1. #4001
    Epic! Fredzilla's Avatar
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    True that, true that. Good luck to ya. I had to wait for our other ret and a fury war to get them before I did, because they both had more dkp than me = /
    "You little hoochees!" - Daos, Lord of Terror

    Quote Originally Posted by PraisetheSun View Post
    "NEENER-NEENER RETS ARE WIENERS."

  2. #4002
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    Quote Originally Posted by nzall View Post
    you both missed that i already had T10 legs.

    and wouldn't the EoF leather gloves be better than the mail ones? or anyway, i'll check rawr for it.

    edit: apparently, the plate EoF gloves are my best bet. that's unexpected. anyway, i'll run an optimisation with EoF cost to see which are the best.
    Armory hadn't updated to show you even had TAJ for me, so didn't realise you had T10 leggs, Gatecrasher's the best for you? That is a surprise..

    Get those T10 leggs on you to sort out ur expertise anyway ^^ Even if you have to wear all 5 till you can afford the gauntlets it'd be worth it rather than the leggs of acension, saying this since atm you're prot on armory and dunno whether you're using the T10 :P
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  3. #4003
    Not to budge in on your discussion. I haven't played ret since I leveled, which is almost 33 days of played time ago, and have been picking up a few pieces from OS rolls. Now I'm way over hit and everything, but I'm just wondering if I'm really just a few gear swaps away from some decent dps. Right now I peak at like 3150 dps at boss level dummy. Anyways, here's my stuff:

    http://wow-heroes.com/index.php?zone...as&name=purusa
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...thas&cn=Purusa

    Yes, I'm still level 80. No I don't have cataclysm.

  4. #4004
    Quote Originally Posted by purusa View Post
    Not to budge in on your discussion. I haven't played ret since I leveled, which is almost 33 days of played time ago, and have been picking up a few pieces from OS rolls. Now I'm way over hit and everything, but I'm just wondering if I'm really just a few gear swaps away from some decent dps. Right now I peak at like 3150 dps at boss level dummy. Anyways, here's my stuff:

    http://wow-heroes.com/index.php?zone...as&name=purusa
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...thas&cn=Purusa
    well, for starters, if possible, try to get a refund for those gloves and get the T10 gloves. then replace your chest and your shoulders by T9 ones. drop a few K on darkmoon card: greatness to replace your pyrite infuser. that leaves you 42 hit above cap. if you replace your bracers by the ToC crafted ones, that's solved as well. you'll be at 260 hit.

    edit: if you have the cash, replace those green gems with epic gems. and when you have a +4 or higher STR bonus with a yellow socket, use an inscribed ametrine.
    Last edited by nzall; 2010-08-22 at 07:12 PM.
    Because I want to say this every single day but don't want it to get a drag:
    1) The ingame store will only sell timesaver items. It won't affect balance.
    2) No, getting to 100 in half the time isn't pay2win. raids don't start until the second week, everyone has time to get there.
    4) getting charms faster is also not pay2win. getting those is easy, but not everyone has the time or want for dailies.

  5. #4005
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    Quote Originally Posted by purusa View Post
    Not to budge in on your discussion. I haven't played ret since I leveled, which is almost 33 days of played time ago, and have been picking up a few pieces from OS rolls. Now I'm way over hit and everything, but I'm just wondering if I'm really just a few gear swaps away from some decent dps. Right now I peak at like 3150 dps at boss level dummy. Anyways, here's my stuff:

    http://wow-heroes.com/index.php?zone...as&name=purusa
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...thas&cn=Purusa
    Adding to what Nzall said, if you can, sell that libram back and wait till u get 4pc t10 and whatever offpieces you want from EoF before getting that, it's a minor upgrade to the EoT one.

    Edit: And if you can't refund the gloves, consider buying the T10 shoulders to bring ur hit down aswell.
    Last edited by Brael; 2010-08-22 at 11:21 PM.
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  6. #4006
    Awesome, thanks for the idea's and direction. ^.^

    Yes, I'm still level 80. No I don't have cataclysm.

