The direction of the shadow priest

[Peppercat]

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...as&n=Peppercat

Again I don't think we'll ever top meters in serious content, but my guild's top casters are equally geared and I have no problem keeping up.

We are definitely NOT mid Ulduar.

Do we scale equally? Absolutely not, and we won't see anything change as far as our damage is concerned until Cataclysm. Half of the problem is in our talent tree, the other half is the very solid class mechanic built around our spell priority, which locks us out of ever having any type of 'Nuke'. Once they implement the talent changes in Cata, I hope to see builds and talaents that scale through end game content like Mage/warlcok trees.

But again, just my little ol' opinion.

<3Pepper.

[Strykzor]

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...as&n=Peppercat

Nice Haste gems.

Again I don't think we'll ever top meters in serious content, but my guild's top casters are equally geared and I have no problem keeping up.

Spriests are last on DPS. If you are doing roughly the same DPS as other people in your raid, they suck.

Do we scale equally? Absolutely not, and we won't see anything change as far as our damage is concerned until Cataclysm. Half of the problem is in our talent tree

1. Reinforces my above point we dont scale yet we can contend with good dps classes? riiiiight.
2. Our talent tree is solid except for a few things, namely Dispersion and Twisted faith.

the other half is the very solid class mechanic built around our spell priority, which locks us out of ever having any type of 'Nuke'.

What mechanic? Our Direct damage spells suck.
Dont need a nuke to be comparable on damage.

Once they implement the talent changes in Cata, I hope to see builds and talents that scale through end game content like Mage/warlock trees.

If i wanted to play a mage/warlock, i would roll a mage or a warlock.

<3Pepper.

:

[Nd]

I don't understand anyone who makes Priest in order to dps. Priests are for healing silly. You don't see rogues rolling to heal now do you?

[syanid]

Of course you do, ones with your attitude get to sprint and bandage the raid! Not like you're better for anything else, so better make yourself useful

[gaymer77]

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...as&n=Peppercat

Again I don't think we'll ever top meters in serious content, but my guild's top casters are equally geared and I have no problem keeping up.

We are definitely NOT mid Ulduar.

No offense but you're also not doing most of the harder hardmodes in Ulduar & judging from your achievements, you're not doing H ToC either. There's a difference between normal modes (or the easier hardmodes) of Ulduar and the "real" hardmodes and H ToC. Also why on earth are you well over 100 over hit cap and stacking a few haste gems? Haste doesn't start benefiting us until you have enough to get 3 full mindflays before mindblast is off CD which I'm sure you're far from that.

[gaymer77]

I don't understand anyone who makes Priest in order to dps. Priests are for healing silly. You don't see rogues rolling to heal now do you?

Priests USED TO BE a healing class. Infact they were THE healer you went to on either faction during classic WoW. For a good majority of BC it was the same way. The problem is priests started getting left behind when Blizzard decided to buff every other healing class to be far superior to a priest. Its also the reason why the best raid spec for a healing priest is no longer holy but disc for the mitigation. Blizzard just keeps fuckin over this class in every aspect. They buff us in shadow & we all start getting happy. Then when the patch goes live we realize how much more they buffed the other classes so OUR buff makes it look like we got nerfed instead since our dmg output is once again lower than other dmg casters (yes run-on sentance ftl). Its one thing to hear Blizzard say how we're going to get buffed & when we look at our own personal dmg output increase to be happy. Its another to compare our new dmg output and the rest of the dmg casters only to see yet again we got the shaft.

If you have been playing since pre-BC you would fully understand how much we've been nerfed or ninja nerfed (us buffed but other classes buffed way more than us).

[syanid]

Why do you bother to answer to a troll? He posted his shit here and left, classic case of a retard.

[Peppercat]

No offense but you're also not doing most of the harder hardmodes in Ulduar & judging from your achievements, you're not doing H ToC either. There's a difference between normal modes (or the easier hardmodes) of Ulduar and the "real" hardmodes and H ToC. Also why on earth are you well over 100 over hit cap and stacking a few haste gems? Haste doesn't start benefiting us until you have enough to get 3 full mindflays before mindblast is off CD which I'm sure you're far from that.

