improved unholy presence

[hagar4172]

k thier is somethign i do not understand about this change

improved unholy presence stats: while in blood or frost presence u retain 8/15% increased movment speed from unholy presence, and your runes cooldowns 5/10% faster while in unholy presence,

does this mean to get that second effect u have to be in unholy presence and if so if u put points into this skill wouldn't it make unholy presence alot more attractive for a unholy dk far as dps is concerned cause u attack faster and ur runes become available faster?

[Lollygagger]

Depends... I have not seen much testing done on the PTR concerning blood presence vs unholy presence /w the haste buff to all melee classes. As of now I think blood presence with the flat 15% damage increase will net you more DPS than the haste from unholy presence.

Now if someone would test the haste changes and give a good write up on how unholy presence nets more DPS than blood I would say just stick to blood presence and save yourself 2 talent points.

[Lollipop]

Unholy presence should be netting higher dps than blood on live and on ptr, tbh. It's not so much the 15% haste instead of 15% damage, but rather the 1 second GCD instead of 1.5 seconds.

[wildmandooby]

Unholy presence should be netting higher dps than blood on live and on ptr, tbh. It's not so much the 15% haste instead of 15% damage, but rather the 1 second GCD instead of 1.5 seconds.

Wrong. What good is the 1 SEC GCD when you don't have any runes to cast any spells with? For most specs on live blood is the clear dps winner. However with the new imp unholy presence, it might be different on the ptr.

[Lollygagger]

Unholy presence should be netting higher dps than blood on live and on ptr, tbh. It's not so much the 15% haste instead of 15% damage, but rather the 1 second GCD instead of 1.5 seconds.

You sir are misinformed, blood presence nets more DPS than unholy on live atm in all dps specs.

[talitu]

k thier is somethign i do not understand about this change

improved unholy presence stats: while in blood or frost presence u retain 8/15% increased movment speed from unholy presence, and your runes cooldowns 5/10% faster while in unholy presence,

does this mean to get that second effect u have to be in unholy presence and if so if u put points into this skill wouldn't it make unholy presence alot more attractive for a unholy dk far as dps is concerned cause u attack faster and ur runes become available faster?

Ok , yes you have to be in unholy to gain the rune and weapon haste and yes in theory Unholy Presence is the sex,
blood offers +15% across the board.
Unholy offers 15% to white and 30% to yellow damage.

the problem comes in that for unholy to return this gain you have to (as it stands on live now) fill 10 GCD's with abilities per 10 second rune cycle to gain the advantage. ofc this isn't possible.

Now with the rune haste its easier , we need to fill 9 GCD's every 9 seconds.
thats going to still be impossible as far as i can see. they need to raise the haste to 30% to make it work but then the problem is it will flat out destroy blood presence, at 20% you can make a rotation that just uses single rune abilities and death coil that might work but will be a very specialised build.

but at the end of the day because its a haste based benefit it will require 100% dps time on a boss to work out or a very short term on/off style fight (i mean something like attack for 4 seconds cant attack for 4 seconds , cycling fast like that)

so although it looks lovely initially on paper in practice it just has too many problems to actually work. but if the rune haste goes up to 20-30% we will need to re look at it.

[neonanaski]

Talitu's pretty much right. To be honest, I'm suprised Blood Presence hasn't gotten a nerf yet. I'm guessing they are more likely to do that than buff Unholy even more.

[Talamare]

Its not "impossible" there are a few builds focus on spamming 1 rune moves that can achieve a full 10 gcd, namely Frost 20/51 and a blood build

Most builds tho that focuses on using the 2 FU runes are better off using Blood, and Ill fully agree with you on this

[JimDoug]

DW would probably benefit more from unholy than the 15% damage increase because of the extra DC we can toss. our white damage and IT are normally our highest output when specing into Imp UH. you end up with more procs over time and your movement keeps you inthe fight longer which may not help your dps per say but it will certainly help your damage out which imo is more important anyway. for a stand still fight your probably better off just stacking a but of haste and using blood.

on the dummy ( yes i know not a good test standard ). i was able to pull the exact same dps in Imp UH as i was with Blood in DW i believe this is because i have 230 haste rating and with the 30% more haste from rating. the difference was instead of using dual angry dread with blood i had to use hailstorm for an OH. why the difference was there i'm still not sure. possibly it was just bad luck for the run i did as it was only 3 min compared to the other two runs at 30 min each.

i didn't have the proper glyphs, i deal for the dw's i think will be the DC glyph, IT, and Ghoul. No spec i have used thus far for DW has gained any dps from using the garg so i have omited it from all specs.

over all i think it will come down to which one scales better