  7. #4007
    http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...dy&gn=Ascardia

    I got bad luck with plate drops. D: (I've seen gunship bracers only once, and those were non hc)

  8. #4008
    Quote Originally Posted by Eyeless View Post
    i would advise any ret pally to either reroll a different class, or at least a different spec. ret pally's are too easy of a class to play, blizz needs to nerf them. i had a 80 ret pally for a time but i eventually respecced it to be holy/prot, prot is still a bit easy but holy is fun for pvp.
    probably a dk

    anyway,
    Quote Originally Posted by Temsen View Post
    http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...dy&gn=Ascardia

    I got bad luck with plate drops. D: (I've seen gunship bracers only once, and those were non hc)
    9.9/10, don't see anything overly wrong in gear, all the stats and stuff look good. the only "wrong" is that you don't have AM but if you've got a couple holy pallies in raid it shouldnt be that big a deal.

    also had about a 3 month break from wow and just got back and did a 10 icc run last night so would like an opinion
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...ad&cn=Vangaurd

    and yes I know I spelled vanguard wrong, but so did about 80 other people :P (had to change my name when I server xfered)
    Last edited by Alenko; 2010-08-24 at 05:19 PM.

  9. #4009
    Epic! Fredzilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alenko View Post
    probably a dk

    anyway,

    9.9/10, don't see anything overly wrong in gear, all the stats and stuff look good. the only "wrong" is that you don't have AM but if you've got a couple holy pallies in raid it shouldnt be that big a deal.

    also had about a 3 month break from wow and just got back and did a 10 icc run last night so would like an opinion
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...ad&cn=Vangaurd

    and yes I know I spelled vanguard wrong, but so did about 80 other people :P (had to change my name when I server xfered)
    Only a few things to point out:

    Replace your cheapo chest enchant with the real deal.
    Move your points from worthless Divine Intellect into the other talents in that tier.
    If you can, replace your cloak with the one from gunship or rot 25, and your gloves with those from fester 25.

    Everything else looks fine.
    "You little hoochees!" - Daos, Lord of Terror

    Quote Originally Posted by PraisetheSun View Post
    "NEENER-NEENER RETS ARE WIENERS."

  10. #4010
    Quote Originally Posted by Fredzilla View Post
    Only a few things to point out:

    Replace your cheapo chest enchant with the real deal.
    Move your points from worthless Divine Intellect into the other talents in that tier.
    If you can, replace your cloak with the one from gunship or rot 25, and your gloves with those from fester 25.

    Everything else looks fine.
    fear reduction isn't really that usefull for human (only fight in ICC with a fear is BQL and there's a 2 min interval between them) so I'd still have 2 pts in it at least. and I would need those to drop for me, or a raid leader that isn't a complete moron and would let rets roll on agi gear.

  11. #4011
    Immortal Ronark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alenko View Post
    fear reduction isn't really that usefull for human (only fight in ICC with a fear is BQL and there's a 2 min interval between them) so I'd still have 2 pts in it at least. and I would need those to drop for me, or a raid leader that isn't a complete moron and would let rets roll on agi gear.
    Its better than 2 points in the 99.8% worthless Divine Intellect talent.

  12. #4012
    @Fredzilla
    Well, you know you're geared well, I imagine you're waiting on a new weapon and thus losing some of your expertise you're carrying, gemming yellow sockets for +4agi socket bonuses has shown to be a dps increase at later gear levels, but if you're like me you cant be bothered to waste a gem for ~2dps, I'll wait until 4.0 and just exchange my ring...

    As for you comment on Divine Intellect, while you are entitled to your opinion, referring to a talent as worthless when it has practical application and is in fact a dps increase over non-dps talents only implies that you didn't know it has a dps value. The talent gives a nearly negligible amount of mana ~250, int gives a very minor amount of spell crit, and a greater sized mana pool increases mana regen of Divine Plea and replenishment. While this seems very lackluster for 5 talent points, it is of some use, more so than either of the other 2 talents from a pure dps stand point.

    As for my gear I'm still juggling my hit and exp caps, I would kill to pick up the belt off of Valithria, but no luck yet. My choices at belt are basically excessive hit or excessive expertise, so i swapped a glyph and threw my old ToGC belt back on until I can get a pure dps belt like Coldwraith Links.

    I also have the luxery of raiding with a moonkin with nearly 100% attendance, allowing me to drop swift retribution for a little extra raid utility elsewhere.

  13. #4013
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    more so than either of the other 2 talents from a pure dps stand point.
    Yes, but you aren't a rogue, you're a hybrid.

  14. #4014
    Quote Originally Posted by Rlyskilled View Post
    Yes, but you aren't a rogue, you're a hybrid.
    You're trolling right? Cause if your next line is STFU and heal, I'm gonna lose it. My job in a raid is to dps, and bring what utility I can where its needed, Hand spells, Aura Mastery, I even spec'd into vindication so our tanks don't have to worry about demo shout/roar. And your comment is comparing a dps talent to a +healing talent and fear reduction talent, where I as a human spend about .3 seconds a week feared in a raid. If you really feel like hybrids shouldn't be maximizing their dps and taking obscure talents that have no bearing on a raid setting, there's nothing I can do or say that will change how you feel, but I do everything I can to maximize my potential dps, and healing is not what I signed up for.

