Healing Prot Hurting Tanking Prot.

[Xthform]

My bad I thought he was referring to holy pallies it's not terribly hard to keep a prot pally from hitting something to refresh divine plea though, I mean pallies are well known for there inability to close in to kiters.

[LeyLey]

My bad I thought he was referring to holy pallies it's not terribly hard to keep a prot pally from hitting something to refresh divine plea though, I mean pallies are well known for there inability to close in to kiters.

Healing prot pallies, in an arena are plenty hard to get away from, especially with a DK snaring you, and a stun etc, and it doesn't matter if you make one fall off, since they have dumb mana efficiency even without it, (though not OP) but just getting two or three refreshes in an entire match is enough to make them not run out of mana before my priest runs out of mana, has to use shadowfiend, OH WAIT IT HAS NO MAGIC RESIST ANYMORE, SO IT GETS STUNNED OR CHAINS OF ICED, and by the time I spam dispel on it, new chains of ice, or they're behind los and it can't teleport, and the 15 second duration is over and I got no mana.

or even better, its a pally war, and the war just uses his fear and its undispellable for 10/15 seconds.


Thats the difference, priests are able to be killed rather easily, and can run out of mana aswell, and our mana return mechanics are easily countered.

Prot Healers aren't easy to be killed, nearly impossible to be switch to, and can't run out of mana, and mana return mechanics aren't easily countered.

[Chimpzilla]

Besides, Spell damage doesn't even exist anymore, it's all spell power.

Spell damage still exists. Maybe you just play one class, but go take a look at moonkins. Then take a look at improved moonkin form. Spirit is converted into spell damage. I'd happily take a screen shot of my character screen showing the difference in damage and healing.

[Accuser.]

Prot Healers aren't easy to be killed, nearly impossible to be switch to, and can't run out of mana, and mana return mechanics aren't easily countered.

Prot healers are very different than any other healer in the game, which is why I love it. Much more like paladin healing in TBC imo. Shhh... keep it a secret, but the way to kill a prot pally ISNT to mana burn him, or to wail on him constantly with a ret paladin! You have to interrupt the heals, or slow his cast time! If you put pressure on the prot pally with interrupts, they will have to drop Divine Plea themselves to keep the heals strong enough to stay up!

Obviously this is a completely different breed of healer than a resto druid or disc priest, not more difficult to kill, just has to be tackled in a different way.

Holy is just too pitiful in 2v2 or open BG combat to stay up, which is why prot-healing is being played. Btw, I think the mana burn argument is pretty weak... what does a holy pally have to beat mana burn? You plea, try to keep your partner up through -50% healing, plea is dispelled, mana burned to 0%, gg. LoS the priest you say? Oh, the holy paladin should put HoTs on his partner and then stay LoS of the priest, right? Compare that to resto druids that can pop hots on their partner, LoS for the duration of Innervate, and be right back in the healing game.

Prot healing exists because holy is weak as hell in pvp.

[Tyneside]

Prot healers are very different than any other healer in the game, which is why I love it. Much more like paladin healing in TBC imo. Shhh... keep it a secret, but the way to kill a prot pally ISNT to mana burn him, or to wail on him constantly with a ret paladin! You have to interrupt the heals, or slow his cast time! If you put pressure on the prot pally with interrupts, they will have to drop Divine Plea themselves to keep the heals strong enough to stay up!

So true. CS, Kick, FoK, Strangulate, Mind Freeze, Spell Lock, Pummel, HoJ, Bash, Maim, Feral Charge, and the list goes on and on. There is just so much you can do to stop a cast. Use it.

[erwin121]

We all know about this gimmick spec the arena has spawned. Paladins speccing deep prot with a little holy and wearing full holy gear they have the defenses and life of a prot pally but heal as well as a holy pally (minus having an insta heal). What I've been fearing is that blizz is going to punish tanking prot while trying to solve this gimmick spec. I see no logical way they could fix the problem by toying with the holy tree so the only thing they could do would be to remove the benefits the prot tree to make it less appealing.

I just wanna get an idea about how everyone else feels about the spec and whether you think its going to have a negative effect on the prot pallies who actually do what prot is intended for.


~~Hugs and Kisses~~
Noochie

Well they shouldnt be able to heal without a proper holy spec, i dont have a clue about the paladin trees tho, but they could make all the heals less effective unless they got a few talents lower in the holy tree.

