Shadow Priest 51-talent

[darkdestiny]

Damn this thread is still going....


Conclusion- (PvP) Dispersion sucks /the end

[Nezoia]

No, Dispersion is win in the end.

People should just reroll if they can't accept it.

[darkdestiny]

People did Reroll, OP didn't like it and wanted to know what we thought as an alternative and we gave it to him. Dispersion is the worse talent blizzard came up with and arena brackets reflect this. /end of thread

[Nezoia]

Really? I think it's the best talent ever for PvE. I use it quite often.

I remember when Ice Block was a talent, lol.

[darkdestiny]

I'm glad you feel that way, but the topic was about its pvp use, not pve. I could care less about the extra mana regen it provides, OP wanted to know what alternatives we had for pvp because it isn't that great. Extra 6 secs of life doesn't really do much or make it fun.

[Nezoia]

Our PvP tree is Disciplin, and our 51 point PvP talent, Penance is overpowered

[Tablemaker]

I can still go OOM on fights like Yogg Saron, during Phase 2, since it's close to impossible to use the shadowfiend efficiently.

Yeah I try to find a tentacle with a person in it if I need the mana badly. Other than that, you're boned if you do not use Dispersion.

- Dispersion is shit in PvE, because Shadows don't need the mana, and damage reduction doesn't work

I find use for it almost every raid. There are times where Dispersion is an awesome ability that can save the use of 'fiend. Thorims Gauntlet is one. It's good for those "Oh shit" moments where your life depends on you using it. Getting in a bad Kologarn eye beam position.

It would be an awesome ability if it returned some HP. 18% total HP wouldn't be too bad. That's 50% of what it was on Beta. I cannot see why they have not even made a glyph with the option. Evocation has an awesome HP regen glyph... yet, everyone wants it on Dispersion but they are reluctant to do it.

[Nezoia]

Getting in a bad Kologarn eye beam position.

Pop dispersion while kiting the beam = free mana.

And if one multi-dot both arms, and the body, you'll possible need the mana, depending on the how good the remaining dps is.

[Tablemaker]

Yeah... I usually pop it and go down the stairs if need be.

Anytime I am in a situation where I cannot deal damage, I disperse.

[darkdestiny]

Our PvP tree is Disciplin, and our 51 point PvP talent, Penance is overpowered

Penance is awesome, wouldn't consider it OP though. And Blizzard tries to buff shadow for pvp, since people actually like pvping as shadow rather than healing all the time. I do agree discipline is the pvp tree, and no matter what blizzard does will change it. The attempt to to buff shadow (or holy for that matter) for pvp purposes was fail.

[Tablemaker]

What's left to make it viable then? You got a major upgrade to dispel protection.

Is Dispersion the only thing making Shadow not work?

I don't Arena. I only Battleground PvP... which is usually standing at a distance and nuking. I have alot of fun doing that... but I think Arena is just a pile of garbage ruining the game. Buff this... Nerf that... This is too OP in Arena but doesn't work in PvE... blah blah blah...

[Nezoia]

Change the drain mechanics back to how they were, and make Imp. Mana Burn viable for Shadow.

Along with Soul Warding, that could easily create a decent shadow PvP tree.

[Kaesebrezen]

And if one multi-dot both arms, and the body, you'll possible need the mana, depending on the how good the remaining dps is.

Multi-Dot both arms? The left is a joke to heal, killing both requires more damage then killing right an switching to kologarn.

Dispersion works fine on General Vezax.

Where? On shadow crash?
I never got any mana of Dispersion, neither do mages from Evocation, and the damage reduction doesn't work on saronite cloud.

I find use for it almost every raid. There are times where Dispersion is an awesome ability that can save the use of 'fiend. Thorims Gauntlet is one.

Why save fiend, use it in the gauntlet, and mind control a warbringer in phase 2, more damage, and raid support.

Getting in a bad Kologarn eye beam position.

Getting a bad eye beam position requires YOU to stand on the bad position, so good players won't need it there.

[Veyne]

Reading the OP, nowhere do they say discuss its use as a PvP talent. Nope, not at all. They just asked what you would rather have as a 51 point talent. This isn't EVEN a discussion ABOUT dispersion, it's a discussion about an alternative to Dispersion for a 51-point talent.

Personally, I love lolshadowblock in PvP. I can't tell you the number of times it has saved my life, plus there are several fights where I'm running my mana-pool freaking dry (like yogg-saron phase 2 and 3) where I've had to use both Shadowfiend and Dispersion as soon as they were off cooldown, timing them a minute and a half a part from each other.