  15. #4015
    The Lightbringer Prentice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluerelic View Post
    You're trolling right? Cause if your next line is STFU and heal, I'm gonna lose it. My job in a raid is to dps, and bring what utility I can where its needed, Hand spells, Aura Mastery, I even spec'd into vindication so our tanks don't have to worry about demo shout/roar. And your comment is comparing a dps talent to a +healing talent and fear reduction talent, where I as a human spend about .3 seconds a week feared in a raid. If you really feel like hybrids shouldn't be maximizing their dps and taking obscure talents that have no bearing on a raid setting, there's nothing I can do or say that will change how you feel, but I do everything I can to maximize my potential dps, and healing is not what I signed up for.
    I am going to quote myself from the bottom of page 198 because I have no interest in retyping it all. Here is why any points in Divine Intellect pail in comparison to spending points in Healing Light.

    Quote Originally Posted by Prentice View Post
    So I just pulled up a random World of Logs parse for an ICC HM full clear from a while back. During that raid, I cast Flash of Light 50 times. Do you know how many times during that 12/12 HM clear that I dropped below 250 mana?? The answer is 0 times. Prioritize Judgement as your #1 attack like you should be. It doesn't matter if you get 15 DS procs in a row. Judgement is still a higher priority and should be used as soon as its off cooldown.

    That is my point, folks. Unless you aren't playing your character to its fullest, you are going to be casting a heal on someone. While it may not be your primary responsibility, it is an ability that you have. My global and couple hundred mana are worth so much more when they are keeping someone else alive regardless of how they got in trouble. This is the bigger picture that so many players fail to see.
    And another for greater effect.
    Quote Originally Posted by Prentice View Post
    Consider this. Divine Intellect will have the same effectiveness regardless of what the ICC buff is. No matter how high it gets, Divine Int will only grant you ~250 mana unbuffed.

    How many times have you found yourself out of place or in a tough spot in the middle of a fight. I don't know about you, but when that happens to me my first reaction is to pop a FoL on myself. That FoL is made 12% stronger by the talent Healing Light. Furthermore, that heal and essentially the talent are affected by the ICC 30% that increases all healing done by 30%. Add to that the Sheath of Light aspect and how it gets to double-dip(heal and HoT gets +30%) the ICC buff, and the reason I take that talent is made very clear.

    During the early waves of trash on Valithria Dreamwalker, I will often stand there and spam some FoL's on the boss. The fact is, I don't want to be in that fight any longer than I have to. Because I can contribute to shortening the fight's length, I do. As of the 25% buff, my FoL crits will heal for more than 10k. Add the Sheath of Light HoT that will heal for an additional 6k (1500/3 seconds) and also benefits from the ICC buff (1950/3 seconds). I won't claim that my healing contributions are enormous, but its all part of being a pally. Contribute the most you can and do it in the most effective way. When there isn't much trash, make yourself more useful. I do and that's why that talent is superior.
    Last edited by Prentice; 2010-08-24 at 07:14 PM.

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  16. #4016
    Immortal Ronark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluerelic View Post
    You're trolling right? Cause if your next line is STFU and heal, I'm gonna lose it. My job in a raid is to dps, and bring what utility I can where its needed, Hand spells, Aura Mastery, I even spec'd into vindication so our tanks don't have to worry about demo shout/roar. And your comment is comparing a dps talent to a +healing talent and fear reduction talent, where I as a human spend about .3 seconds a week feared in a raid. If you really feel like hybrids shouldn't be maximizing their dps and taking obscure talents that have no bearing on a raid setting, there's nothing I can do or say that will change how you feel, but I do everything I can to maximize my potential dps, and healing is not what I signed up for.
    Its the difference between Theoretical DPS and Actual DPS.

    Theoretically, talents like Pursuit of Justice and Unyielding Faith will have more DPS than the Actual DPS given by Divine Intellect.

    ---------- Post added 2010-08-24 at 02:06 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Prentice View Post
    I am going to quote myself from the bottom of page 198 because I have no interest in retyping it all. Here is why any points in Divine Intellect pail in comparison to spending points in Healing Light.
    Nice new sig, Rlys did a nice job on it.

