[Improvement] Feral druid PvE DPS

[Cantthink]

this is a quick version of what ill probably be using

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?drui...0&version=9684

the Glyphh is bugged but i think it adds 6% ap to SR


oh and theres a free talent point

[Luaavin]

The best Base spec for PvE Feral DPS in my opinion is (on live):

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?drui...0&version=9684

Most of the Time you don't need improved mangle, because usual you have either a Feral Tank or you are Feral Tank for yourself so you can't even use that spec. There is also the possibility of your guild bringing an Arms Warrior to the raid. As you can see there are 4 talent points left for usage which can placed freely.

As for the Glyph pick Mangle + Rip Glyph

When you get to 50% crit raidbuffed, FB will always outdps Rip, as long as you don't using at least two pieces of T7 AND the Glyph.

For the usage of skills:
Keep Savage Roar up
Keep Rake up
Keep Mangle up (if needed)
Use Shred when Clearcasting procs (at any number of CPs)
Finish at 4 or more CPs (this is because if you crit with your next CP-builder you lose 1 CP)


Always plan your next steps, there is no need for buttonsmashing as a Feral DPSer. If you are at zero energy and your Rip will fall off in 5 seconds and you are at 5 CPs, you wont lose any DPS if you wait that 5 seconds to reapply Rip and pool your energy to 50. You will only loose DPS if you pool your energy to the maximum of 100.

[Bergenia]

The best Base spec for PvE Feral DPS in my opinion is (on live):

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?drui...0&version=9684

Bad spec is bad.

There is no reason to put 5 points in Furor. 3 is enough, put 2 points in Imp. MotW instead. You definitely want Feral Swiftness, being able to move quickly between targets is a lot more valuable than you might think. Same goes for Feral Charge.

To make the optimal DPS spec at this point you'll have to choose between 5/5 Feral Aggression or Master Shapeshifter. You cannot have both and still perform as well as you should. It's really a choice between using Bite in your "rotation" or not. As it is on live now, you'll probably not get a lot of Bites off. But that might change in 3.1.

This is my current spec (for 3.1 I'll move one point from Furor to Primal Gore):
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=0ZxGMcfrzbeR0huAobyczb

[sd78]

I typically put out around 4800dps on 25Patches, with an average of 30% coming from bleeds.

If all goes as planned, the bleed crits will contribute a flat 15% or so to DPS, putting me over 5500dps. I can't wait...

[Alski]

When you get to 50% crit raidbuffed, FB will always outdps Rip, as long as you don't using at least two pieces of T7 AND the Glyph.

Not true, Glyph of rip + 2set T7 = 20sec rip. since rip ticks every 2 sec that = 10 ticks.

10 ticks of rip > 1 FB

[Hippiez]

Come 3.1, you will prefer agility over strength, armor pen very slightly better than crit, with haste and attack power being our worst 2 stats.

Actually Strght gives more AP than agi and crit over 50% is nearly useless cause u wont be able to go much farther with DR.

Armor penetration is only fine for melee and shred (Bleeds arent affected anyhow by the armor of your target)

AP is still better than Agi ( agi on live gives 1.2AP/agi ) and haste is the less useful of our stat due to the lack of cooldowns and the 1.00 attack speed w/o haste

[Kuddly]

When you get to 50% crit raidbuffed, FB will always outdps Rip, as long as you don't using at least two pieces of T7 AND the Glyph.

i have 50.50% crit with close to 7.2k (or was it 7.3?) AP with motw only and i've NEVER used FB over rip, thats just retarded, only times i've done that was pre patch to get 20-22k crits on dummies with full energy trinkets and berzerk etc. anyhow can't wait for patch when bleeds will be able to crit, might have to regem for agi tho, seeing SR wont give +AP anymore >_>

[Kuddly]

Actually Strght gives more AP than agi and crit over 50% is nearly useless cause u wont be able to go much farther with DR.

AP is still better than Agi ( agi on live gives 1.2AP/agi ) and haste is the less useful of our stat due to the lack of cooldowns and the 1.00 attack speed w/o haste

is there even a DR for crit? if so a link would be sweet, and come 3.1 AGI might be to prefer once again, due to even having close to 60% or so selfbuffed would be fun XD (+ retards think that anything with high hp tanks good, and anything with close to 60% crit selfbuffed is amazing even if you would have 100 AP) ((not saying i PUG anymore >_>))

[Hippiez]

This isnt really a diminishing return but:

50% gives you 1/2 crit chance
60% give you 6/10 and its still near the 1/2
Getting to 70% crit for 2/3 crit off attacks is getting almost impossible(i know its 66.66.....% for 2/3 )

I don't know if you understand what i meant but i concider that any crit over 50% if a lost of dps if you have to lower your AP wich is raw DMG

[Schlock]

This isnt really a diminishing return but:

50% gives you 1/2 crit chance
60% give you 6/10 and its still near the 1/2
Getting to 70% crit for 2/3 crit off attacks is getting almost impossible(i know its 66.66.....% for 2/3 )

I don't know if you understand what i meant but i concider that any crit over 50% if a lost of dps if you have to lower your AP wich is raw DMG

...

