I'm being traded out in my 10 man group.

[Jon]

Name something that DPS warriors bring to the raids.

Seriously retarded replys in here.

Rogue is normally 400 DPS ahead, Shaman is just behind me normally.

It's just for this one fight, but it annoys

"I play a feral druid and agree the dps is quite nice Smiley If you want to argue about bringing a buff to the raid, go arms and your trauma buffs the feral druid Smiley They don't have to use mangle and this will boost their dps quite a bit, so boot that rogue."

Also a bad excuse, Warriors still bring nothing that other classes can't already bring.

We BADLY need some raid utility, and I can't see any other way then removing there 5% crit.

You not seeing it just means you lack imagination and creativity.

And like Ghostcrawler says, asking for nerfs to other classes to buff up yours is never going to get their attention.

I'm beginning to think this is simply a l2p issue here...

[fatcamp]

Loooool, i top meters as fury. Obvious your gear isn't up for it.

then my question is. how bad is the other people in the raid? i put out around 4.5-5.5 in raids and iam around 7-9 in recount.
Then we start ulduar i were around 1-3, sure i havent get all the best loot yet, i have much to get full ulduar gear. But it seems really like blizzard hate warriors.
like for arms the only weapon that is an upgrade from naxx is Lotrafen, Spear of the Damned, there is like no weapons in ulduar that is really good for us. its most
swords in ulduar, and a arms warrior really sucks with sword. i have been thinking about to reroll to something els starting to be so tired of all the nerf to warriors etc.

[Deleted]

Make the shouts 30min buffs while not in pvp as they arent dispellable.
Let the mace, poleaxe and swordspec be one tallent that gives the same as poleaxespec or even imp it.
Make one of the new tallent to make MS and BT to reduce magical damage dealt by the encounter by lets say 5%. That would increase our damage and give us warrior a utility of our own that was realy worth it.
It should be put in the tier 2 or 3 in the furytree to make both trees use it and also skip one of the not so important stuff that just is a waste of dpstallents.

I know u all will say that warriors will be to OP. Well then its just about time.
Just face it. Warriors is one of the worst classes as dpsers atm. If u say they do insane damage thats only because the players is skilled and not because warriors is OP.

I had to quote this becuse quite frankly this was just wrong.

Weapon specs are like there are for a reason. If they merge the talents, they suddenly need to invent new talents, and the need to respec whenever you change your weapon is NOT a problem at 80, you won't be replacing your weapon every week.

If they make MS/BT reduce magical damage done by 5%, they will need to add it to another class aswell, as it would be next to a required buff for any serious raid.

Fury is right now BETTER than arms given endgame gear, and some AOE damage on the encounter, which thankfully most have.

And lastly: If a skilled player can do good and viable DPS as a warrior, they need to be tuned around that. We're not a terribly difficult class to play, so if it's tuned for people who are unable to max it, what will happen when said warrior end up in the hands of someone who can max it? Yea, we would be druids. Never fun to be overpowered.

[Saerin]

You not seeing it just means you lack imagination and creativity.

And like Ghostcrawler says, asking for nerfs to other classes to buff up yours is never going to get their attention.

I'm beginning to think this is simply a l2p issue here...

Druids have.

Innervate.
Combat res
MOTW
+5% crit

Take that 5% crit away and then Warriors are more useful and wanted for raids.

How can you not see the logic behind this, and no It's not a l2p issue, as I've stated in my previous posts I'm normally VERY high on Damage, but because I don't bring anything for hard modes in 10 mans, I'm traded out.

This entire thread was created to bring out and state the fact more clearly that WARRIORS are not bringing enough to the raid to take them over something like a DK for example, or a druid, or any other class.

I had to quote this becuse quite frankly this was just wrong.

Weapon specs are like there are for a reason. If they merge the talents, they suddenly need to invent new talents, and the need to respec whenever you change your weapon is NOT a problem at 80, you won't be replacing your weapon every week.

