Holy Paladin PvE Healing

[darthceltic]

if you don't HL spam, u should try a little haste over crit.

Int pt for pt will still be best stat in 3.2, but u need the others too. Just like a ret pally needs strength as best stat, but that doesn't mean u don't need hit cap, exp cap, and some crit on your gear to be good.

same with us, if 2 pieces of gear are =, one has 5 more mp5 and one has 3 more int, the int one will be the best choice., but u still need haste, crit, mp5, and even spellpower.

At the end of nax it was to the pt i could spam HL the entire fight not going oom. It was hard to get back to using my brain and using all my spells in ulduar but i did it, and we are easily downing normal content and getting some of the hard modes.

last night i had 506 flash, 328 HL and almost = % of healing done between the 2 in the fights we did.

[FiveDkp]

mp5 will be number 1 stat next patch with the increase to all mp5 on gear and wth the nerfs to illumination and Divine int, sp and haste will out weight int.

Are you drunk or something
Int still owns SP and Haste.
Afaik - DPS =/= Healing.
If you are going to go to a HL build. You won't need to gem for haste as all your gear should have it. Not to mention you get 23% haste from raid buffs.

[Brabun]

It's simply amazing how people quote being able to "spam HL" with DP and stuff after being told that this won't be HL spam as you will cut your HPS in half...

If you want to get only that much HPS, you'll be just fine spamming FoL (without a single DP), and you'll be able to sustain it much, much longer.

And there's no point in trying to mock me, really. HL spam, under the definition above, is not possible. Simply that. You're welcome to prove otherwise by naming a realm, a character and a time when you'll demonstrate your uberness.

[darthceltic]

with only one DP linked to AWrath i could spam a long, long time in nax. i had 4 piece, glyph of wisdom, libram to reduce, and almost all int gems. with all that you are getting like near 80% mana back with every crit and i had some full 25 nax clears where i had 54% HL crit. u'd have to look at some old, old pre ulduar web stats, but it was there. without 4 set, and not using glyph of wisdom i can't anymore. ulduar gear is not set up for HL spam unless u gimp your stats with worse gear like the JC trinket and stuff.

[Sergille]

So, can anyone post priority for stats in 3.2?

[Xern]

It's simply amazing how people quote being able to "spam HL" with DP and stuff after being told that this won't be HL spam as you will cut your HPS in half...

If you want to get only that much HPS, you'll be just fine spamming FoL (without a single DP), and you'll be able to sustain it much, much longer.

And there's no point in trying to mock me, really. HL spam, under the definition above, is not possible. Simply that. You're welcome to prove otherwise by naming a realm, a character and a time when you'll demonstrate your uberness.

I managed it quite fine on algalon 10man , using zero (0) flash of lights and only using DP during the big bang (And once with wings before the first big bang) , I had roughly 10k mana left when he died.

Just for the sake of it I have 30179 mana unbuffed, and about 37k~ buffed using distilled wisdom

But if you honestly don't see that as HL spamming (DP'ing during big bangs meaning no HPS loss due to not healing anyways) then yeah , I dont know what to say

[Caean]

I currently have a max int set and an mp5 set and in my mp5 set (which uses no int gems in any capacity) and full25 man raid buffed I still have 27k mana, easily enough to spam HL if need be.

also, I can still use DP even when I stack mp5, please, l2play

Not really the point.

If you're going to say mp5 is the most important stat, how the heck are you going to even have a 27k mana pool to begin with?

Are you going to get your 27k mana from mp5 or haste or sp?

No, it's coming from int. Our most important stat.

I know how to play quite well, but perhaps you should learn where mana comes from.

Hint: It's not mp5.

[FiveDkp]

It's simply amazing how people quote being able to "spam HL" with DP and stuff after being told that this won't be HL spam as you will cut your HPS in half...

If you want to get only that much HPS, you'll be just fine spamming FoL (without a single DP), and you'll be able to sustain it much, much longer.

And there's no point in trying to mock me, really. HL spam, under the definition above, is not possible. Simply that. You're welcome to prove otherwise by naming a realm, a character and a time when you'll demonstrate your uberness.

Ironically, 50% healing reduced HL heals more than a FoL.
Sad but true.

Unless you are a prot/holy with TobL (My spec next patch)

[Maaya]

Get some decent gear and check Ulduar 25 HMs. Then you'll be able to judge if HL is that crap.

If you don't have a clue about stopcasting and mana conserve... try asking for innervate :

[FiveDkp]

Get some decent gear and check Ulduar 25 HMs. Then you'll be able to judge if HL is that crap.

If you don't have a clue about stopcasting and mana conserve... try asking for innervate :

Cancel-casting is a relic of the past. You can not afford to do that on tank healing intensive fights, Rest its fine.

[Maaya]

Cancel-casting is a relic of the past. You can not afford to do that on tank healing intensive fights, Rest its fine.

Vezax

[FiveDkp]

Vezax

Vezax isn't a tank healing intensive fight.
It just tells the healer to play reactive
Note what i said, Not on tank intensive healing fights.

[Maaya]

Ask Saronite Animus if it is intensive or not TT

[Accuser.]

Ironically, 50% healing reduced HL heals more than a FoL.
Sad but true.

Unless you are a prot/holy with TobL (My spec next patch)

I'm open to innovative new ideas... stack 100% spellpower/crit, bust holy lights on the melee group to heal the beacon for 140% of your HL, keep DP up almost all the time and melee something every 15 seconds?

[Kendaus]

Ask Saronite Animus if it is intensive or not TT

This! When you are the loan healer (minus Hots) until Animus pops... you'll soon become familiar with the 'relic of the past'.

[Caean]

This! When you are the loan healer (minus Hots) until Animus pops... you'll soon become familiar with the 'relic of the past'.