  17. #4017
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    +12% healing is a better place to spend talent points than more % intellect. Maybe your guild allows you to mindlessly DPS and not worry about doing anything else and that's fine lots of rets are just brought for DPS. As a hybrid that's brought not only for competitive damage but my cooldowns and hybrid abilities, I use instant FoLs if it means life or death to another raid member at the cost of my personal DPS. If you save a raid mate that's doing 12k dps by losing 50 of your own isn't that better than ignoring them? And if you play that way, wouldn't 12% more healing be attractive to you?
    In before 'lol ur healurz are shit'. My instant FoLs helped me get Argent Defender yesterday.

  18. #4018
    @Prentice
    While your experience is moving, and I'm sure they are indeed a great group of people, but the fact of the matter is that 50 FoL over the course of a 12/12 HM clear even if they were ALL crits of 10k which is completely unreasonable, thats 60000 healing that talent provided alone, adding in a tick or two of Sheath of Light before a real healer tops off your presumably would be dead ally. This is assuming you even used all 50 of them on bosses, or that you used them on allies, since its not uncommon for rets to heal valithria during downtime. Or that not a single point of healing was overheal, which is highly unlikely unless your healers have poor reflexes, which in a 12/12 HM clear I highly doubt. So, assuming all these incredible factors is true, over the course of 12 bosses, only 2 of which are even a remote concern for healers, you give us a number of 50 with out explaining number of attempts, wasted heals or when you even used them and even then you come up with a negligible amount of healing that may even have just caused your presumably good healers to just overheal afterward. The act of healing at all is what saves your allies, not the extra 600 healing your shitty FoL gives.

    @Ronark
    This is true, its about boss on target time. But, my exact point is that there is 1 encounter in all of ICC or RS that has a fear mechanic and I'm going to trinket it, in 25s i trinket the 1st and bubble the 2nd making the talent have exactly 0 dps value, not theoretical dps, actual dps. Even if I had Unyielding Faith she fears you right before flying out of melee range, so god forbid you have to sit through the entire fear, you aren't even capable of meleeing her anymore.

  19. #4019
    Immortal Ronark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluerelic View Post
    This is true, its about boss on target time. But, my exact point is that there is 1 encounter in all of ICC or RS that has a fear mechanic and I'm going to trinket it, in 25s i trinket the 1st and bubble the 2nd making the talent have exactly 0 dps value, not theoretical dps, actual dps. Even if I had Unyielding Faith she fears you right before flying out of melee range, so god forbid you have to sit through the entire fear, you aren't even capable of meleeing her anymore.
    No, but it does help in other instances, i.e. fears trash mobs, disorient effects from players who have been MC'd, etc.

    The only thing 5/5 DI gives is 24 Intellect in a raid setting, or 360 mana and 0.14% Spell crit. In any situation, 12% extra healing from HL and namely FoL is MUCH more beneficial- Moreso when used to save yourself or someone else.

  20. #4020
    The Lightbringer Prentice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluerelic View Post
    @Prentice
    While your experience is moving, and I'm sure they are indeed a great group of people, but the fact of the matter is that 50 FoL over the course of a 12/12 HM clear even if they were ALL crits of 10k which is completely unreasonable, thats 60000 healing that talent provided alone, adding in a tick or two of Sheath of Light before a real healer tops off your presumably would be dead ally. This is assuming you even used all 50 of them on bosses, or that you used them on allies, since its not uncommon for rets to heal valithria during downtime. Or that not a single point of healing was overheal, which is highly unlikely unless your healers have poor reflexes, which in a 12/12 HM clear I highly doubt. So, assuming all these incredible factors is true, over the course of 12 bosses, only 2 of which are even a remote concern for healers, you give us a number of 50 with out explaining number of attempts, wasted heals or when you even used them and even then you come up with a negligible amount of healing that may even have just caused your presumably good healers to just overheal afterward. The act of healing at all is what saves your allies, not the extra 600 healing your shitty FoL gives.
    Criticizing the extra 600 (50x) healing vs the extra 250 mana is pretty comical.

    If the link below takes you to the screen intended, you can see that I cast Flash of Light 86 times which yielded over 676k healing while contributing another 267k healing via the Sheath of Light HoT. 100% of that healing was effective. Unfortunately, this attempt was a wipe because the holy pally lost his stack. It is not uncommon for me to cast FoL 40-50 times in a single Dreamwalker kill.

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/47moa...?s=5951&e=6387

    ---------- Post added 2010-08-24 at 07:44 PM ----------

    Its a good thing that Kayla is providing the haste buff for your raid though. Your 8 boss deaths to her 1 would have been a pretty significant DPS/Healing loss for your whole raid. Perhaps if your FoL's healed for more.....

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