Durka durka

[Achilles]

Muffins are good...

[emjay]

, with guilds getting better every year does it make sense that they are making it easier ? Well i think the more skill you gain the harder it should be next time around. This isn't something new to the WoW community could this be looked at as an issue in the near future? Soon enough Tier gear will be quest rewards at this rate..

man this isnt about skill, you dont need ANY skill to play wow. pve is easy, pvp is a matter of class setup. blizzard doesnt aim for you pseudo pro gamer, they aim for YOUR MOTHER, your grandma, your sister, your girlfriend.... for every f'in casual. when do you casual whiner learn that wow is not about skill and that blizzards goal is to earn money out of as many people as possible.

now pls, look for a real game or live with the casuality in wow

[Joigahdenn]

I agree with you to some extent, but you completely neglect to mention the fact that there are hard modes. On several occasions I have now heard that hard modes are not the solution, but I ask why?

Blizzard spends millions on developing new content, it simply wouldn't be fair to those players who want to see content but not be hardcore raiders to exclude them from something they pay for. So, in turn, to keep those who are in for the long haul, Blizzard made hardmodes. If easy mode is to easy for you, do hardmode, what is the problem with that? Why is it a problem when things became more accessible while still providing the means at making things significantly more challenging. What you, and everyone else who thinks hardmodes are not the solution are ignoring, is that the current system is significantly more inclusive, and caters to a much larger player base in terms of player preferences, than the game used to. Excluding players from content is really a poor econimical choice by Blizzard, and while I'm sure they like developing the game, $$$ plays a pretty damn big role as well.

[PBitt]

I agree with you to some extent, but you completely neglect to mention the fact that there are hard modes. On several occasions I have now heard that hard modes are not the solution, but I ask why?

Blizzard spends millions on developing new content, it simply wouldn't be fair to those players who want to see content but not be hardcore raiders to exclude them from something they pay for. So, in turn, to keep those who are in for the long haul, Blizzard made hardmodes. If easy mode is to easy for you, do hardmode, what is the problem with that? Why is it a problem when things became more accessible while still providing the means at making things significantly more challenging. What you, and everyone else who thinks hardmodes are not the solution are ignoring, is that the current system is significantly more inclusive, and caters to a much larger player base in terms of player preferences, than the game used to. Excluding players from content is really a poor econimical choice by Blizzard, and while I'm sure they like developing the game, $$$ plays a pretty damn big role as well.

This!

To add to this, yes Blizzard wants moar monies, but the designers (who are not billionaires) do put in a decent amount of effort becuase they like the work they do and want people to enjoy it, its not about money for them. People don't realize that by making WoW much cleaner and diverse, lets say, that because of this improved gameplay it also makes the content much easier to learn and get through. For one, I'm talking about raid setups; 10 and 25 mans are much easier to organize and maintain than the epic clusterf***s of 40 mans, they may have been fun here and there because there were so many people but otherwise, the new system is much cleaner. They also fix bugs and the like much quicker now(and test more), so there should never be another Mu'ru or C'thun. People threaten to go elsewhere and I really don't care, but where is it you are going??? Hello Kitty Online Adventures? I've at least sampled a good number of so called 'wow-destroyers' that simply went down the can. Some of them brought new things to the table but WoW is still extremelely dominant in the genre because it is so well-developed and cared for. Now I agree that WoW could use a little refreshing and new material, but I mean that in other ways beyond the raiding, because I happen to like the hard mode/achievement system they have set up and there is no valid reason I can think of not to like them, but thats just me.

[darkfenix_rizen]

DAMMIT! Did they make bosses actually killable again? WHY DO THEY DO THAT!?! I WANT TO WIPE FOR MONTHS ON THE SAME BOSS! SCREW THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE PLAYERBASE! THEY SHOULD MAKE THIS GAME FOR MEEEEEEEE!

[Wheres]

<3 people who bitch and moan about content being to easy. Have you downed Agalon? No? Orly? Sit Down. Hard mode is meant for hardcore raiders, if you down all the hard modes, awesome! Your good at this game. Stop complaining because they make the rest of the content open to everyone else. Get the 25 Man proto-drake to show off your awesomeness, park it outside the bank, or on Krasus' landing and watch everyone walking by, thinking to yourself, "Oh yeah, he so wishes he was me", the whole while having typed /afk to make people think you are not there watching them.

So, either be good enough to down all the hardmodes and let others bask in your Glory, or get off your soap-box.

[Titan]

I don't like how people lump bad players in with the word "casual".

I have been on both sides of the fence. Was in one of the top raiding guilds for a long time pre-bc/some of BC. did the PTR grinds, the creation of your own strategy, sitting on IRC theory crafting with other top guilds. It was fun but life moved on, things got busy. Then I joined up with a casual raiding guild, and to my surprise most of the members were in the same predicament as I was. They are by far, some of the best players I have ever played with, and better then most hardcore raiders. They just have shit to do IRL, and more responsibilities.