Edit: by reading an above post i think prot healing isnt that good afteral, since prot healers are way more vaulnerable to interupts then holy healers.

[Accuser.]

Well they shouldnt be able to heal without a proper holy spec, i dont have a clue about the paladin trees tho, but they could make all the heals less effective unless they got a few talents lower in the holy tree.

>

Should priests not be able to heal unless they're in Holy spec? Of course not, holy is a crappy spec for most PvP situations... Oh wait, that sounds like exactly what I'm saying about paladins. Playing a holy paladin in PvP is a lot like playing a holy priest in PvP, it's just not built for it very well. Prot-healing is our Discipline spec. It's more vulnerable to some situations (interrupts) but is a lot tougher overall, without nearly the healing capacity of the holy tree (missing instant 5k shocks, 15% haste and Beacon).

[LeyLey]

Prot healers are very different than any other healer in the game, which is why I love it. Much more like paladin healing in TBC imo. Shhh... keep it a secret, but the way to kill a prot pally ISNT to mana burn him, or to wail on him constantly with a ret paladin! You have to interrupt the heals, or slow his cast time! If you put pressure on the prot pally with interrupts, they will have to drop Divine Plea themselves to keep the heals strong enough to stay up!

Obviously this is a completely different breed of healer than a resto druid or disc priest, not more difficult to kill, just has to be tackled in a different way.

Holy is just too pitiful in 2v2 or open BG combat to stay up, which is why prot-healing is being played. Btw, I think the mana burn argument is pretty weak... what does a holy pally have to beat mana burn? You plea, try to keep your partner up through -50% healing, plea is dispelled, mana burned to 0%, gg. LoS the priest you say? Oh, the holy paladin should put HoTs on his partner and then stay LoS of the priest, right? Compare that to resto druids that can pop hots on their partner, LoS for the duration of Innervate, and be right back in the healing game.

Prot healing exists because holy is weak as hell in pvp.

Yup, because EVERY COMP has an short interrupt or a cast time slow, yup. EVERY COMP. Wait, no they don't.

And yes, I am a 5 season gladiator priest, I understand not to mana burn a prot pally, my point is that priests are balanced around mana burn, we have shit mana efficiency and run out of mana extremely fast to balance the fact we have mana burn, the problem is mana burn is useless against any class except priest, and especially prot pallies, so we have shit mana efficiency for no reason.

I run out of mana in about 2 minutes, while a prot pally can chill with 100% mana, so our only choice is to burst down a prot pally or a DK, its not going to happen, sorry, maybe you should try getting good or playing at a higher rating, prot pallies are rediculous.

even without infinite divine plea, mana burning a pally is a dumb choice, you'll go oom before him, so what do you need to counter mana burn? Nothing, just play a pally.

[LeyLey]

>

Should priests not be able to heal unless they're in Holy spec? Of course not, holy is a crappy spec for most PvP situations... Oh wait, that sounds like exactly what I'm saying about paladins. Playing a holy paladin in PvP is a lot like playing a holy priest in PvP, it's just not built for it very well. Prot-healing is our Discipline spec. It's more vulnerable to some situations (interrupts) but is a lot tougher overall, without nearly the healing capacity of the holy tree (missing instant 5k shocks, 15% haste and Beacon).

Wrong, disc is balanced around being a healing tree, prot is balanced around being a tanking tree, I could understand if it was MADE TO BE THAT WAY, but its just abusing mechanics made to make tanking easier, sorry.

[Accuser.]

It's not "abusing mechanics", it's using available spells and abilities, which are functioning in the way they were intended, in a creative way.

The fact is, Blizzard has done a terrible job of making Holy Paladins viable in both PvE and PvP with the same spec. I mean, Sacred Cleansing? Has anyone seen a team over 1500 rating spec into that? Beacon looks great! Oh wait, I just spent 1000 mana on it and it got dispelled.

The reason that Bliz hasnt changed healing prot is because it's a creative solution to a problem they couldnt fix. If Holy were viable, no one would make the major sacrifices to healing ability that are required to spec for the durability of prot.

[Tyneside]

Yup, because EVERY COMP has an short interrupt or a cast time slow, yup. EVERY COMP. Wait, no they don't.

And yes, I am a 5 season gladiator priest, I understand not to mana burn a prot pally, my point is that priests are balanced around mana burn, we have shit mana efficiency and run out of mana extremely fast to balance the fact we have mana burn, the problem is mana burn is useless against any class except priest, and especially prot pallies, so we have shit mana efficiency for no reason.

