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  1. #41

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Quote Originally Posted by Alenko
    Replinishment works off of mp5 now not int, fyi. I dont know if priests have a int -> mp5 talent but saying that int is the superior stat for the sole reason you have replinishment isn't fully correct.
    Care to share with the rest of the class where you found this information? Cause everywhere I look, its 1% of MAX MANA every 5 seconds. (or .20 every second)

  2. #42
    Dreadlord
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    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Quote Originally Posted by Alenko
    Replinishment works off of mp5 now not int, fyi. I dont know if priests have a int -> mp5 talent but saying that int is the superior stat for the sole reason you have replinishment isn't fully correct.
    No.

    Replenishment restores a percentage of your maximum mana. Intellect increases the size of your mana pool; MP5 does not. Ergo, Replenishment works off of Intellect not MP5. The only thing that has changed with Replenishment is the amount it returns; the source has not changed since 3.0 implemented it.

    Also, Intellect isn't the best regen stat just because of Replenishment. It also feeds into your Spirit regen, as well as benefiting other maximum mana based regen abilities such as Hymn of Hope and Shadowfiend.

  3. #43

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Well, vasyl83, for starters, you're in the 13 point greater heal talent trap. Dropping Improved Healing to pick up that last point in Improved Renew, and Healing Focus would be a great start.

    Sure, as a Holy Priest, I still cast Greater Heal (most of the time in 5's, occasionally in 10's, rarely in 25's but it happens). But for how frequently it is, and required, there are better gains to be had elsewhere. Healing Focus might not seem mandatory, but a perfect example is on Hodir. Losing up-to a second of cast time of Prayer (or worse, half your bar on Divine Hymn) when the entire raid is taking damage isn't a good idea, and if you have a Paladin with Concentration Aura, you lose no cast time at all. I'll get back to Improved Renew.


    Another thing, you taking less damage means less mana you spend on yourself and on heavy hitting incoming raid-wide "fire", Spell Warding (instead of Divine Fury) makes you alot less of the "omg squishy healer" that everyone knows the priest to be.

    Empowered Healing has been proven to be better off when it's dropped, netting you gains by picking up Blessed Resilience (3% on all heals), and that's a decent place to put them. I personally don't like the talent myself, but it works. Drop those 5, and max out either Test of Faith (a full 12% when you need it, which is quite frequently, in all honesty) and either a) Blessed Resilience, or b) Body&Soul and Desperate Prayer (or lightwell).

    Now, looking at this, in your head, you think "but my flash heal is nerfed now!" and your Greater Heal is slower, and heals for less, and "that nub told me to put more points into Renew? why?"

    Renew is the new Flash Heal. It's instant cast, can be cast on the move, and given Twin Disciplines, Improved Renew, Empowered Renew and optionally the Glyph of Renew, it's a very very powerful staple. Costs the same amount of mana that a Flash Heal does, and assuming your raid knows how to use HoTs (zomg that person is missing 4k, I better snipe that heal before the druids' Rejuv ticks again!)... it can also put out a lot more effective healing in the thoroughput version.

    Learning when to use renew, and when to use Flash heal will help keep other people alive better, but be slower on the Serendipity stacks, so pick up a couple haste peices, which I then tested with Divine Fury on Greater Heal. With DF and Sx3, I was at a 1.35 second cast, without DF, that same cast with three stacks was roughly 1.6, so 5 talent points for 0.3sec off a spell I rarely cast? It's great for solo and PvP, but outside of that, meh.

    Your meta bothers me, but that's because I'm so attuned to the Insightful Earthseige meta as anybody else, and couldn't bear to lose it. Your cloak enchant should change to 23 haste rating, and your wrists should swap over to Spellpower, and grab the 30 spellpower on your gloves.

    Realistically, if mana's not a problem like you say it is, you may want to drop a couple crit pieces for more haste, and swap your sustainability trinkets for thoroughput.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
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  4. #44
    Scarab Lord Izenhart's Avatar
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    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Quote Originally Posted by [-Spiritus-
    ]

    In short, I was wrong. Glyphed HN is a superior throughput spell for your party from a theorycraft perspective.
    And there shouldn't have been any doubts on that, too.

    Holy Nova is clearly better than PoH for your party, first because the heals that come with it are way more efficient than a PoH, since HN has less healing than a PoH, this means that you can use it at 70-80% of your party's health while fully using its efficiency, when for PoH you'd just have to wait more to land it, or land it earlier with an higher amount of OH.