I disagree, when I first hit 80 I changed from Axe -> Mace -> Sword -> Axe -> Mace -> Axe -> Mace -> Axe


De-raged waraxe -> Hammer of grief -> Armageddon -> Death's bite -> Inevitable defeat -> Death's bite -> Ironsoul -> Stormedge


Over a 4 week period.

[conscript]

Although, I jumped on the band wagon and went MS...so i bring top dps to the raids...+ im the guilds only Australian...they invite me for the tokeness :P

Reminds me of my last raiding guild. We had one French guy and one Aussie just because their accents made vent fun. Making the French guy say Ricky Bobby every raid was pretty funny for awhile.

[Deleted]

I disagree, when I first hit 80 I changed from Axe -> Mace -> Sword -> Axe -> Mace -> Axe -> Mace -> Axe


De-raged waraxe -> Hammer of grief -> Armageddon -> Death's bite -> Inevitable defeat -> Death's bite -> Ironsoul -> Stormedge


Over a 4 week period.

You dissagree? Well, it's not my fault you made some bad choices regarding what is best. Death's Bite is better than Inevitable defeat, so it was a meaningless swap that can be entirely dissregarded.

Secondly, it's to save gold. It has NO effect on gameplay whatsoever, but it still causes them to invent new talents to fill out that tier in the arms tree. Do you honestly think it will happen so you can save 50g whenever you get a weapon upgrade, that may even be the same type as your previous?

It's quite frankly a silly thing to ask for, just as silly as it would be to move said merge further up the tree so Fury can reach it, thus making the fury tree require yet another nerf, due to the now obtainable 5%crit, 5% critdamage, 15% ARP, or 6% at an extra attack every 6 seconds.

I understand it can be hard to grasp, but Blizzard aren't idiots, they do have a greater understanding of their own game than you give them credit for. Weaponspecs are still around becuse merging them would require a smaller revamp of the arms tree as a whole, and they are where they are for a very specific reason: So fury can't use them.

If you think about it, it's a good thing that fury can't reach weapon specs and titans grip, becuse if they could, titans grip would probably be -15% rather than -10%, hurting scaling even more.

[Peng]

Raid comp is a part of raiding. If you are hardcore, you should understand this. If your RL believes the shaman buffing melee will outweigh the DPS difference then that's how it is. Especially if the raid doesn't have heroism/bloodlust already.

I don't see why ppl think the RL is being a jerk. He's simply trying to give the group the best chance at doing one of the harder encounters.

This!

My raid isn´t that hardcore. When we started Ulduar, we had to care a lot about the best possible setup. Now everyone in the group can bring the alt he wants to most encounters, but for Firefighter we will need to go back to the best setup again.
If we weren´t as casual as we are, we would surely have to replace players as the OT´s raidleader does. We will have a very hard time there, because we bring the friend and not the class.

[Amorac]

10: Me (Fury OR arms warrior, very good gear, most BiS gear.) OR Enhancment shaman that doesn't have all that great gear.

Reason for bringing him over me? Totems.
Yes.
Seriously.
I'm being traded out for that.

Did they tell you that flat out ?

If not, couldn't it be because you allready got the gear and they let the shaman gear up ?

[Saerin]

Did they tell you that flat out ?

If not, couldn't it be because you allready got the gear and they let the shaman gear up ?

Shaman has better gear then me.

I'm also suprised how many trolls MMOchampion has.

[Jayded1]

When people aren't welcome in raids but are #2 in dps this leads me to believe they are just really annoying and no one wants to deal with them

[rezsõ seress]

10: Me (Fury OR arms warrior, very good gear, most BiS gear.) OR Enhancment shaman that doesn't have all that great gear.

Shaman has better gear then me.

............. What?

[amk]

Hi, I've been in a 10 man group for Ulduar 10 since 4 weeks after 3.1, I've done ALL hard modes (Except 1 light in darkness, was ill.) and now since they've started on Firefighter...I'm now being traded out for anyone else...and this really REALLY sucks.

My raid leader is a nice guy, he explains things well nice guy in general, but he states that warriors just do not bring anything, and that makes them crap.

I'm being traded out for an Enhancment shaman to buff up our Rogue (Talking melee here)

So, bring the class, not the player.

