1. #1

    Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    So I was asked to heal General Vezax in Ulduar 10 the other day, and man do I hate that fight as a healer. No mana, except what I can get from puddles of green vomit on the ground is not my idea of fun....

    ... so I decided to see if I could think of another way around it. This is what I came up with.


    This build was made with the idea of healing ONE PERSON- the tank on the general Vezax encounter.
    There are a lot of CRAP talents for healing in the ret tree, which is why nobody would ever spec this way except for select certain situations that required 'Out of the box' thinking.

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...&version=10048

    Basically, here's what I'm thinking. Now, mind you, I'm main spec RET so I really don't think much in healing circles and such....but this is the idea I had.

    First, by judging with this build, I get back 1100 mana every 8 seconds....minus the cost of the seal which is around 200, thats a net gain of 900 man every 8 seconds....about the time it takes to cast 3 flash of lights...which mana totals to be near 900 with seal of wisdom glyph. So, almost free flash of lights.

    Second, with Sheath of Light, I gain a heal over time, which if I crit with a holy light, will tick for around 2600 in my current gear, and around 900 with a flash of light. Especially with the flash of light, which when the target has sacred shield on them increases my chance to crit with flash of light by 50%....that puts me at about 85% crit chance self buffed only.

    Third, this build requires that the healer be within melee range of Vezax in order to use judgement. What this does is prevents the healer from ever getting hit with Shadow Crash or Mark of the Faceless except in the odd occasion where a puddle would be needed.


    I tested the new Sacred Shield on the ptr with this build....and my flash of light would put up 2 different heal over times if my FoL crit....which is pretty good imo. Also, I had another pally hit me with flash of light while i had SS up....and his FOL put that double hot up on me, and it STACKS.

    I'm posting this, aware I'm gonna get flamed, but if you read it all....its for ONE fight. My guild is not as far along as I'm sure yours is, you who are about to flame....I'm just trying to come up with a way to make a boss that has given us some problems a little bit easier. (Yes, we have downed him. But, he is still not easy from a healer point of view.)

    Anyone ever think to try this?
    "With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. "

  2. #2

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    What you posted was similar to one of the more popular Healing pvp specs that was used to ruin arenas last season. When you cast Judgements of the Wise on Vezax you get a 15 second debuff on you that reduces all healing done by 75 or 90% I believe. Blizzard wanted to make managing mana difficult on this fight so they nerfed your idea specifically, otherwise Paladins would be OP on this fight.

  3. #3

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    As a palading on 10vezax your main focus will be healing during surges. If you have a resto druid this will be even easier, a disc priest on top of that makes normal mode cake and hard...well its still hard but with a different healing set up it would be harder. If you are not doing hard mode than mana will not be a problem, just make sure your dps is solid so you can kill him before clouds need popping. Time your heals correctly and use beacon wisely when you get mana.

    Edit: Crazy yes, stupid not really but it wouldnt do much good for you.
    "This one time, I died and lost all my lifes in Mario. It's not fair because I should be able to save the princess too." -Offhand

  4. #4

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    Yo dawg, i heard you liek ret heals so you used a build we tried a while back for our first kill, so you can heal while you fight!

    Problem with this build however; the heals were so low that our main tank healer was bottom on healing charts. He was barely able to keep the MT up due to the lack of oomph behind his healspams. Staying holy and standing in saronite is still the best way, sorry :|
    BY SARONITE BE PURGED!
    I have... 80 rogue. 2 80 DK's. 80 Shaman. 4 80's makes me pro amirite?

  5. #5

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    we did vezax hard mode 10 man with a resto shaman a druid healer and me as enhacement shaman dropping mw 5 heals on the mt when it was needed untill the add spawned, then i focused on dps and the 2 healers used their almost full mana pool.
    enhacement shamans dont get any kind of debuff while using stormstrike or shamanistic rage and even our heals arent to strong i get 5 mw charges every ~5 sec, and if u get good dps having 1 person not dpsing at 100% is not a problem, vezax was around 10 % right before saronite animus spawned

    when the fight ended i had something around 300 k healing done 28 interrupts and 3.5k dps or something

  6. #6

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    Yo dawg, I heard you like retribution so I put some holy in your ret so you can heal while you're healin!