I run out of mana in about 2 minutes, while a prot pally can chill with 100% mana, so our only choice is to burst down a prot pally or a DK, its not going to happen, sorry, maybe you should try getting good or playing at a higher rating, prot pallies are rediculous.

even without infinite divine plea, mana burning a pally is a dumb choice, you'll go oom before him, so what do you need to counter mana burn? Nothing, just play a pally.

So... you have a comp that can't beat another comp? What's the problem?

Dear Devs,
Rock is OP. Paper is fine.
Love,
Scissor.

Their comp struggles with groups who can interrupt. Your comp struggles with groups who NEED to be interrupted. Other groups struggle with living long enough for a priest to go OOM. Do you understand how this works?

[Heywes]

9k FoL ftw
16k FoL raid buffed.

Our healing paladin uses Prot/holy for his healing spec in pve. Never goes oom and spams like crazy. Its pretty funny.

Chron, didn't blizz make a post about changing spell power on plate?

[LeyLey]

So... you have a comp that can't beat another comp? What's the problem?

Dear Devs,
Rock is OP. Paper is fine.
Love,
Scissor.

Their comp struggles with groups who can interrupt. Your comp struggles with groups who NEED to be interrupted. Other groups struggle with living long enough for a priest to go OOM. Do you understand how this works?

Yeah, being the top comp and having it easy as fuck with like 50% of the arena teams running the same healer, I'm sorry, must be so diffucult.

[Tyneside]

Yeah, being the top comp and having it easy as fuck with like 50% of the arena teams running the same healer, I'm sorry, must be so diffucult.

There is ALWAYS a top comp, and it is judged by a ton of different factors, not the least of which is what the most common MID RANGE comp. If everyone is rolling a comp there will be a spike in whatever combats it most easily, as well as a very fast rise in the ratings of those teams.

If, say, there is a comp that is especially difficult to defeat without certain things (CC/Interrupts), there will be a spike in groups that have those things.

You rolled a priest. Disc was awesome for a while, still pretty good for a lot of reasons, but you can't always be #1. Quitcherbitchin.

[Skiball]

I disagree very much with Chronalis. Prot healing, while fun, is not nearly as good as holy for pvp. Holy shock is just so important as most casted heals are interrupted. Not to mention the insance haste buffs and instant flashes provided by holy.

I find actual damage prot with the avenegr's shield glyph and some gear swapping actually is more badass pvp than healing is.

However, putting a dot effect in the ret talent and a 30% increased heal talent in prot while NOTHING for holy is retarded, always had been.

If your that angry at prot healing because of how effective it is (even though I think it has been overstated), then SPEC IT. All paladins can, it isn't some super tank secret that only tanks can spec. Nothing is stopping you so complaining just sounds like whining instead of contructive criticism.

Holy Shock + instant flashes + large amounts of free haste rock for sticky spots.

[FiveDkp]

Thats why Beacon healing now heals the Beacon for 100% of the heal and not just the efficient heal.

Ronark, You know i'm a pretty good holy pally.
But yeah, This beacon buff is really just a gimmick. If you use beacon smartly then you wouldn't need it. Beacon will still be overhealing your beacon target and also still has its lag component on it.
The Prot Holy spec combined with t9 4 set means.....
30k heal over 12 seconds because of a 15k crit
Now tell me this, Would you go for some shitty beacon while spamming Holy Light and evantually ooming
OR
Spam your tank with big FoLs, use DF to generate a big Hot then raid heal, have SA, Rarely oom...

Touched by the Light gives more spellpower than the Int version of it and you can get high stam easily .
Pretty much gem all spellpower and get the meta. Spell power trinkets etc. Also you buff sanc if u dont have a prot pally >.>

^ TALKING ABOUT PVE NOT PVP.

P.S - Sorry to all the prot tanks in advance, Its not that we like to jump onto every fotm spec, its because the fact Holy isn't that great.

[Jackielope]

If anything, using a prot heal spec would make Blizz want to rebalance paladins in general (which they do need to do admittedly).

Honestly though, any spec of any class with any gear will have its weakness(es). Use that weakness instead of whining about it.

Holy does have its uses, but with Paladins it comes down to "How much bang can I get out of what crappy stuff we have to begin with?" That's where the TbtL spec comes from, since when used right the benefits it gives outweighs the cons of not having the Holy stuff.