Remove Leader of the pack and make Warriors the only 5% crit class, and you'd have a pretty fine reason to take a warrior...currently to my 10 man I bring battleshout, and because our talents are so poor, It's not even 5/5.

DPS is important on Firefighter, but it's not THE most important thing (this isn't Hodir). The most important facet of Firefighter is staying out of the fire. Period.

If your DPS is comparable to whatever they replaced you with, then either your Raid Leader is being silly, or there is another issue at heart - your survivability.

The only advantage a Feral Druid has over a Warrior (I've seen that comparison brought up in this thread) is that in P3 a Kitty DPS can shift into Bear Form and eat Bomb Bots. In my guild (working on P4 atm) we simply have a DK CoI the bots while ranged blow it up. A Feral who could eat them would be -easier-, but we aren't really having problems that we can't overcome.

So I can make 3 assumptions here:

1 - the OPs DPS isn't as good as what he was replaced with
2 - the OPs survivability wasn't as good as what he was replaced with
3 - the OP's Raid Leader is being foolish (not unique to any particular guild)

In the end, Warriors are fine.

[Amorac]

Shaman has better gear then me.

Ok, that's not what you said tho :-X

10: Me (Fury OR arms warrior, very good gear, most BiS gear.) OR Enhancment shaman that doesn't have all that great gear.

I'm also suprised how many trolls MMOchampion has.

Hm, about as many as any other forum I'd say.

[Svenskpally]

Make the shouts 30min buffs while not in pvp as they arent dispellable.
Let the mace, poleaxe and swordspec be one tallent that gives the same as poleaxespec or even imp it.
Make one of the new tallent to make MS and BT to reduce magical damage dealt by the encounter by lets say 5%. That would increase our damage and give us warrior a utility of our own that was realy worth it.
It should be put in the tier 2 or 3 in the furytree to make both trees use it and also skip one of the not so important stuff that just is a waste of dpstallents.

I know u all will say that warriors will be to OP. Well then its just about time.
Just face it. Warriors is one of the worst classes as dpsers atm. If u say they do insane damage thats only because the players is skilled and not because warriors is OP.

Armswarrs do insane dmg.. have 1 myself whit crap gear (green and bluequestreward + some HC blues) and he is doing well over 1600 dps with just BS on Hc dummy. In good gear and raid buffed they should do veryhigh dps. And about warrs that to high dmg being skilled.... I am one of the worst warrs everseen :P and it dose not take alot to dps with arms specc..

[Darkspectre]

1: Warrior tank
2: Druid tank ( Feral on this fight, and doing of course, doing stupid amounts of DPS.)
3: Rogue
4: Hunter (With +10%ap aura)
5: Elemental shaman
6: Holy priest
7: Resto druid
8: Mage
9: Ret paladin/Holy Pala (Dual specced, equal amounts of gear, all Tier 8 etc.)
10: Me (Fury OR arms warrior, very good gear, most BiS gear.) OR Enhancment shaman that doesn't have all that great gear.

so basically your RL is an idiot for having an ele sham in there at all. The ele sham's buffs only matter to the mage and himself, where as you have alot more melee that would benefit more from having an enhance sham. if anything, he should have just swapped shams.

[ezay]

Hi, I've been in a 10 man group for Ulduar 10 since 4 weeks after 3.1, I've done ALL hard modes (Except 1 light in darkness, was ill.) and now since they've started on Firefighter...I'm now being traded out for anyone else...and this really REALLY sucks.

My raid leader is a nice guy, he explains things well nice guy in general, but he states that warriors just do not bring anything, and that makes them crap.

I'm being traded out for an Enhancment shaman to buff up our Rogue (Talking melee here)

So, bring the class, not the player.

Remove Leader of the pack and make Warriors the only 5% crit class, and you'd have a pretty fine reason to take a warrior...currently to my 10 man I bring battleshout, and because our talents are so poor, It's not even 5/5.

They said "bring the class". Never "bring the spec".

/thread

[Genitorturer]

Why isn't the rogue replaced instead?

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