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  1. #21

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by sleekit
    some of you need to get away from the idea that people 'bring you' to provide 5% of your dmg as healing to 4 other peeps.

    people bring you to do dps.

    VE is a joke now even when its talented up to 5%
    your thought processes are relics from an age when it was 20%
    While i for a long time was against Imp VE, in recent times i have found it to be quite useful, but situational at that. For a fight like Twin Valkyr Hardmode it is VERY good, and provides a vast amount of healing to yourself and your party. While we dont have any WMO reports for our Twins attempts, i was doing around 1.5k-2.5k HPS (spiked to 3k a few times). That is alot of healing in this encounter, even tho healers were doing 3k+ (except the disc) that extra HPS helped. If you have improved its basically 45% of the damage you do into healing, assuming all 5 people in your party dont have full health - [4 x 5% healing + 1 x 25% healing = 45% healing].

    Now assume your doing 7k DPS on twins and your party isnt at full health, correct me if im wrong but that would be something like:

    Party member 1 - 5% healing : 7000/100 x 5 = 350HPS
    Party member 2 - 5% healing : 7000/100 x 5 = 350HPS
    Party member 3 - 5% healing : 7000/100 x 5 = 350HPS
    Party member 4 - 5% healing : 7000/100 x 5 = 350HPS
    Yourself - 25% healing : 7000/100 x 25 = 1750HPS

    1750+(350x4) = 3150 HPS
    Priest - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenalol
    Druid - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenah
    DK - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Jubei%27Thos&n=Weenalol

  2. #22

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti
    Mana's abundant.
    No.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thragh
    You are brought to AoE heal with VE...
    what? ??? ??? ???

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti
    Improved Shadow Form is pushback reduction. If you're taking pushback, you're not doing your DPS. True story.
    if you're taking pushback that means you're taking melee hits which means you should've specced shadow affinity.

    c wut i did thur?

    Quote Originally Posted by Weena
    assume your doing 7k DPS on twins and your party isnt at full health, correct me if im wrong but that would be something like:

    Party member 1 - 5% healing : 7000/100 x 5 = 350HPS
    Party member 2 - 5% healing : 7000/100 x 5 = 350HPS
    Party member 3 - 5% healing : 7000/100 x 5 = 350HPS
    Party member 4 - 5% healing : 7000/100 x 5 = 350HPS
    Yourself - 25% healing : 7000/100 x 25 = 1750HPS

    1750+(350x4) = 3150 HPS
    you know, the healers arent exactly waiting for your VE to top everyone up. over 90% of VE is overheal most of the times. now it might be something less than that at Twin Valkyr but still doesnt justify 2 talent points.



    Use this spec: http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?prie...z,ywJOqR,10433
    I use this spec for Gormok disarms. my second spec is pretty much the same, just without psychic horror and 2/2 veiled shadows, for 3/3 shadow affinity.
    GUYS DONT UNDERESTIMATE SHADOW AFFINITY (caps intended). There is no tank in the world that can hold aoe aggro against a fully buffed shadowpriest, unless the shadowpriest gives him time, which means his dps would drop.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucetia
    I need to go respec him because there have been a lot of fights where aoe damage is caused and would help reduce the knockback on casting MF/Mind Blast
    "Channelling" aoe damage doesnt cause spell pushback. for example (in pvp) a mage's blizzard ticks wont cause spell pushbacks, but his arcane explosion will. now, im not quite an expert in ToC HM but afaik u shouldnt be getting pushbacked at all.

    EDIT: oh just something i noticed, the OP stated in his signature: My idea - and then follows with a blizzard quote. Does that mean the OP works for blizzard? OMG THE BLUES ARE PATROLLING TEH MMO FORUMZ! /sarcasm


    Feel free to PM me about any question you might have regarding LoL.
    Holy paladin

  3. #23
    Fluffy Kitten Marest's Avatar
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    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    To get some things straight when it comes to Shadow PvE spec:

    Shadow Affinity is not a mandatory talent since your threat can easily be managed by using fade properly. It is however one GDC and a dps reducer.

    Shadow Focus is only needed until your base gear gives you hit so that you are exceeding your cap. Removing 1 point depending on your current hit rating is only a smart way to free one talent point. Some also argue that you can start experimenting with Misery as well, but I disagree.

    Imp. Vampiric Embrance is not something you take because you have "shitty healers", but to help ease up raid healing on hardmode and progress fights. Every little bit helps, remember?

    Improved Shadowform is a must, always. Try doing Mimiron hardmode without it and you will end up doing less then 3k with BiS gear, honestly.