I'm reitemizing as we are doing ToC HM's and finishing up Vez and Yogg HM's.

And I'm right under the haste soft cap, which is why I'm stacking the way I do, again I average about 6k atm, just clipping the third MF.

And I never said I was topping meters; I said I had no problem keeping up. There is a big difference.

[Uggrukor]

If you think a Priest is nerfed and unacceptable to play, you are so very very wrong. As a Shaman I have 3 heals, a HoT and Earth Shield. Priests have Shield, PoM, PoH, Binding Heal, Flash Heal, Heal (which sucks), GHeal, Renew, Circle, Penance, and tank cooldowns for each spec. I also bet I am missing a heal somewhere in there.

Go cry some more about how Priests suck. Any competent priest is INVALUABLE to a raid.

[fabian]

If you think a Priest is nerfed and unacceptable to play, you are so very very wrong. As a Shaman I have 3 heals, a HoT and Earth Shield. Priests have Shield, PoM, PoH, Binding Heal, Flash Heal, Heal (which sucks), GHeal, Renew, Circle, Penance, and tank cooldowns for each spec. I also bet I am missing a heal somewhere in there.

Go cry some more about how Priests suck. Any competent priest is INVALUABLE to a raid.

Read the title? This is not about healing priests its about shadow(dps) priests. So you're the one that is very, very wrong.

[Kalakukko]

If you think a Priest is nerfed and unacceptable to play, you are so very very wrong. As a Shaman I have 3 heals, a HoT and Earth Shield. Priests have Shield, PoM, PoH, Binding Heal, Flash Heal, Heal (which sucks), GHeal, Renew, Circle, Penance, and tank cooldowns for each spec. I also bet I am missing a heal somewhere in there.

Go cry some more about how Priests suck. Any competent priest is INVALUABLE to a raid.

What the hell?

[Raunyc]

If you think a Priest is nerfed and unacceptable to play, you are so very very wrong. As a Shaman I have 3 heals, a HoT and Earth Shield. Priests have Shield, PoM, PoH, Binding Heal, Flash Heal, Heal (which sucks), GHeal, Renew, Circle, Penance, and tank cooldowns for each spec. I also bet I am missing a heal somewhere in there.

Go cry some more about how Priests suck. Any competent priest is INVALUABLE to a raid.

Oh thank god someone could clarify my usefulness!!

Seriously, did you read any post in this thread, or the title for that matter?

As for your point, we're priests, we have 2 trees for healing, of course we're going to have the broadest range of heals compared to any other class, no one else is that dedicated to healing.

[TwistedPower]

Lol! It seems DPS/UPS man doesnt like healing priests, NO MAIL FOR YOU!

[Airianna]

Personally i've never raided shadow high end, i had it as an off-spec to holy and tried a few times... I hated it. Having to concentrate when to renew dots, the rotation is horrid imo. Maybe i just didin't get used to it.

Another problem was the lack of ONE offensive cooldown besides trinkets... not one? :S

I do hope they fix them

[Worshaka]

Spriests are last on DPS. If you are doing roughly the same DPS as other people in your raid, they suck.

How do you explain the fact the spriest in Paragon's world first kill of Anub'arak wasn't dead last? While he was behind the mages and warlocks he was definitely in the ball park and considering we know pure dps classes get a slight advantage it seems the spriest dps seems about right for the blizzard ideaology.

Melee dps is a lot higher but that's obviously partly due to incidental damage on adds. And if you're going to use multi-dot as an excuse, keep in mind that Blizzard don't define encounters a simple single target tank and spank. Target switching or multi target damage is part and parcel of encounters. We are balanced on what encounters we are presented with, not target dummies.

Going by the jist of your thread one might conclude you believe the mages and warlocks in paragon to 'suck'. I think the fact they were involved in the world first kill might put a hole in that argument.

