Why "let every one see the content is bad"

[Wiltor]

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After I thought about it, the reason hardmodes aren't apealing to most hardcores is that in the past when you did a very hard boss you were rewarded with the ability to SEE new content.
It wasn't just the loot, but it was the fact that finally you defeted boss X and you can move foward and see boss Y.
This was the bigest reward.
Sure algalon was a boss you could see, but you needed to kill 5 hard bosses to unlock 1 boss that you can see 1 hr per week.
As for the hardmode loot its BAD because of the epic inflation i just spoke about.

I liked this post and I agree, I am not a noob I am good enough to do all the "hard modes" out there! After you clear the instance on regular your still fighting the same bosses just doing some things different. There is no new content or bosses after you kill these guys on "hard mode" and your doing this for what? a drake? a mount? a title? a tiny upgrade piece of gear you don't even need to kill the encounter(if you were one of those guys that killed kael pre-nerf etc)?

Edit: Your now getting like what... 20 titles and 25 mounts per patch?

Patch 3.3 inside info:

The ability to wear 5 titles and ride 3 mounts at the same time!!!

[Tapairu]

omg its a game wtf u act like its life and life isnt good enough wow is fine just quit and walk away..

[ultimateman]

WOW. This thread is STILL goin? Must be a real slow news month.

Guys, face it. You're burning out on WoW. Its not even the matter of how good the old days were. The Good Ole days are a lie. The truth is you have been served sweet succulent Steak every day for the past 5 years. Sure, its the tastiest thing you've ever sunk your teeth into and it smells a hell of a lot better than most other things... but its still Steak. After 5 years of steak, you don't mind trying other foods out.

Bliz can't be anything but prime cut steak. If you've eaten steak for many years running and need a break, take one. Don't invest 300 days played in a character and then complain that the game went stale on ya. Its your responsiblity to game wisely and take breaks.

Don't diss the game because you don't know when to say when :P

QFT…I always LOL at people who quit WoW and are so short-sighted that the only thing they can think of is “The game has changed for the worse. The game is the problem. I am just the same as I was before, a completely objective participant who sees the light.” They always automatically assume that what they feel must be true and that most people who play WoW must feel the same way.

Really…grow a brain. The game has continued to get better and better for 5 years now. Blizzard has done an admirable job of keeping millions of gamers hooked for an inordinate amount of time. Is the game perfect? No game is. But keep in mind, this is one post on one thread among HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS, all about the same game. Blizzard is obviously doing a lot of things right.
So after 1,2,3,4, or even 5 years…you’ve finally grown bored with this game. WEIRD. Must be something wrong with the game. Can’t be you, can it? Nope. There’s something wrong with the game, and all 11 million people who play it.

[veemon_ro]

You do realize between BT and Sunwell was 10 months right? So waiting 6 months for content is something you should be use to

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First of all thats the longest time in the history of the game during wich there was no new content. So giving it as an example is very poor.
Usually there were 6 months breaks between patches give or take a month or two.
Finally alot of guilds were not even in bt back then so you had a lot to look up to (ssk/tk/mh before even thinking of bt) in fact thats the reason it kept alot of people going as you allways had more content to do.
Right now the instances they make can be finished in 4 weeks at most, and then you can either start on hard modes or just get bored and farm same content over and over.

ZA was in the middle of that yeah, but the gear was weaker than BT's.

Who cares what gear it had? It was fun and an awesome instance. You could allways get the bear as well and some of the items were better then bt btw.

So for the point of progressiosn sake, it doesnt really count. And then LK didnt come out for 7 months after Sunwell came out. So tahts 7 months with the same content. So that arguement is really lackluster.

Sunwell was one of the hardest instances in the game. Even for the best guilds it took more then 2 months to clear it.
So its no excuse when we got 6 months in wotlk with just nax and then 4 months with ulduar. Again i could of waited 2-3 months for an ajzol nerub raid instead of this crap they pulled out.

And there is already another thread debating the amount of 'content' between TBC and LK. It came to the conclusion there is roughly 11 (I cant recall exactly, but i believe it was something like 51TBC vs 40LK bosses) more bosses in TBC than in LK currently. Thats NOT counting Icecrown.

Yeah you know why?! because they added 10 man bosses to that as well. That's really bshit considering that its still the same boss, its not a diferent encounter.
A person who knows the 25 man tactics will know the 10 man and viceversa with very very few exceptions.
Wotlk has half the bosses tbc has (not counting icecrown) and most of the bosses in wotlk are remakes of vanila (nax)

But you know what? lets give you this one and say wotlk has 10x more bosses then tbc. Since when is quantity > quality?
Try counting the memorable bosses from tbc the ones that people will allways remember compared to wotlk who has what? maybe mimiron and yog?! and they hardly compare with big dudes like kaelthas or vashj.