However, if I could choose a different talent, I would make Dispersion a trainable ability. and remove the damage reduction. It could be immensely useful for a healing priest as well. For the 51-point talent I would make Shadowfiend a fulltime pet and scale down the mana regen (and possibly the damage a little bit, I don't know if you've noticed, but Shadowfiend hits about as hard as our dots tick (noncrit) these days). I'd also give the shadowfiend a mini-taunt for emergencies and when you kill the shadowfiend it does a Shadow Nova like ability that does damage to all targets around it. This wouldn't turn it into another pet-centric class. Unlike Warlocks and Hunters who can use their pets as tanks, this would just be a supplement to damage, like an Unholy DK. For PvP use, give the Shadowfiend a short stun or movement slowing ability as well. When there's a Shadowfiend on you in PvP, you shouldn't just shrug it off and kill it easily, it should be a pain in the ass.

Another option I thought of was to give shadowpriests a Curse of Doom like ability, but this might be homogenizing it with Warlocks a bit too much, but I like the idea. The effect would cause a debuff, maybe a slowing effect that works like the opposite of Chains of Ice (Start out at normal speed, then each second for ten seconds you lose 10% of your movement speed), when the debuff where's off it does pretty substantial damage (not too much). This would be a decent PvP ability, and it would no doubt add a little to PvE DPS (of course, bosses would probably be immune to the slowing).

Another option that I really like myself would be called something like Vampirism or Mind Link or something like that, it turns your Vampiric Embrace into a personal buff instead of a single-target debuff. While active, it causes the same effect that it would if placed on a target however it effects all of your shadow damage, including when you AoE with Mind Sear. While active it could increase your Shadow spell damage by like 5% and last for 30 seconds or so, so it'd be sorta like another DoT you'd have to refresh.

I dunno, just ideas.

[Kaesebrezen]

Personally, I love lolshadowblock in PvP. I can't tell you the number of times it has saved my life, plus there are several fights where I'm running my mana-pool freaking dry (like yogg-saron phase 2 and 3) where I've had to use both Shadowfiend and Dispersion as soon as they were off cooldown, timing them a minute and a half a part from each other.

Everybody has "several" fights, but they all just name Yogg-Saron.
I only use Dispersion on one fight in Ulduar, and thats yogg-saron, because mana can get low there, but i still would have the option to spec improved spirit tab for more mana regeneration.

You can't tell the number it saved your life? Thats just as easy to answer.
It didn't save it once, it just prolonged your death by 6 seconds.

[darkdestiny]

True but they wont, people will complain and instead they will give them a useless talent to pvp with like dispersion.....oops. I need to stop thinking out loud.... anyway. They know Spriests are having problems in the pvp area but I think they did a good job on them for pve, but the stuff they come up with for solutions are just plain dumb (except for fade breaking movement imparing effects). When they come up with something good they nerf the crap out of it without really letting priest use it to see if it really is OP or not. PTR isn't really enough time. They let DK's last so long with OP abilites (I have a DK that i raid with so im not really complaining) but to be fair they should wait a bit and see where the class ends up before they start dishing out nerfs. I would really like to pick up my priest and go shadow again for my dual spec, but I got tired of being the victim in arena cause blizzard has their head up their ass. Granted I love disc as well but shadow would also be fun (if they fix them).

[Tablemaker]

Getting a bad eye beam position requires YOU to stand on the bad position, so good players won't need it there.

*sign* Kiting the eye beams out the door and down the steps can be considered bad position because you are out of range when the beams stop. In the time that you spend running away or back to deal damage, you can disperse and gain your mana bar back.

Why save fiend, use it in the gauntlet, and mind control a warbringer in phase 2, more damage, and raid support.

Why waste it there when you can go all out in the gauntlet and then disperse to Thorims ledge and gain your mana back? You're not doing anything from the Door to Thorim's ledge... Then you can pop Shadowfiend at the start of Thorim and hopefully have it ready again near the end for added damage.

[Nezoia]

Where? On shadow crash?
I never got any mana of Dispersion, neither do mages from Evocation, and the damage reduction doesn't work on saronite cloud.

The damage reduction works fine on the Saronite Clouds. I get 7-8 stacks with Dispersion, np.

[Ruatek]

The damage reduction works fine on the Saronite Clouds. I get 7-8 stacks with Dispersion, np.

Yeap, I tried it last week. Waited till the buff went up to three and then popped it, stood at the edge to when the effect came off. Jamp out, took minimal dmg, regended in with VE during in DPS burst while in a black pool.

[Kaesebrezen]

Why waste it there when you can go all out in the gauntlet and then disperse to Thorims ledge and gain your mana back? You're not doing anything from the Door to Thorim's ledge... Then you can pop Shadowfiend at the start of Thorim and hopefully have it ready again near the end for added damage.

You skipped the "Mind-Control" part, didn't you ?
When you Mindcontrol, you won't even need the fiend in Phase 2. And you will do more damage with a Mced Add, and give your party or raid the 20% Haste buff.
So it is no waste. I use it, because i can't use it in p2.

The damage reduction works fine on the Saronite Clouds. I get 7-8 stacks with Dispersion, np.

I didn't bother testing it after 3.1.2, because it still didn't work on Ignis Pot and Kologarns arm.
But good to know, although Vezax HM doesn't have any clouds.


So i'm testing a spec without dispersion next week. and will post my results then.