowfrost spec posted here looks like a pve one, however, the armory profile linked at the top is pretty much the pvp version, was surprised over no NotD etc.

Looks promising, maybe i'll try it out and let you know what i think, as opinions seems to be what you're looking for.

[Peet]

This spec looks very interesting and i'm about to try it. I was wondering which (major) glyphs you would recommend with it? I have Glyph of SS, which i'm quite content with for PvE and also 2v2 situations where i'm not being focused.
My problem is i would like to have 4 major glyphs: Scourge Strike, Blood Boil, Ghoul, and Icy Touch. Which would you recommend?

Seeing how this spec also depends on scourge strike and plague strike to reach its full damage potential, can you help me with some general guidelines for when i should start kiting my target rather than meleeing it?

Also, off topic: Is spell penetration useful for death knights?

[zold]

The reason why I like this build is for it's burst for pvp (killing machine and Deathchill)
Other reason is for survivability (Lichborne)

Of course lichborne is situational use as good pallies and priests will notice it and shackle or fear you.

[darkdestiny]

This spec looks very interesting and i'm about to try it. I was wondering which (major) glyphs you would recommend with it? I have Glyph of SS, which i'm quite content with for PvE and also 2v2 situations where i'm not being focused.
My problem is i would like to have 4 major glyphs: Scourge Strike, Blood Boil, Ghoul, and Icy Touch. Which would you recommend?

Seeing how this spec also depends on scourge strike and plague strike to reach its full damage potential, can you help me with some general guidelines for when i should start kiting my target rather than meleeing it?

Also, off topic: Is spell penetration useful for death knights?

My spec is alittle bit different than the one posted, i do have NoTD, normally i just use my pet for stuns and if im low on health, kill it to heal me then just resummon another one. You can kite or melee, thats what i like about it, but I would generally kite someone that is doing more dmg to me than I am to them, you will find rogues and warriors very easy to kite other DK's will be alittle more difficult. If its a caster I would kite them for fun but if you try to melee them thats less spells they will be using on you since they'll be trying to run away most of the time. And omg icy touch hits so hard! but anyway If you perfer to kite, blood boil glyph will be a good choice and chains of ice glyph. I'm still experiementing with different glyphs but so far i enjoy the spec alot. Oh and yes armor pen does help with DKs.

[Kaede]

I'd say take 1 point from the unholy tree and put it in Deathchill. As that specc you wont survive to long wich means u need to do hughe dmg, (Im playing that specc with a ele shaman atm). Works pretty good, No chance to be feared.

[darkdestiny]

I'd say take 1 point from the unholy tree and put it in Deathchill. As that specc you wont survive to long wich means u need to do hughe dmg, (Im playing that specc with a ele shaman atm). Works pretty good, No chance to be feared.

I agree with this post, and thats exactly how im set up, im actually 0/21/50 Death chill is a must

[rathok]

I tried it and really just couldn't get down with it... I ended up going back to 20/51. I don't feel like im hitting nearly as hard but i only ran about 10-15 games as this spec before i dropped it. I guess its a matter of prefference...