TBC was out for roughly 21 months before LK came out. For 51 bosses. Thats roughly ~2.43bosses per month.
LK has been out for roughly 10 months. For 40 bosses. Thats roughly ~4bosses per month.

40? where do you get that number. and even if they were cause i cba to count now, again quantity does not mean quality.

Which is making content faster? (Thats even if you discredit that all raids can now be done 10/25 man, vs the only content FORCING 10 man groups for half of tier4)

Of course im discrediting it. Its not a new experience like going from ssc to za. Its the same instance




[/quote]

[veemon_ro]

Again for the ones who go hardmodes is content...you do realise if it was true and blizz would just keep ulduar and making a hardmode to the hardmode and keep doing this strategy you would eventually get bored. No matter if the bosses would actually get harder and harder right?

Secondly, I have said this before and I will say it again.

In TBC and Vanilla people would start an instance, lets say SSC. And they would want to see VASHJ.
But in order to do this they would have to kill every boss.
They would start out with facerolling bosses like lurker hydross etc.
Eventually they would even reach harder and more annoying bosses like morogrim that would probably whipe the raid for few days to some mediocre guilds.
Now why would they keep trying? To get loot? To get achievment? No. They would try to unlock the next boss and get to SEE vashj.
That was the reward of doing a hard boss you would get to SEE more content.
Eventually you would reach vashj wich was hard as hell for the first time. But when you kill her and you kill kael as well you get to SEE mount hyjall and black temple.

Now a days whats the reward for a hard mode? You get an epic wich is easily replaced by the next instance.
You already saw all the bosses so you don't get anything new.
Mount and a title..big whoop.

And while you might say..well I like hard modes they're awesome. There can be 5 people in your guild who don't think like that so they cba about them.


[

QFT…I always LOL at people who quit WoW and are so short-sighted that the only thing they can think of is “The game has changed for the worse. The game is the problem. I am just the same as I was before, a completely objective participant who sees the light.” They always automatically assume that what they feel must be true and that most people who play WoW must feel the same way.

Lets see. In tbc I had to log on, do my dailies, grind some rep for some factions, grind some mats to make a craftable for myself.
I could do some instances with some alts, maybe a kara badge run.

Now a days what to do? I don't need rep nax 10 gives better loot. Don't need 5 mans, voa and nax 10 gives better loot. Don't need mats for craftables since there aren't any that are better then what loliseum drops...err...yeah the game hasn't changed you're right its 100% the same its just me geting burned out.

Really…grow a brain. The game has continued to get better and better for 5 years now. Blizzard has done an admirable job of keeping millions of gamers hooked for an inordinate amount of time.

I dunno, the old carrot on a stick worked well for 4 years. Don't let people see the end game content and make sure that if they do see it there will be more content added.
At the moment its let every one see the content so they end up with nothing to do till next patch.

So after 1,2,3,4, or even 5 years…you’ve finally grown bored with this game. WEIRD. Must be something wrong with the game. Can’t be you, can it? Nope. There’s something wrong with the game, and all 11 million people who play it.

You see I don't get this. One week before wotlk I just killed killjaden...Damn was awesome.
I was incredibly excited about it in fact I even got drunk.
Then i started lvling, the quests were awesome, excitment leveld peeked even further.
Then I cleared nax in t6 and excitment started droping. Three weeks later and excitment droped like a stone while random tards were telling me to do 10 man 3d on the forums, when i have already did 25 man 3d....so yeah.

Obviously its me geting burned out.

[Safiro]

the hard content is yet to come...


i hope..

[ultimateman]

lol You quoted several of the things i said yet did not manage to prove your point at all. All you did was continue to complain about several aspects of the game that have been improved since BC. Basically you're saying "Oh noes! I've run out of stuff to do."

More or less, you're saying that because there is nothing left for you to conquer in raiding, there is nothing for you to do in game. Keep in mind that millions of people play this game everyday and most of their time in game is not spent raiding. There are soooooo many things to do now at level 80 as compared to level 60 or 70. If you don't like doing any of those things, fine. But stop acting like the entire game occurs in the microcosm of raids.

[Aùssa02]

the hard content is yet to come...


i hope..

and your hope will be swept away by the mighty nerfbat of blizzard.. sad but true is what says most about wow as it is right now imo...

Sad but true..