    As for the discussion on giving up Meditation I do find it an interesting thought, and as long as you can manage your mana I think it is a very cleaver way to clear up some talent points. I personally will try out something like http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#bVcbkZZGxrVRfzffqfzAo depending on my current hit rating options.

  4. #24

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    You don't take Imp VE for party healing...you take it for self healing, on stuff like mimiron p2 I can almost keep myself up on purely ve but the party stuff is nice to have...

    Drop meditation and affinity take everything else is my plan.
    'u get constant hit by ice shit from roof so you can travel instantly all across the room'

  5. #25

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    situational yes.
    and possibly even worth a second spec if you are a dedicated shadow priest.

    but the concept that people bring you along for because of the utlity you can offer is history which is what i was refering to.

    in a standard build anything which sustains or enhances your dps is a better choice (and imo that includes mana regen and interrupt protection talents)

    Mannoroth nodded. "The warrior shows much promise... I would see more of his kind, learn their potential..." WoTA

    gee thx Brox...

  6. #26
    Fluffy Kitten Marest's Avatar
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    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    I miss the old, full utility, shadowpriest. Healers used to salute us as insane mana batteries. I miss the good ol' days.

  7. #27

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by thoukaia
    you know, the healers arent exactly waiting for your VE to top everyone up. over 90% of VE is overheal most of the times. now it might be something less than that at Twin Valkyr but still doesnt justify 2 talent points.
    Did you read the 'assume' part of my post, i never said that everyone in your whole group is always under 90% health.

    Quote Originally Posted by thoukaia
    GUYS DONT UNDERESTIMATE SHADOW AFFINITY (caps intended). There is no tank in the world that can hold aoe aggro against a fully buffed shadowpriest, unless the shadowpriest gives him time, which means his dps would drop.
    Unless is vezax, our tanks are very comfortable in keeping threat over me
    Priest - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenalol
    Druid - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenah
    DK - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Jubei%27Thos&n=Weenalol

  8. #28
    Stood in the Fire
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    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    So much wrong information in this topic. The serious raiding spec for a good Shadow Priest will still be 13/0/57.

    Shadow Priests will only ever have mana issues on fights where you are multi-DoTing. This IST change isn't exactly needed, but of course it is welcome. I only ever use Dispersion for mana on extremely rare cases (Yogg hard modes, for example, where I'm constantly DoTing everything). It's nearly always used as a 'Oh damn, this is going to hurt. I'll just pop Dispersion' button.

    Whoever said there wasn't pushback in PvE is an idiot. Mimiron phase 2? Improved Shadow Form is vital in a serious raiding spec, especially for the added bonus of making your Fade remove movement impairing effects (Nova on Hodir, Roots on Freya). Imp VE is a nice extra, but it's nowhere near vital, and it's not something we're in desperate need of as Shadow Priests, since we're the most resilient caster anyway, due to our higher armour, and 15% damage reduction.

    There is absolutely no need to take points out of Shadow Focus. You gear for 11% hit, or 10% if you're lucky enough to have a Draenei in your party constantly.

    if you're taking pushback that means you're taking melee hits which means you should've specced shadow affinity.

    I cringed, hard.

    I use this spec for Gormok disarms. my second spec is pretty much the same, just without psychic horror and 2/2 veiled shadows, for 3/3 shadow affinity.
    GUYS DONT UNDERESTIMATE SHADOW AFFINITY (caps intended). There is no tank in the world that can hold aoe aggro against a fully buffed shadowpriest, unless the shadowpriest gives him time, which means his dps would drop.


    Tell me which boss you need to AoE enough to warrant a spec with Shadow Affinity? Don't say Anub'arak 25 heroic. You have Fade. Do you respec to that spec for trash? I also found it laughable when you said Shadow Priests had mana problems, but you spec out of Veiled Shadows for your 'AoE spec'. Nice one.

  9. #29

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tihr
    So much wrong information in this topic. The serious raiding spec for a good Shadow Priest will still be 13/0/57.

    Shadow Priests will only ever have mana issues on fights where you are multi-DoTing. This IST change isn't exactly needed, but of course it is welcome. I only ever use Dispersion for mana on extremely rare cases (Yogg hard modes, for example, where I'm constantly DoTing everything). It's nearly always used as a 'Oh damn, this is going to hurt. I'll just pop Dispersion' button.

    Whoever said there wasn't pushback in PvE is an idiot. Mimiron phase 2? Improved Shadow Form is vital in a serious raiding spec, especially for the added bonus of making your Fade remove movement impairing effects (Nova on Hodir, Roots on Freya). Imp VE is a nice extra, but it's nowhere near vital, and it's not something we're in desperate need of as Shadow Priests, since we're the most resilient caster anyway, due to our higher armour, and 15% damage reduction.