  5. #45

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Quote Originally Posted by Izenhart
    And there shouldn't have been any doubts on that, too.

    Holy Nova is clearly better than PoH for your party, first because the heals that come with it are way more efficient than a PoH, since HN has less healing than a PoH, this means that you can use it at 70-80% of your party's health while fully using its efficiency, when for PoH you'd just have to wait more to land it, or land it earlier with an higher amount of OH.
    When it became the glyph of choice for fights like Firefighter, you can kinda see why they nerfed it a bit.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
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  6. #46

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Quote Originally Posted by Smoopie
    Please don't ever PI yourself, please don't have a haste trinket either.

    DO cast pw:s for borrowed time before a PoH though
    Think about the context in which this thread was created for. In 5 mans, I rarely have casters in my group, even more rarely do I find casters WORTHY of my PI. I'm not giving a shitty mage with >2000 dps my PI so he can maybe pull 2500 for 15 seconds, if he's lucky.

    And in this particular case, if the group is dying, even IF the mage was rocking 4k dps in this 5 man, the extra 20% haste to the mage wouldnt out-weigh the benefit of giving it to yourself if you need it to keep the group up.

    I've had several occurances where the haste was very useful in 'oh shit' situations. The mana cost is also a nice added bonus for severe aoe healing needs when the group is lacking alternative mana regen sources. (Oh man you feel it when there is no replenishment, no paladin for wisdom/kings, or no shaman for mana spring!) And yes, I've been in groups like that.

    I will agree on having a haste trinket being stupid.
    HOWEVER
    This priest is holy, so all of this is Off-Topic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Izenhart
    And there shouldn't have been any doubts on that, too.

    Holy Nova is clearly better than PoH for your party, first because the heals that come with it are way more efficient than a PoH, since HN has less healing than a PoH, this means that you can use it at 70-80% of your party's health while fully using its efficiency, when for PoH you'd just have to wait more to land it, or land it earlier with an higher amount of OH.
    I love Holy Nova! Even without the glyph, I love jumping in circles healing these Lolheroics with it. I've had it be my #1 heal in a full strat run, that was done in probably 15 minutes. It was awesome, not to mention the added damage I'm throwing around to make it go that much faster.

  7. #47

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Quote Originally Posted by Firegod1385
    I do have to ask though, If his FH was HITTING for more than yours CRIT... He'd have to be hitting for over 6k, because with your spellpower you should easily be able to crit for that much. I'd then have to ask (just to make sure) are you sure you are using rank 11 of flash heal?


    As you can see, low...

    BUT!



    You were right, my spells were DOWN RANKED! ALL THIS TIME! WHAT THE....

    OMG... this is gonna change things lol!

  8. #48

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Well I must admit that I am face-palming now.

    You managed to successfully heal through the three faction champions with those downranked FH??? Actually forget this question since you might not be using FH much at the time...

    Your FH at 4k is still a bit low unless u don't have empowered healing or other related talents. Either that or your spellpower is drastically low. Low as in someone who heals in pvp gear. I usually Flash Heal at 5.1 to 5.4k

    I am curious at to how did you have downranked spells on your hotkeys in the first place??

    Also wondering how the fact that your spell was downranked never came to your mind.
    I mean how can you flash heal for 2.5kish and not be surprised about it? When you see a 2.5k flash heal, downranking should have instantly came to your mind, but it didnt.

    Holy spec isn't always the best, I was in a "healing war" (2 priests healing each other until there's no mana) and I got completly destroyed by a discipline priest. and I got completly destroyed by a discipline priest. His non-crit FH was bigger than my critted FH! He casted faster, had more crit then I, he healed for longer... damn! I looked at his gear, he had slightly better, but wow still.
    So you got destroyed by a disc priest in a war with flash heals....instead of a "WTF" response, your response to this was "holy isnt always the best"

    Just pure flash heal spamming Holy beats Disc in output. Not counting shields etc. Therefore...

    judging from this, you didnt seem surprised at the fact that a disc FH has beaten a crit holy FH in terms of output.... you were more surprised as to why such minor gear difference could mean such a huge output difference. It seems that you came to the REALISATION that a disc priest flash heal is better than the holy version. (a false realisation btw). Of course the above comment was just an assumption. But still doesnt the fact that his normal FH heals more than your CRIT VERSION tell you anything at all?
    wow..lol

    A knowledgeable priest would KNOW that disc flash heals is never higher than holy flash heals of the same rank.