  7. #7
    High Overlord Silorn's Avatar
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    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    When you cast Judgements of the Wise on Vezax you get a 15 second debuff on you that reduces all healing done by 75 or 90% I believe.
    Almost correct, when you have judgements of the wise *In Your Spec* during the fight, you will gain an aura called Corrupted wisdom during the fight, doubling the mana you gain from judgements of the wise but reducing your healing by 90% (Meaning by speccing for this you will do little or no effective healing)

    The spec I have been thinking of for the hard mode of vezax is: http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...&version=10048

    With this spec basically you'd be getting huge flash of light crits required for keeping the tank up, alot of extra mitigation for the tank and of course alot of extra survivability, and since spiritual attunement still gives mana back during the fight (its one thing they cant block because its the only thing that can let prot paladins tank it) the extra damage from the marks/early shadow crashes (since late ones will probably kill you) to keep your mana up for the entire fight.

  8. #8

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    Quote Originally Posted by wrathdragon
    Third, this build requires that the healer be within melee range of Vezax in order to use judgement. What this does is prevents the healer from ever getting hit with Shadow Crash or Mark of the Faceless except in the odd occasion where a puddle would be needed.
    Being in melee range makes your heals almost useless i don't recall exactly how it works and the exact values but i remember that melee DPSers would only heal for about 10% of what they should, that's exactly to prevent ret paladins and enhancement shamans to be the ones healing here.

  9. #9

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    Quote Originally Posted by Kduruh
    Being in melee range makes your heals almost useless i don't recall exactly how it works and the exact values but i remember that melee DPSers would only heal for about 10% of what they should, that's exactly to prevent ret paladins and enhancement shamans to be the ones healing here.
    read what the above poster said about corrupted wisdom, enhacement shamans can help healing on this encounter with no problem,

    also our druid tree is usually meleing into vezax trying to get a omen of clarity proc if he is really low on mana

  10. #10

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    for 10 man hard-mode the best spec is probably going to be a TbtL spec:

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...&version=10048

    the reason being you will only have 1 tank you are healing the entire time and this gets the most out of you FoLs. you should never shock and definitely not HL. we generally use 3 healers: pally/disc priest/drood, although it can probably be 2 healed without too much of a problem. 10 man is a joke.

    for 25 man it's probably best to go 51/20/0 primarily for beacon during the animus phase.

    as a holy paladin you should also try to grab the t8 4pb. it's incredibly helpful on this fight. also you should be in melee range (behind the boss of course). this does NOT decrease your healing b/c you don't have JotW. just make sure you have enough ppl range of the boss (3 ppl in the 10 man, can't member for 25 man) or he will crash/faceless the melee.

    also, on this fight you want to sit and melee the boss till your tank gets hit before you cast FoL. depending on the HoTs/shields and other healers you may even want to wait until he gets hit a 2nd time in some cases. all depends. all in all this is a fairly easy fight for a holy paladin. you just need to have ranged dps not be idiots and you should be able to get him on farm quickly.

  11. #11

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    I heal vezax as prot healer. 14k flash of lights is amazing.

  12. #12

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    Best way is to have a Ret Paladin and Enhancement shaman in the raid

    Make the enhancement shaman use his maelstrom proc ONLY when the tank has taken damage

    Try and spec for the divine guardian; it will REALLY help during the add phase, 2 "raid wall" is pretty much instant win.

    Just make sure you're ranged dont fail in shadow crashes.

    Also its 10 people who need to be at range in 25man.

    My guild has now done 10man HM with a paladin and a warrior tank, so a DK is definitely not needed.

    sometimes when the add spawns he bugs and his surge does not reset, and other times it does. best for the tank to use a CD here if possible (or a pain supression from a priest if threat is good enough)

    we had our holy paladin and disc priest 2 heal this just fine..