    There is absolutely no need to take points out of Shadow Focus. You gear for 11% hit, or 10% if you're lucky enough to have a Draenei in your party constantly.

    if you're taking pushback that means you're taking melee hits which means you should've specced shadow affinity.

    I cringed, hard.

    I use this spec for Gormok disarms. my second spec is pretty much the same, just without psychic horror and 2/2 veiled shadows, for 3/3 shadow affinity.
    GUYS DONT UNDERESTIMATE SHADOW AFFINITY (caps intended). There is no tank in the world that can hold aoe aggro against a fully buffed shadowpriest, unless the shadowpriest gives him time, which means his dps would drop.


    Tell me which boss you need to AoE enough to warrant a spec with Shadow Affinity? Don't say Anub'arak 25 heroic. You have Fade. Do you respec to that spec for trash? I also found it laughable when you said Shadow Priests had mana problems, but you spec out of Veiled Shadows for your 'AoE spec'. Nice one.
    this man knows what his on about
    Priest - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenalol
    Druid - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenah
    DK - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Jubei%27Thos&n=Weenalol

  10. #30

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tihr
    So much wrong information in this topic. The serious raiding spec for a good Shadow Priest will still be 13/0/57.

    Shadow Priests will only ever have mana issues on fights where you are multi-DoTing. This IST change isn't exactly needed, but of course it is welcome. I only ever use Dispersion for mana on extremely rare cases (Yogg hard modes, for example, where I'm constantly DoTing everything). It's nearly always used as a 'Oh damn, this is going to hurt. I'll just pop Dispersion' button.

    Whoever said there wasn't pushback in PvE is an idiot. Mimiron phase 2? Improved Shadow Form is vital in a serious raiding spec, especially for the added bonus of making your Fade remove movement impairing effects (Nova on Hodir, Roots on Freya). Imp VE is a nice extra, but it's nowhere near vital, and it's not something we're in desperate need of as Shadow Priests, since we're the most resilient caster anyway, due to our higher armour, and 15% damage reduction.

    There is absolutely no need to take points out of Shadow Focus. You gear for 11% hit, or 10% if you're lucky enough to have a Draenei in your party constantly.

    if you're taking pushback that means you're taking melee hits which means you should've specced shadow affinity.

    I cringed, hard.

    I use this spec for Gormok disarms. my second spec is pretty much the same, just without psychic horror and 2/2 veiled shadows, for 3/3 shadow affinity.
    GUYS DONT UNDERESTIMATE SHADOW AFFINITY (caps intended). There is no tank in the world that can hold aoe aggro against a fully buffed shadowpriest, unless the shadowpriest gives him time, which means his dps would drop.


    Tell me which boss you need to AoE enough to warrant a spec with Shadow Affinity? Don't say Anub'arak 25 heroic. You have Fade. Do you respec to that spec for trash? I also found it laughable when you said Shadow Priests had mana problems, but you spec out of Veiled Shadows for your 'AoE spec'. Nice one.
    Good info, but you're kinda contradicting yourself. The point of the thread was that with mana being somewhat of a non-issue(you even say it yourself), you might be able to forgo Meditation in 3.2.2 and pick up all the pve utility talents and still have decent manage regen in 8/0/63 or the pseudo-meditation 11/0/60 spec.

    I do agree that the basic raiding spec will probably be 13/0/58 but because of the IST buff, we are more flexible than before.

  11. #31

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    This is what you get when wannabe healers discuss spec they never played in their life

  12. #32

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by syanid
    This is what you get when wannabe healers discuss spec they never played in their life
    Not like it matters anyway

    http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?prie...m,ywJOqR,10433

    The rest of the points you can basically put in where you want in 3.2.2 (as long as 3 are in some combination of meditation or imp ST)
    'u get constant hit by ice shit from roof so you can travel instantly all across the room'

  13. #33

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    That spec is pretty garbage mmhmm.

  14. #34

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tolar
    That spec is pretty garbage mmhmm.
    /facepalm

    The spec will probably be the base line spec in 3.2.2
    As in the there are still points to be spent where ever you want with at least a combination of 3 talents in IST and Meditation.

    @Talrob, I agree that your spec will probably be the base line spec with points spent on what you want.

  15. #35

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by syanid
    This is what you get when wannabe healers discuss spec they never played in their life
    This is what you get when tools don't even read topics to apply anything relevant to the discussion.

    Back on topic, I'm thinking of picking up Improved Fort again (for 10-mans) and Inner Focus for a shitty "dps cooldown", and seeing where we go from there.