What I assume you mean is Blizzard is now tuning fights for flat out bad players. The guys who aren't organized, who make retarded guilds, don't look look into the mechanics of their class etc.. Those people aren't "casuals" they are just retards.

and yes, blizzard is tuning some encounters for them. Obviously top guilds in the world will burn through the content when they spent days of their lives wiping on it during PTR, and more time doing so on LIVE. however. That is nobodies fault but their own.

They could not play it on PTR, and spend LESS time doing the content and it would take much longer, but they don't. They want to get through it as fast as possible.

It just doesn't make sense to create new content for a game of 11,000,000 that can only be done by 2 percent of those people, that spent 100 percent of their free time working on it.

If you create an encounter for someone to beat. They will beat it. You can't create an encounter for someone to beat in 3 months. It doesn't work like that. When players are playing their class the best that is humanly possible, then bosses tuned to be killed by those type of people will, and fast.

You always see hardcore raiders say "LAWL Blizzard broke that fight, can't be done, FIX it Blizz WTF" then when they do it's "LAWL that was so EZ, Blizz make harder fights K".

[Autodidact]

Soon enough Tier gear will be quest rewards at this rate..

Tier 3
<3

[Deleted]

Another one with Heroic:Glory of the Ulduar raider here...i counted already 386324 members of Ensidia on this site...

Mimiron hard is definately easiest encounter in the game, only for casuals..

[nrross]

DAMMIT! Did they make bosses actually killable again? WHY DO THEY DO THAT!?! I WANT TO WIPE FOR MONTHS ON THE SAME BOSS! SCREW THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE PLAYERBASE! THEY SHOULD MAKE THIS GAME FOR MEEEEEEEE!

Lol.

I love how the OP acts like this trash nerf will mean a gang of newly dinged lvl 80's in full green will walk in and clear Ulduar in 10 minute flat. As if it will be made mindbogglingly easy.

He is right, he is not the only one to post about this. However if you insist on making a topic which already exists in other threads, at least make the effort to introduce some original, thoughful discussion to the topic. Your OP did none of these, indeed all it was is a more ignorant and wordier version of http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=57336.0

If you want people to take your opinions seriously, maybe put some thought into them. Stand back and ask "Will this make me seem like an utter moron" and if so, don't post it.

[Suikiele]

I agree with you to some extent, but you completely neglect to mention the fact that there are hard modes. On several occasions I have now heard that hard modes are not the solution, but I ask why?

Blizzard spends millions on developing new content, it simply wouldn't be fair to those players who want to see content but not be hardcore raiders to exclude them from something they pay for. So, in turn, to keep those who are in for the long haul, Blizzard made hardmodes. If easy mode is to easy for you, do hardmode, what is the problem with that? Why is it a problem when things became more accessible while still providing the means at making things significantly more challenging. What you, and everyone else who thinks hardmodes are not the solution are ignoring, is that the current system is significantly more inclusive, and caters to a much larger player base in terms of player preferences, than the game used to. Excluding players from content is really a poor econimical choice by Blizzard, and while I'm sure they like developing the game, $$$ plays a pretty damn big role as well.

You assume that, historically speaking, the content was too difficult for these people to even attempt it. Couldn't it just be that they are lazy or not interested in it? Why does the benefit of the doubt nowadays seem to be that it should be made "easier and more approachable for the common player" instead of simply saying "Yeah, they sucked and couldn't go. That's the nature of the game"?

Long/short: Hardmodes don't change or address the nature of "the gamer", and that's what the issue is here. All it does it lower the bar for everyone.

[coach]

You really want to prevent casuals from getting purple loot? The answer is easy!! Just bring back 40 man raids... even if 40 people were to pug a raid its guaranteed fail unless its just a few guilds merged together. It is impossible for 40 complete strangers (especially WoW players) to work together in order to do anything never mind a proper strat.

Think about it... in vanilla how long did it take for people to even try to pug MC and then BWL?? Nevermind AQ40 or Naxx! And when they did pug it how successful was it?

Problem solved.... Make big raids 40 man and leave the casuals the troll raids!

P.S I'm a casual and i like troll raids!!!!!!

[Spoonerism]

there is also a trend amongst humans: the weather is hot "I wish it were cooler", the weather turns cold "I wish it were warmer".

In other words everytime blizzard makes a change threads like this crop up, people complain about change.

Blizzard have done unkillable bosses that needed nerfing, they have done encounters that are too easy and needing buffing, they have done raids so hard you need to raid stack differently for every boss - all of the above prior to Wrath of the Lich King, what makes you think they are going to stop tuning things?

[GAfo]

it's incredibly funny to see people that did not even clear the istance without hard modes (not even the keepers mostrly) complaining about the level of it.. so either your guild is less then a casual one, or either you are really really bad according to your statement.

Ulduar is perfectly tuned for the tier level, and i bet that if the ppl in ensidia are enjoying the encounters (they stated it a lot of times already), nobody in the world should whine about it.

From my pov (and i'm in a raiding guild, not hardcore but not even casual), the normal modes may be kinda easy for a non casual guild AFTER you learn the fight, but surely yoggy/algalon/hardmodes are way far from being easy.