Which makes the point perfectly -- anyone tied to one way of healing is going to find himself at a disadvantage.

You always have to be looking to try new things when appropriate, while digging up the old when necessary, and hanging onto what works best at the moment.

[Rurikar]

3.1 Raid Buffed
35k Mana
40% Crit
250 mp5
Cost of Holy Light: 1102 (Glyph + Libram)
Mana back from Illumination: 764.4 per Holylight
Avg Cost of Holy Light with DI: 759.8
Cast Time: 1.75
Mana back from Replinishment: 87.5 per second or 5250 per minute
Mana back from Mp5: 5000 per minute


Total Mana in a 3 minute Fight: 73.55k = 35k+ 4.3k (Mana Pot) + 7.8k (Divinity Glyph) + 15.75k (Replinishment) + 15.k (Mp5)
Total Mana in a 5 minute Fight 98.35k = 35k+ 4.3k (Mana Pot) + 7.8k (Divinity Glyph) + 26.25k (Replinishment) + 25k (Mp5)
Total Mana in a 10 Minute Fight: 149.6k = 35k+ 4.3k (Mana Pot) + 7.8k (Divinity Glyph) + 52.5k (Replinishment) +50k (Mp5)

Total Mana Cost to Spam HL for 1 minutes: 26k
Total Mana Cost to Spam HL for 3 minutes: 78k
Total Mana Cost to Spam HL for 5 minutes: 130k
Total Mana Cost to Spam HL for 10 minutes: 260k


You can spam HL none stop for 3 minutes unassisted.
You can spam HL none stop for 5 minutes if you are given an Innervate.
You cannot spam HL none stop for 10 minutes.




3.1 Raid Buffed
33.3k Mana (Losing 5% Int)
40% Crit
400 mp5 (Counting Wisdom/Totem btw)
Cost of Holy Light: 1102 (Glyph + Libram)
Mana back from Illumination: 382.2 per Holylight
Avg Cost of Holy Light with DI: 949.12
Cast Time: 1.75
Mana back from Replinishment: 66.5 per second or 3990 per minute
Mana back from Mp5: 8000 per minute


Total Mana in a 3 minute Fight: 81.4k = 33.3k+ 4.3k (Mana Pot) + 7.8k (Divinity Glyph) + 12k (Replinishment) + 32k (Mp5)
Total Mana in a 5 minute Fight 105.4k = 33.3k+ 4.3k (Mana Pot) + 7.8k (Divinity Glyph) + 20k (Replinishment) + 40k (Mp5)
Total Mana in a 10 Minute Fight: 165.4k = 33.3k+ 4.3k (Mana Pot) + 7.8k (Divinity Glyph) + 40k (Replinishment) + 80k (Mp5)

Total Mana Cost to Spam HL for 1 minutes: 32k
Total Mana Cost to Spam HL for 3 minutes: 96k
Total Mana Cost to Spam HL for 5 minutes: 160k
Total Mana Cost to Spam HL for 10 minutes: 320k


You can spam HL none stop for 3 minutes with an innervate.
You cannot spam HL none stop for 5 minutes.
You cannot spam HL none stop for 10 minutes.



Conclusion: 3.1 spamming HL is not only possible but makes sense. If you been clearing content without using HL like it's your job I feel bad for your raid because with a bit of micro on your mana and proper DP/Innverates you can easily push 5 minute fights and in 10 minute fights you would simply need to hold back. In 3.2 crit becomes less of a powerful stat for Paladins but Mp5 starts to become a real powerhouse. 500 mp5 from gear would mean 10k Mana per minute which with the nerf to replishment might mean stacking for Int might not be a sure fire way to win anymore. 1600 Mp5 would be enough to allow you to spam HL endlessly if you still maintained 40% crit. Overall though it's mostly coming up just the way Blizzard wants, a balance of Int and Mp5.

[Firecrest]

How are you going from 250 mp5 to 400 mp5? From my understanding, the mp5 buff is only 25% on items. This means that your raid buffed 250 mp5 includes 110 mp5 from BoW and that the number being increased by 25% is actually only 140. 25% of that is only 35. So you'll go up from 250 mp5 to 285 mp5.


Edit:
Actually. It looks like you figured Mana Spring Totem in there too. That's 91 mp5. Meaning that your base mp5 from items is only 49 and that your increase after the patch should be 25% of that. That works out to a total new mp5 of 262.25. Far far less than 400.

[darthceltic]

and u really only have 49mp5 from items? wow. hope that's just an example.

as far as a holy pally needing to spam hl non stop in a raid and calling for an inervate, lolzzzzzzzz. i'd be laughed out of vent being a pally calling for an inverate.

save that for the shammies or something. if u cant dp/wrath macro, pot, or stop hl for 4-5 cooldowns with flash, or have mana tide in your group, your raid, and u, are horribad.

[Dualkalibur]

500 mp5 from gear would mean 10k Mana per minute which with the nerf to replishment might mean stacking for Int might not be a sure fire way to win anymore. 1600 Mp5 would be enough to allow you to spam HL endlessly if you still maintained 40% crit. Overall though it's mostly coming up just the way Blizzard wants, a balance of Int and Mp5.

500 mp5= 12 ticks per minute. 60/5=12. 500x12=6000. Not 10000.

And I don't see Divine Plea factored into your math at all.... 25% of your mana over 15 seconds every minute.

35k mana: 8750 mana each minute.
DP mana in 3 minutes: 26250
DP mana in 5 minutes: 43750
DP mana in 10 minutes: 87500

Also, your math is horribly wrong. Situation 1, 250 MP5 is 250x12=3000 mana per minute, not 5000.
Situation 2, 400 mp5 is 400x12=4800 not 8000.