  13. #13

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    I find this thread interesting and wanted to share an idea I came up with. As a protection warrior, I could charge away with intervene during surge. I could use my normal charge after that on a saronite gem to get even further away from him. That way, I dont have to use cooldowns and healers wont have to heal me.

    If I think more about it, I could use a sprinting potion and a hunter could use aspect of the cheetah to run with me. This could mean that I can kite him through the whole room, using charges, sprinting potion and with the help of the hunter.

    The main problem would probably be threat, since I cant build threat if I kite him. After a few taunts, he will get tauntimmune but maybe the hunter could misdirect when that occurs. I dont know if that is possible if he is tauntimmune.

  14. #14

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    Quote Originally Posted by Razhir
    I find this thread interesting and wanted to share an idea I came up with. As a protection warrior, I could charge away with intervene during surge. I could use my normal charge after that on a saronite gem to get even further away from him. That way, I dont have to use cooldowns and healers wont have to heal me.

    If I think more about it, I could use a sprinting potion and a hunter could use aspect of the cheetah to run with me. This could mean that I can kite him through the whole room, using charges, sprinting potion and with the help of the hunter.

    The main problem would probably be threat, since I cant build threat if I kite him. After a few taunts, he will get tauntimmune but maybe the hunter could misdirect when that occurs. I dont know if that is possible if he is tauntimmune.
    He's always taunt immune. Threat isn't a problem really, at least it shouldn't. The main issue is, when running, melee dps may have problems to interrupt.

  15. #15

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    As a druid in 10m hard I pretty much just sit under vez with the melee and attack, heal with clearcast heals while the priest main heals, and when the other dude pops out I take over main heals and I'm pretty much at full mana at that point, pretty easy.

  16. #16

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    This isn't really handy. I understand that those whole 2-3 helpful things to heals in the Ret Tree sound nice to have, but it's not worth tossing out Holy Shock, Infusion of Light, the Spell haste from judging, or other things that'd make it easier to heal.
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    I asked all of my friends and they all agreed with me that [cataclysm feature] is as [opinion] as it is possible to be.
    Blizzard are so [opinion], what [compliment/insult]s they all are!

    There, now we can stop posting new topics in the Cataclysm forum altogether.
    And if you disagree with me you're an [insult].

  17. #17
    Deleted

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    Quote Originally Posted by Silorn
    Almost correct, when you have judgements of the wise *In Your Spec* during the fight, you will gain an aura called Corrupted wisdom during the fight, doubling the mana you gain from judgements of the wise but reducing your healing by 90% (Meaning by speccing for this you will do little or no effective healing)

    The spec I have been thinking of for the hard mode of vezax is: http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...&version=10048

    With this spec basically you'd be getting huge flash of light crits required for keeping the tank up, alot of extra mitigation for the tank and of course alot of extra survivability, and since spiritual attunement still gives mana back during the fight (its one thing they cant block because its the only thing that can let prot paladins tank it) the extra damage from the marks/early shadow crashes (since late ones will probably kill you) to keep your mana up for the entire fight.
    you have the same spec as the OP (sort of, but your spec is holy/retri combo, you mean holy/prot combo).

    maybe a mistake?

  18. #18

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    They caught this possible "clever use of game mechanics" on the PTR and "corrupted wisdom" or some such was implemented.

    They should caught enh shamans imp stormstrike as well.

  19. #19

    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    Aha, well I am glad i mentioned it here before trying it on Vezax tonite. I think the prot/holy build will be the best one for this fight then, since the sheer size of those FoL crits are enough to make me drool LOL.
    "With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. "

  20. #20
    High Overlord Silorn's Avatar
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    Re: Healing VEZAX- a crazy and prolly stupid idea

    you have the same spec as the OP (sort of, but your spec is holy/retri combo, you mean holy/prot combo).

    maybe a mistake?
    Yeah, don't know why it came out that way O.o Correct link : http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...&version=10048

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