Only pally - kings for raid?

[Daez]

Every raid should have kings available to them in. It doesn't matter how it is available just that it is available. That being said, I will never be the paladin to actually bring kings. It sucks to fit it into a good protection build. It sucks to fit it into a good heal build. I could never justify fitting it into my preferred retldain build.

[Daez]

Oops, my bad. 3/5 :P

5/5 the 3/3 comes from sanctified seals and the other 2 points come from talents require to get to sanctified seals.

[eodem]

Every raid should have kings available to them in. It doesn't matter how it is available just that it is available. That being said, I will never be the paladin to actually bring kings. It sucks to fit it into a good protection build. It sucks to fit it into a good heal build. I could never justify fitting it into my preferred retldain build.

It's actually not that really hard to get it in any of the specs. Though Holy and Prot have to chip in, where as for the Retri it's quite easy to get. I do wonder what your pref Ret spec would be... I assume this is taking offtanking into account?

[Dokoran]

10% increase to stats outweighs 3% crit any day. That and if you have any dps warriors in your raid group... you in turn have 1 buff and 1 buff only to hand out. So skipping on kings which increases dps/health/crit(even if not by much) is a mistake.

2 buffs actually. A few classes get more benefit out of BoW than BoK.

[Dokoran]

The thing that sucks about Kings is that it's arguably the best buff in the game. @ end game a 10% increase to stats is great, what also sucks is the only spec that can take it without gimping their PvE damage is a ret paladin.

Holy Paladins lose their crit, which is the #1 stat for a holy paladin [you can argue about this if you like but you'd be wrong...]

Prot Paladins lose some additional TPS skills or survivability [depending on spec]

But both can still be viable specs in 25mans.

I've thought about giving up 5 points for kings because our ret paladin has been sorta flaky with showing up to raids, thus all the paladin buffs fall onto me and it sucks being in a 25man with no kings, mainly for the dps jump and survivability for the tougher fights. That being said, we've still cleared 25man naxx without kings AND without fort, so, it's possible and actually not all that difficult, it just slows things down do to the DPS loss more than anything.

[halmmar]

That being said, we've still cleared 25man naxx without kings AND without fort, so, it's possible and actually not all that difficult, it just slows things down do to the DPS loss more than anything.

What strategy did you use for Raz without mind control? Hunters kiting or abusing spellsteal?

[eodem]

Holy Paladins lose their crit, which is the #1 stat for a holy paladin [you can argue about this if you like but you'd be wrong...]

Not arguing... YOU are wrong. Best stat nowadays is INT. Simple enough said, go browse EJ :P.

What strategy did you use for Raz without mind control? Hunters kiting or abusing spellsteal?

Spell steal is removed. Can't comprehend the tactics without at least 1 priest...

[Matson]

Well I´m in the same situation only that I am one of 2 tanks in the raid.
I do take Kings even if I don´t want it myself (rather use sanctuary especsially on trash but even on bosses)
I simply have Kings because for alot of people it´s the best buff they can get.
I think it´s sacrifices you have to do, it´s all about gain vs loss and when it comes to kings or no kings the gain from haveing it is huge compared to your personal loss.
Isn´t Improved BOM standard for most holy builds?

You should not take kings as prot. Since you cannot give 2 buffs to tanks. You need kings, but you need sanctuary also, and there is no way ret or holy pala will go that deep prot to give it ^^..
Holy should have imp BoM since they will have so deep ret anyways.
Ret should go for kings.

If there is no ret palas in your guild, holy pala should sacrifise some crit to go for kings. If you have only 1 pala and its tank, you need fast recruit :P

[loopy]

Not arguing... YOU are wrong. Best stat nowadays is INT. Simple enough said, go browse EJ :P.

True, but crit is a close(ish) second.

[iktankniet]

its no use stacking just 1 stat. you should balance it around.

if you stack int, you can have a manapool of 26k(for example) but you wont have much crit. so your healing will not be as high as a healadin who has been stacking crit.

the advantage is that you might be able to outlast him, and im not sure about that. since crit = getting mana back.

just my thoughts on the subject.

[sainthubbins]

Intellect does provide some crit, as well as some spell power through a talent. Intellect is the best all around stat for a holy paladin, because you'll regen more mana through Replenishment and Divine Plea. Once you get a large enough mana pool, you can basically spam holy light for entire fights, increasing your heals per second more than spell power or crit ever will.

[Bolzep]

Kings is great.. nuff said its been repeated several times already...

But you are already rolling 28% crit unraid buffed... if you are worried about more crit you should regem because though the 16 int is great you could be gemming to 16crit instead...

on a side note... if you wanna respec... respec and quit worrying about it

its your 15 bux a month do what you want... if you want to raid, deal with conforming to what is needed and quit qqing..