    Also how long have you played your priest? how long have you been healing with those 2.5k flash heals? I mean the fact that a 2.5k flash heal didnt surprise you, the fact that you have downranked spells on your bar, the fact that you were unaware of them, and also the fact that you dont have much clue about the healing output differences between disc and holy... it all adds up to one thing.
    Well my advice atm is to go and check to see if any other spells on your bar is also downranked. Change all downranked spells to its maximum rank and try healing again. You'll do a lot better

  9. #49

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    First, I never thought I would have downranked spells unto my bars... and don't ask me why/how it was like that, I got no idea! Now everything is at max, ofc I took care of it.

    Yes, healing all heroics were pretty much easy even with downranked spells. I got nothing to say about that.

    I am NOT a noob, just never thought it would get downrank... I've been playing since the beta days of wow in 2004, so like you I was quite surprised by that! i never CARED to play discipline, hence my "amazement" of disc healing. But I knew it was different healing, just never got in a "healing fight" with a disc priest, that's all.

    I'm currently in a Naxx10 raid, 2 healers, and I'm beating our top holy pally, so it's going ok... just need to get another try at reg ToC, then we'll see how it goes from there.

  10. #50

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Zsune, my disc priest's flash heals toss out more than mine do, but I don't take Empowered Healing, and he (being disc) hits the regen "cap" sooner and can start gemming raw SP before me.
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  11. #51

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Quote Originally Posted by zsun
    Just pure flash heal spamming Holy beats Disc in output. Not counting shields etc. Therefore...
    He did put a shield on myself to get those higher-than-me FHs... maybe that's why he's pretty much doing the same FHs than I'm doing now. (shielded target gets bonus to heal, or something like that?)

  12. #52

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Not unless he had 4piece T-8. However, he does get 9% bonus healing from x3 grace and extra crit from the WS debuff.

  13. #53

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    Quote Originally Posted by [-Spiritus-
    ]
    Not unless he had 4piece T-8. However, he does get 9% bonus healing from x3 grace and extra crit from the WS debuff.
    And extra crit, should the target be low on health.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
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  14. #54

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    yeah true, I suppose you have proven me wrong in regards to the fact that disc flash heal can sometimes surpass holy in terms of raw numbers...

    But the point here is the fact that how can you play a priest to lvl80 WITHOUT knowing that 2.5k flash heals is downranked (at level 80), especially coming from a holy priest?

    For me if one day I see that my skills (whether healing skills or dps skills) isnt putting out high enough numbers...then:

    If the numbers are only a little bit lower (~5% - 10%) then I would first check if I had the right gear set and if i do i check my spell rank.
    If the numbers are a substantially lower (~20%) then I would first check to see if I am in a different spec, ie holy and not shadow, and if I am in the correct spec then I would check my spell rank
    If the numbers are heavily lower (~40%) then I would immediately check if I am using the correct spell rank.

    Quote Originally Posted by Firegod1385
    I do have to ask though, If his FH was HITTING for more than yours CRIT... He'd have to be hitting for over 6k, because with your spellpower you should easily be able to crit for that much. I'd then have to ask (just to make sure) are you sure you are using rank 11 of flash heal?
    Quote Originally Posted by DiGG
    You were right, my spells were DOWN RANKED! ALL THIS TIME! WHAT THE.... Shocked

    OMG... this is gonna change things lol!
    So before you read this post by firegod, I assume you've always used that downranked flash heal in your heroics and Naxx10 raids... well I suppose they are easy and you can still get away with it but yeah...



  15. #55

    Re: Geared healer can't heal

    I don't know DiGG's history. But I DO know what could cause you to have incorrect skills on your bars.
    Dual spec.

    There's a current issue (which is more of an inconvience, than a bug or anything like that)

    But if you are dual specced, lets say for this example, Shadow - Disc.

    You leveled up in Shadow spec. You went to the trainer, bought all your skills. It will replace all your newly upgraded skills on your SHADOW SPECS BARS ONLY. So when you switch over to Disc, you still have Rank10 flash heal on your bar as opposed to rank 11. I've noticed this before when leveling up my shaman, it was throwing me for a loop several times.

    I just know that it has happened to me, hence why I asked. I don't know if thats what happened to you or not, as well. I dont know you.

    This should substationally help your healing abilities as disc, seeing a 40% increase in your flash heals alone should help alot. Glad we could be some of assistance. And let us know how your next ToC goes

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