[shiroii]

To the OP:

Until you've actually entered Ulduar and completed it, you probably shouldn't complain that it's too easy.

[Sillicur]

With the exception of 3 needed nerfs, aka Hodirs 2 min timer, XT's nerf and Ignis meleeing people in the pot, no other ulduar nerfs where needed.

Casual guilds were making good progress and enjoying every minute of it, hardcore were clearing it in one week and started to down the hardmodes the next reset.

Everyone had their place, casuals for the most part were happy, hardcores too. So why do they nerf it every patch while the majority of the community, hardcore+casuals where happy with Ulduar, that's whats bothering me.

Think about this, why change something which was perfectly designed for both groups of players? (excluding the 3 nerfs mentioned above)

Reason : The bads still complain. You know who you are, bad players even make casual guilds sad, cause i know most casuals i spoke to enjoyed wiping on trash even and finally killing the bosses.

Casuals+hardcores where happy, bads werent, hence the nerfs.

/endthread

[jpwkeeper]

I agree with you to some extent, but you completely neglect to mention the fact that there are hard modes. On several occasions I have now heard that hard modes are not the solution, but I ask why?

I'll tell you now why people complain. It's not the lack of challenge; the hard modes are obviously providing that. It's not the lack of better-than-average gear; the hard-mode bosses are providing that too.

It's Ego.

Back in Vanilla and even in BC, if you were a raider you were somebody special. You had seen and done things that very, very few people had ever had the privilege of seeing and doing. You could look down on the poor pathetic green and blue geared characters and laugh at them with your shiny purple epics.

In BC, it was almost the same thing. If you had raided BT or SWP, you were somebody special. You had seen and done things that few people had seen and done. It wasn't as few as in Vanilla, but it was still enough of an exclusive club that you could look down on the Kara and Zulaman geared toons from your lofty perch upon your War Bear and laugh at them.

But now it's completely different. Way too many raiders are running around in gear that is as good, or close enough to as good, as yours that you can't laugh at them anymore (or if you do they just shrug). Now you are seeing and doing the same things that half the wow players in the world are seeing and doing. What's worse is those "casuals" are not just content to see and do this themselves, they're reaching back and pulling their friends up from the grind of dailies and convincing them to run as well, swelling their numbers, and when their friends experience these intricate fights for the first time, they smile at them and say "Now wasn't that awesome?" rather than glower in whatever corner those who are no longer special hang out in.

And the final nail in the coffin is that the casuals just don't seem to care that being a raider doesn't make them special. They have their family, friends, and even co-workers and bosses to give them that feeling. They're content to just enjoy the challenge of executing maneuvers as a team to down that next boss. They wipe on Flame Leviathan and don't feel like less of a person. Where do they get the nerve?

So now to feel special, those who used to be special come here and talk about how easy it was to down 8 Ulduar bosses or single-tank Kologarn despite the fact that they're doing it in 10 man using all 25 man gear. And they do it because it is their last chance to be special in the game; to try to laugh at the casuals to say that what is easy for them is hard for the casuals and thus they are special again.

[Sarnaxx]

Achilles, I would love to know how you can sit here and say this having never killed a boss in Ulduar on 10 or 25 man?

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...AFlles&gn=Aeon

Interesting opinion for someone who hasnt killed a damn thing in the latest instance...

[GAfo]

With the exception of 3 needed nerfs, aka Hodirs 2 min timer, XT's nerf and Ignis meleeing people in the pot, no other ulduar nerfs where needed.

Casual guilds were making good progress and enjoying every minute of it, hardcore were clearing it in one week and started to down the hardmodes the next reset.

Everyone had their place, casuals for the most part were happy, hardcores too. So why do they nerf it every patch while the majority of the community, hardcore+casuals where happy with Ulduar, that's whats bothering me.

Think about this, why change something which was perfectly designed for both groups of players? (excluding the 3 nerfs mentioned above)

Reason : The bads still complain. You know who you are, bad players even make casual guilds sad, cause i know most casuals i spoke to enjoyed wiping on trash even and finally killing the bosses.

Casuals+hardcores where happy, bads werent, hence the nerfs.

/endthread

Oh by the way.. Hardcore are still happy, normal raiders are still happy and casuals are happy too.
The only people that are not happy atm are the bads that feels incredibly strong and need to whine about everything even if they dont even have a clue on what they are talking about (eg. OP).

[Unicorn]

man this isnt about skill, you dont need ANY skill to play wow. pve is easy, pvp is a matter of class setup. blizzard doesnt aim for you pseudo pro gamer, they aim for YOUR MOTHER, your grandma, your sister, your girlfriend.... for every f'in casual. when do you casual whiner learn that wow is not about skill and that blizzards goal is to earn money out of as many people as possible.

now pls, look for a real game or live with the casuality in wow

of course and that is why some people with naxx 10 man gear outdmg/outheal/in other ways omgwtfpwn other ppl who have almost full ulduar 25 gear