[3.1.0 Tankage] Frost still the top?

[Kao]

I will cut through the bulls**t and get straight to it. Now that Howling Blast is down to an 8 second cooldown and Rime now having that 15% chance to refresh that cooldown once triggered, is it safe to say that Frost is going to stay at the top?

Now I know some of you will say no because of the Black Ice nerf, but do remember Tundra Stalker and Glacier Rot are now buffed to compensate.

Also, since DK tanks are a very active "popping cooldowns" class, Blizzard decided to nerf such cooldowns such as Unbreakable Armor and Lichborne. Not really THAT big of a deal; glyphs can compensate (ex: new UBA and IBF glyphs).

In the beginning we thought Frost tanking would die out in 3.1.0 but it looks like to me it will be still the strongest and most viable tanking class.

EDIT: This is my mere opinion on Frost being the top with facts to support it. REMEMBER this please.

[failoth]

small note, new IBF glyph is completely useless for tanks.

[Deleted]

Well, I can discuss even the "still" at the thread subject.... really? "still"?

Until 3.1 hits live it's hard to tell wich one will be better or even if it's going to be a better one. But i don't think that frost was ever the best one.

[Luckyless]

Well best tanking specc for DK's is different for each player. Heard some say they didn't like frost, or couldn't build up enough aggro with it. So they went unholy/blood (I did the same until I got the hang of it, then tried frost again and my tps went much higher). In my opinion frost is best single and multi tank specc. I pull of 6k tps on single mobs, and 2/3k tps each mob when I aoe tank. With these changes I doubt building aggro with frost will change alot. Guess only big nerf are the CD's wich I used to pop alot, guess I'll have to start blowing my trinket CD's a bit more.

[Talamare]

Lets see compare the tanking talents each tree has (wont list 5/5/5)

Blood
-Scent of Blood
-Rune Tap/Improved
-Spell Deflection
-Veteran of 3rd war
-Mark of Blood
-Vampiric Blood
-Will of the Necropolis
==================
While it has a large amount of skills that can be considered for tanking, but they tend to be heal effects, very little actual reduction type

Frost
-Improved Icy Touch
-Frigid Dreadplate
-Improved Frost Presence
-Unbreakable Armor
-Acclimation
===================
A fair amount of reduction, from reducing attack speed, to reducing amount of times hit and damage when hit


Unholy
-Magic Suppression
-Anti Magic Zone
-Bone Shield
===================
Doesnt have too many talents that would be considered tanking, so its more dependent on gear for reduction

[bujaberry]

Keep in mind that all defensive abilities have a 2min CD, making the tree with more passive abilities strong. Bone armor, while it is nice, but 6 charges on a 2min CD is just really really bad. Sure UA isn't much more attractive, but its 1) nice threat on the pull (+25% str) 2) frigid breastplate & impr. FA make it really nice.

Blood is a bit iffy, whereas the other trees reduce dmg blood tries to make up for the dmg taken, but if a hit will kill you, selfhealing wont do you much. I have to admit though, blood is STRONG for vezax, increase healing done, heal yourself, strongest tree for that fight.

[Raptorg]

It is for me, and that's all that matters.

[neonanaski]

I disagree about Frost being #1 on live. Blood is probably the strongest right now. WotN is very strong.

In 3.1, the new UA will close the gap, but we'll see if it's enough. The problem is Frost's magic mitigation is unreliable or nonexistant. The new UA will absorb about 1800 dmg per hit assuming Naxx25 armor values. Enough for a bolt spamming mob or boss.. but Hodir who hits for 40k Frost it's a very small drop in the bucket.

Comparing 'number of tank talents' in the trees is pointless, also.

[tears]

IThe problem is Frost's magic mitigation is unreliable or nonexistant.

huh? acclimation? i dont see how thats unreliable being up 24/7 if u get hit by sorta magic each 20seconds

[neonanaski]

huh? acclimation? i dont see how thats unreliable being up 24/7 if u get hit by sorta magic each 20seconds

An example:

Let's say theres a fight where every 30 seconds he does a massive AE that can't be interrupted.

Blood DKs will always mitigate it by 15%, or use VB to give themselves a substantial buffer.

Unholy DKs can mitigate it by an extra 6%, an extra 20% with BA, or knock off 18k from AMZ

Frost DKs only defense at that point is 2% from Frost Aura.


Same example, but he does it every 15 seconds:

Blood DKs are still mitigating it by 15% every time consistently

Unholy DKs mitigate it consistently by 6% each time, and with help from BA/AMZ extend their average mitigation higher

Frost - First shot 2% mitigation, and after 4 shots finally has a full stack of Acclimation. Which may or may not happen, considering Acclimation is only a 30% proc. Even with a full stack, you may resist 1,000, you may resist 7,000, or any random number in between.


It's the same reason nobody takes Spell Deflection - it's far too random and unreliable. Especially if the next hit after that AE could kill you.

[Gomexus]

It is for me, and that's all that matters.

Raptorg answered this whole thread.

We can all argue for days/weeks/months (since we have been) about which tree is "best" for tanking. Truth of the matter is, whichever tree the player feels most comfortable with is the best.

At any given point in any raid currently I can think "man if I was X spec I could be doing better"...Blood against Patch...Unholy against Sarth...Frost against trash...but until we can swap 3 or 4 specs (instead of just 2) then it really doesn't matter.

DK's are great that way though imo. Frost to me represents the "classic" tanking tree...mitigation/avoidance/CD's. Blood and Unholy represent the "alternate" tanking tree's...both have killer CD's and are focused on seperate forms of incoming damage...compared to Frost being decent at both physical and magic.

I personally use Frost because it's good enough to cover the bases for what I do...if my guild were doing Sarth+3 or something I am sure I would be a different spec.

One thing everyone should do is learn to branch out a little. I mix it up and run Blood or Unholy every once in a while just to stay fresh...mainly because we never know what will happen 2 months from now.

[taek]

I will cut through the bulls**t and get straight to it. Now that Howling Blast is down to an 8 second cooldown and Rime now having that 15% chance to refresh that cooldown once triggered, is it safe to say that Frost is going to stay at the top?

If you only care about threat and have no concern for the survivability part of tanking, i can see deep Frost still being the best TPS.

Although now that Blizz offiically stated that Naxx25 was far too easy, much easier than Naxx10 even, the survivability talents may matter more to more DK tanks in Ulduar.