[Wiltor]

lol You quoted several of the things i said yet did not manage to prove your point at all. All you did was continue to complain about several aspects of the game that have been "improved" since BC. Basically you're saying "Oh noes! I've run out of stuff to do."

Wrong choice of words there...

WTFO you noob keyboard turner/clicker that couldn't kill vash/kael!

[ultimateman]

Wrong choice of words there...

WTFO you noob keyboard turner/clicker that couldn't kill vash/kael!

You assume that I'm a noob keyboard turner/clicker because I think the game has been improved by allowing more people to see raid content? Ok bra. Makes alot of sense.

[Advent]

Someone lock this topic already!

[Gron]

Actually I think forums exist for people to discuss things.

I am really happy none of the bullshit - as seen in other threads happened here. Its more like arguments coming up. Its good to see some other views too - e.g. some people finding current raiding system good.

I still think the validity of this post is there - "why let everyone see the content is bad because it will push Blizzard to the lowest common denominator, that is the worst player in the history of WOW so he can see the content".

This F***S up those people who are intelligent and loved to spend time in the game - and could find the right challenges (e.g. in the many raids in BC).

Anubarak - he was wasted in a 72 instance

Why is that then? Maybe Blizzard doesn't know its own lore? Makes a level 5 instance for level 72's to roflstomp on such big and powerful creature? Then they are surprised that some people ask for more creativity in a major content patch then to recolor Anub'Arak who has already been wasten 100's of times? Oh wait, it all started with recoloring Naxxramas...

This is one of the reasons why many old time players are shocked. We got used to more content, better content. Maybe class balance in PVP is better. I have to agree that quests in WOTLK are the best I have seen in WOW so far. But I spend most of my time raiding, and I am struggling to find good excuses for the lack of effort Blizzard invests in raiding instances.

[veemon_ro]

lol You quoted several of the things i said yet did not manage to prove your point at all. All you did was continue to complain about several aspects of the game that have been improved since BC. Basically you're saying "Oh noes! I've run out of stuff to do."

If you read my posts I specificly said that any one who clears ulduar NORMAL mode, runs out of stuff to do OUTSIDE raiding.
So please feel free to explain, what is there to do outside raids, when you are full t8.5 (wich you can get in 2-3 weeks) after clearing ulduar.
And the only thing you can say is pvp don't cha?

More or less, you're saying that because there is nothing left for you to conquer in raiding, there is nothing for you to do in game. Keep in mind that millions of people play this game everyday and most of their time in game is not spent raiding. There are soooooo many things to do now at level 80 as compared to level 60 or 70.

Suuuure m8 sure.
In vanilla at lvl 60 i spent 1 month to get all the BLUE gear required for raiding.
In TBC i spent over 1 month and even more to get all the craftables possible and all the epics from heroics.
To get atuned for karazhan.
To get reputation up with various factions so that I may get even more gear.
To get my rep up with aldor/scryer to get enchants.
To grind monney for said enchants and to buy a flying mount.
And only then did i start raiding, and once I did I still had stuff to do outside it like
-Grind monney for consumables oil, food, flask
-Grind even more monney for repair bills
-Grind mats for craftables belt of blasting etc.
And every time I made an alt i would have to go through the same process again. Now lets compare with vanilla shall we?

Dinging 80 in wotlk.
-You can jump right in to nax 10 with other people who just dinged 80 to get gear
-You can do voa
-You can do the new 5 man heroic
(This will take 1-2 weeks to get you geared up for ulduar)
-You need to do the sons of hodir (again around 2 weeks)
-You dont need faction rep
-you dont need to grind gold since the raid has fish feast and oil has been removed from the game. The monney you get from sons of hodir can get you flasks.
-You dont need to get atunments
-you dont need to get craftables.

Again please tell me how is MORE things to do in wotlk then tbc and vanilla? Either you didn't play tbc or vanilla, or you just jumped in a casual guild who didn't care if you didn't have enchants/top notch heroic gear and bosted you in kara or , no one in your guild had any enchants heroics and you didn't get very far anyway (prolly tk and ssc didnt kill vashj or kael) and then went to mh bt when they opend up.
This is just speculation not flaming, but please feel free to correct me if im wrong and you did have the best craftable gear and best enchants in slot before you started raiding. But personally if you did that, i dont see how you can say theres more to do in wotlk...

If you don't like doing any of those things, fine. But stop acting like the entire game occurs in the microcosm of raids.

It shouldnt. But as I pointed out there is nothing else to do outside raids. There are no goals set like there used to be in vanilla and tbc

[Malania]

Well a raider would grind rep for the helm enchants just like you had to for TBC factions. A none raider would use the gear you can get from factions. Just because it's stat balanced around Naxx 10 gear. And theres the plans and patterns held by each faction.