10% increased crit is 10% increased crit regardless of whether you're going from 10% to 20% or 80% to 90%. It's the same all the way down the line. Since savage roar no longer is scaled based directly on your AP but is a overall percentage increase, and with the new talent that causes bleeds to crit, most number crunching is showing that gemming for agi, not strength, is the way to go again once the patch rolls around.

[Avermra]

This isnt really a diminishing return but:

50% gives you 1/2 crit chance
60% give you 6/10 and its still near the 1/2
Getting to 70% crit for 2/3 crit off attacks is getting almost impossible(i know its 66.66.....% for 2/3 )

I don't know if you understand what i meant but i concider that any crit over 50% if a lost of dps if you have to lower your AP wich is raw DMG

Just going to edit out this part. Poorly thought out math does piss me off still, however.

Played around with Feral DPS on PTR today. Using a standard hybrid 3.0.8 0/60/11 Spec that is NOT a good 3.1 spec(taking 1 point out of a tanking talent into Primal Gore) and I am able to pull 5.5k DPS fairly consistently on Mimiron 25 (this is with melee needing to run in and out). Fights that don't allow you to use Shred will lower your DPS very dramatically, but should not be a big deal.

This patch will definitely put feral DPS on top, assuming equally geared and skilled with the other players. Whether we'll be too high or just about right remains to be seen since tweaks are not done.

And final words, I do hope no feral plan on only playing physical DPS, because that's pretty much playing 1/6 of a class =P.

[Kuddly]

...

10% increased crit is 10% increased crit regardless of whether you're going from 10% to 20% or 80% to 90%. It's the same all the way down the line. Since savage roar no longer is scaled based directly on your AP but is a overall percentage increase, and with the new talent that causes bleeds to crit, most number crunching is showing that gemming for agi, not strength, is the way to go again once the patch rolls around.

Thanks Schlock, just what i wanted to know ^^ anyone know how much more the crit dmg is 1.5 or 2x? had to ask seeing locks get 2x dmg in affli tree >_<

[Avermra]

Thanks Schlock, just what i wanted to know ^^ anyone know how much more the crit dmg is 1.5 or 2x? had to ask seeing locks get 2x dmg in affli tree >_<

Started out as 1.5, blue said they intended on changing it to 2. However I cannot confirm whether or not it has been that way today since my recount does not record DoT crits for some reason.

Also any other crit bonuses are multiplicative, in case you're wondering.

[Kuddly]

Also any other crit bonuses are multiplicative, in case you're wondering.

meaning what? they stack or? :P (sorry for being retarded, bit hungover atm T_T)

[Avermra]

meaning what? they stack or? :P (sorry for being retarded, bit hungover atm T_T)

Assuming 3% crit meta gem and 10% crit bonus from PI , and assuming 100% crit bonus

Crit damage= 2 x 1.1 x 1.03 = 2.266, not 2+.1+.03=2.13

Assuming 50% crit bonus

Crit damage = 1.5 x 1.1 x 1.03= 1.6995, not 1.5+.1+.03=1.63

Again haven't really paid attention on PTR about actual crit bonus since those numbers were not important to me at least for last night. Others can probably help you more in this perspective.

[Kuddly]

Thanks anyhow

[furyform]

3% crit meta gem and 10% crit bonus from PI , and assuming 100% crit bonus

Crit damage= 2 x 1.1 x 1.03 = 2.266, not 2+.1+.03=2.13

This. Tested by myself! 1861 rip -> 4205 crit rip

[Bergenia]

And final words, I do hope no feral plan on only playing physical DPS, because that's pretty much playing 1/6 of a class =P.

WTF. I'll play whatever I want, it's my time and money spent on this game so if I want want to play feral dps and nothing else that's my choice. Why the hell would I play tank/healer/caster if I don't enjoy that? :

[Cantthink]

This. Tested by myself! 1861 rip -> 4205 crit rip

O_o and with a 50% crit rate, thats about 60% dmg incresse of an Old rip.

i roughly worked it out to about 30,000-/+ 5k dmg on a full 20 sec rip your looking at 48000ish over 20secs thats a dps of 2800 on its own. i would say its going to be more closer to 3k dps.

but then again this is not taking into account the 10% ap loss from SR which would give us a smaller base rip dmg to work with.

[Kuddly]

but then again this is not taking into account the 10% ap loss from SR which would give us a smaller base rip dmg to work with.

It's +30% Phys dmg not ap if i rember alright? but yeah a bit lower base dmg, but it'll still increase bleed dmg with 30% so for crappy druids geared druids, its a buff and for us with those crazy high numbers in AP its a nerf :<