    11/0/60.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  16. #36

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    So much wrong information in this topic. The serious raiding spec for a good Shadow Priest will still be 13/0/57.
    Can I please put my last point in the shadow tree to make it 58?

    Anyway... there is so much fail in this thread.

    if you're taking pushback that means you're taking melee hits which means you should've specced shadow affinity.

    c wut i did thur?
    Melee is not the only source of pushback. Besides... if you are taking melee hits from a boss, you're dead... or dispersed waiting for death.

  17. #37

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti
    This is what you get when tools don't even read topics to apply anything relevant to the discussion.

    Back on topic, I'm thinking of picking up Improved Fort again (for 10-mans) and Inner Focus for a shitty "dps cooldown", and seeing where we go from there.

    11/0/60.
    You should play more rather than discuss stuff you got no clue about. Do yourself a favor and check amount of spirit gained in Coliseum, pick up a calculator and calculate what's more mana regen - crappy spirit tap that depends on you casting or meditation that's there passively. You seriously have way too little experience in game to be discussing this, even tho you think you don't. Running without Imp. Fortitude is stupid. Running without Meditation is stupid. Running without imp. shadowform is borderline retarded in environment with so much pushback. What you're discussing is tiny bit of mana regen and some stupid amount of spellpower like 10 or so in BiS gear. It's not like you changed the world of shadowpriests with your suggestion, things will remain the same dps-wise. Oh yes, with your spec I'd have to run with glyph of dispersion to be able to keep up, which means I'd be silencing myself more often, which in return means I'd lose in dps.

    Now do yourself and us a favor and go actually play and then talk about shadow.

  18. #38

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti
    Mana's abundant.
    Mana's never abundant. If you're not running oom on longer fights with multiple targets, then you're doing something wrong. Remember that Dispersion is almost always a DPS loss, so the less often you use it, the better for your DPS.

  19. #39

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by syanid
    You should play more rather than discuss stuff you got no clue about. Do yourself a favor and check amount of spirit gained in Coliseum, pick up a calculator and calculate what's more mana regen - crappy spirit tap that depends on you casting or meditation that's there passively. You seriously have way too little experience in game to be discussing this, even tho you think you don't. Running without Imp. Fortitude is stupid. Running without Meditation is stupid. Running without imp. shadowform is borderline retarded in environment with so much pushback. What you're discussing is tiny bit of mana regen and some stupid amount of spellpower like 10 or so in BiS gear. It's not like you changed the world of shadowpriests with your suggestion, things will remain the same dps-wise. Oh yes, with your spec I'd have to run with glyph of dispersion to be able to keep up, which means I'd be silencing myself more often, which in return means I'd lose in dps.

    Now do yourself and us a favor and go actually play and then talk about shadow.
    Improved Fortitude may be brought in a 10 man by a Discipline Priest, or a Holy Priest in your 25 man. Going without it in 10's is iffy, hence dropping Shadow Affinity to pick it up and Inner Focus or one more point of Meditation.
    I'd actually criticized people that are running without Improved Shadow Form, don't know where you got off where I promoted running without it. And quite frankly, running without 13 (or 14 if you go back to TBC) poitns in Discipline does sort of "change" the shadow priest class.
    And lastly... in response to this:
    You should play more rather than discuss stuff you got no clue about. Do yourself a favor and check amount of spirit gained in Coliseum, pick up a calculator and calculate what's more mana regen - crappy spirit tap that depends on you casting or meditation that's there passively.
    If you're "not casting" you get "full" spirit regen. Do yourself a favor, and shut the fuck up.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  20. #40

    Re: New 8/0/63 Shadow PvE Spec?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti
    Improved Fortitude may be brought in a 10 man by a Discipline Priest, or a Holy Priest in your 25 man. Going without it in 10's is iffy, hence dropping Shadow Affinity to pick it up and Inner Focus or one more point of Meditation.
    I'd actually criticized people that are running without Improved Shadow Form, don't know where you got off where I promoted running without it. And quite frankly, running without 13 (or 14 if you go back to TBC) poitns in Discipline does sort of "change" the shadow priest class.
    And lastly... in response to this:If you're "not casting" you get "full" spirit regen. Do yourself a favor, and shut the fuck up.
    Brainiac, Improved Fortitude increases YOUR HEALTH POOL TOO by a nice amount, that's why it's important, not because someone else brings it in.

    Do yourself a favor and delete the game, you're boring to no end and stupid as fuck, all your suggestions are so stupid and I doubt you even stepped outside of naxx anyway.

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