There was a need to grind rep, however the only thing a raider needed was the enchant so you could stop at Revered.

Anyone remember back in TBC, where EVERY druid grinded CE for weeks for http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29171

Even raiders grinded it =) So back in TBC there was more of a need to grind rep and that was a grind. None of this championing shit.

Ah great days lol

[veemon_ro]

Well a raider would grind rep for the helm enchants just like you had to for TBC factions. A none raider would use the gear you can get from factions. Just because it's stat balanced around Naxx 10 gear. And theres the plans and patterns held by each faction.

There was a need to grind rep, however the only thing a raider needed was the enchant so you could stop at Revered.

Anyone remember back in TBC, where EVERY druid grinded CE for weeks for http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29171

Even raiders grinded it =) So back in TBC there was more of a need to grind rep and that was a grind. None of this championing shit.

Ah great days lol

While i agree there was too much grinding, it should of been slightly reduced not completly removed. The point is back then you could log on at any hr of the day and have something to do if you wanted to play.
How ever if i log online right now, I wouldn't have anything to do what so ever

[Malania]

I don't agree with that. By the time Black Temple was released the only faction I wasn't exalted with was Honour Hold, for obvious reasons. (It was a bitch to get a group for). I had netherdrake etc... I had my epic flying. In fact I spent 90% of my time when not raiding flying in circles over Shattrath. In Wrath I spend most of my time running in circles in Dalaran. Not a great deal has changed for me =)

There was as much to do in TBC as there was in Wrath and the only thing thats made it any easier is the Championing.

[Malania]

Well, I don't know where the claim comes from that Blizzard actually said "Hardmodes are new content"?

Hardmode is obviously the same boss, graphics, encounter with a different mechanic. I see it this way: In BT days we killed Illidan for about 3 months in the same old way. While our gear got better and better and our tactics became more refined. In the end, we just steamrolled BT in one raidnight of 4 hours (and there were even folks who could do it in under 90 minutes)

A hardmode would have allowed us a different challenge (yes, to an existing encounter) with better loot (hell..an upgraded dropchance of the warglaives to 10% already would have been nice. We never ever got even one.

That is how I see hardmodes. 10 months of same old BT before sunwell was released. I bet more ppl would have apprechiated even a slight challenge

As to what I can do if I log on tonight. Well, veemoon_ro - you find nothing to do. I will be doing my AT dailies, running a daily heroic, doing Ulduar 25 and Colliseum 25 sunday, monday, tuesday and Ulduar 10 with Algalon wednesdays on friday. We are helping fellow guildies to get the 310% mount. Thursday is my Naxx 10 alt run for badges. All this takes place in 2-4 hours. Time in which I normally would have watched TV...or followed another hobby.

So..I enjoy that aspect of the game..you have cleared all content that you enjoyed and it bores you now. Fair enough.

As for rep grind. Revered with a faction of your choice for a head enchant...I like this system - expecially since I grinded my AD rep to exhalted with a million of cauldron runs and never got my epic CC items from Silithus and AQ 20 runs, because either rep, or the token or the scarabs or some other shit was missing.

So - we differ here. I have done the old rep grind and I consider I have suffered through it the hardcore way. And it didn't stuck to me as something I need to repeat

Sucks to be you, we got 3 glaives in our first 4 kills. 1 Complete set in 2 weeks solid =)

[Malania]

Hehe..you don't know how much it sucks to be me. Playing a warlock. Skull of Guldan dropped on first kill. Goes to a mage who quits the raidgroup the day after and that damn thing never dropped again. I left BT with 700 dkp or some shit because that was ALL I ever needed from there in the end :/

Only being able to get rep from dungeons that were tied to a faction and needed to be run on heroic? Oh how I hated that.

Especially since my alchemy alt then needed Shatar revered to get the alchemy trinket and that in turn was needed to buy the one from Shattered sun. So it was rep of one faction that build on the rep of another faction.

No way I need that agin...and I never considered myself casual ^^

Haha, well our final run of BT before Wrath was released. Black Bow of the Betrayer finally drops. Now our Hunter CL has a shedton more DKP than me so I have no chance but its the last run so he's like "OK, well since its the last we'll roll." I roll like 10 and he's like 80. So its >< *sigh*

"OK Mal, since your roll's are as fail as your DPS best of 3"

20 lost 70 won 2 lost

"Yoink, unlucky Mal"

......I FUCKING HATE THIS GAME ><

And thus, was Black Temple finished for Mal.

The End