[superstargoddess]

Priests USED TO BE a healing class. Infact they were THE healer you went to on either faction during classic WoW. For a good majority of BC it was the same way. The problem is priests started getting left behind when Blizzard decided to buff every other healing class to be far superior to a priest. Its also the reason why the best raid spec for a healing priest is no longer holy but disc for the mitigation. Blizzard just keeps fuckin over this class in every aspect. They buff us in shadow & we all start getting happy. Then when the patch goes live we realize how much more they buffed the other classes so OUR buff makes it look like we got nerfed instead since our dmg output is once again lower than other dmg casters (yes run-on sentance ftl). Its one thing to hear Blizzard say how we're going to get buffed & when we look at our own personal dmg output increase to be happy. Its another to compare our new dmg output and the rest of the dmg casters only to see yet again we got the shaft.

If you have been playing since pre-BC you would fully understand how much we've been nerfed or ninja nerfed (us buffed but other classes buffed way more than us).

That's true, everyone wants to have a resto druid with them now.

[Strykzor]

How do you explain the fact the spriest in Paragon's world first kill of Anub'arak wasn't dead last? While he was behind the mages and warlocks he was definitely in the ball park and considering we know pure dps classes get a slight advantage it seems the spriest dps seems about right for the blizzard ideaology.

Going by the jist of your thread one might conclude you believe the mages and warlocks in paragon to 'suck'. I think the fact they were involved in the world first kill might put a hole in that argument.

Multidot.

[Boneclinkz]

yeah resto droods > priests and every other healing class

dumb trees, gtfo

[Raunyc]

How do you explain the fact the spriest in Paragon's world first kill of Anub'arak wasn't dead last? While he was behind the mages and warlocks he was definitely in the ball park and considering we know pure dps classes get a slight advantage it seems the spriest dps seems about right for the blizzard ideaology.

Melee dps is a lot higher but that's obviously partly due to incidental damage on adds. And if you're going to use multi-dot as an excuse, keep in mind that Blizzard don't define encounters a simple single target tank and spank. Target switching or multi target damage is part and parcel of encounters. We are balanced on what encounters we are presented with, not target dummies.

Going by the jist of your thread one might conclude you believe the mages and warlocks in paragon to 'suck'. I think the fact they were involved in the world first kill might put a hole in that argument.

I'm sorry, I don't see this as a clear example of where we sit... Without a video, or being able to see what was used during the fight, we're just seeing an "Overall Damage" chart. If he is dpsing purely dots, multi-target or single, I'll concede that his dps was fair for this fight. We don't know that, they could have handled the adds with pure incedental damage (Full dot duration = +dps) or pure aoe.

SS of recount doesn't mean/change anything... Especially on a fight like Anub where there are many more variables at play, how many swarmers spawn, how the raid handles these swarmers, how do they handle the larger adds, all these things come into play for your DPS. We all know where the shadow priest AoE comes in for dps, and I would argue that my usual 11k mindsear spam dps averaged with my 4-5k dps constant would come out around 7k, assuming the aoe wasn't more than 1/3 of the fight.

Next, take a look at his gear. Would you agree that it is safe to assume his guild mates are in generally the same? (Just looked at the casters, mostly ulduar 10/25 HM loot, whereas he has almost none) So it's fair to assume they stuck to single target dps (2xfire 1xdestro, both single target dps) while the shadow priest has the opportunity to aoe and increase damage significantly.

We're talking of an issue scaling here, not purely an issue of max dps.

And should he read these forums, perhaps he could clarify for us with a link to a meter, or hell I'd even take his word, then it would become a specific numbers comparison. As of now, it is not a fair example.

Edit: Gonna throw this in there too, assuming the mages, and the lock are purely single target on this fight, I think is a fair estimate due to spec, shouldn't this be where the shadow priest passes them due to the ability to multidot? If we're supposed to shine at 2-3 targets (any more and mind sear is better), where's the shine? What makes his dps wanted more than say a Mage or Lock?

[walach]

so, shadow is lower single target than mages/locks atm, but better at multi target; you want us to be on par single target AS WELL as better multi target? i'm sure that would go down well :P

yes, there are scaling issues, but things are nowhere near as bad as some of the QQers on forums would have you believe.