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  1. #1861
    Graceful you are definitely the man. This has helped me tremedonsly. Just knowing these specifics and clearing up the confusion for me is going to take my dps to the next lvl.

    Clarifying again, I think the tooltip for Meta just jacked me up. I believe it says increases your dmg and your pet. I just assumed the Doomguard was a Pet but I guess he's a "Guardian". So much like Affliction he will do w/e dmg he's going to do just based on Int, and Haste %. I will pop him with the most procs present. For me I'm using Kneed to Know with procs and ICDs. I will just basically wait until the last sec of Volcanic Destruction waiting on Power Torrent/Synapse and pop the bad boy. Defintely cool to find out Meta/DG didn't matter as mucha s I though it did in my opener takes some stress off.

    Thanks for the Multi Dot advice I'll def do more dps just using Immo/Corr saving GCDs if Agony isn't that big of a deal.

    I'll let you know on the Heroic fights. We're a guild that raided succesfully Heroics/Glory end of ICC with a buff and then made it all the way to Nef on Normal first tier cata raids before we fell apart there. We then raided SWTOR NiM modes, but obviously easier raiding scene there, and just returned. So we're a bit behind the curve for a few people and atm having some reintroduction pains and or having to become more hardcore than casual at this point with people. Not sure if its DPS or Heals. It's looking like heals mostly but our druid needs to pick it up some as well.

    Lastly thank you very much I very much appreciate getting knowledgeable responses to these types of questions. Always awesome to clarify stuff like this that will take your DPS up! Definitely excited to go burn it on the bosses.

    I think for the precast shadow bolt I'll just make 2 macros one without the snypase springs...But atm I think it's been fine cause I've been doing gear swaps with the MWC with a countdown timer so it's been working out atm. In MoP is this shadowflame crap fixed?

    So you go with 3 Meta Buffed Dots. Does having DS or not on that make a diff to you or the Spellpowers used? Or in general after that first super one is a Meta buffed one going to be the best every time?
    Last edited by rap87; 2012-07-16 at 09:40 PM.

  2. #1862
    Stood in the Fire gracfuldeath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rap87 View Post
    I think for the precast shadow bolt I'll just make 2 macros one without the snypase springs...But atm I think it's been fine cause I've been doing gear swaps with the MWC with a countdown timer so it's been working out atm. In MoP is this shadowflame crap fixed?

    So you go with 3 Meta Buffed Dots. Does having DS or not on that make a diff to you or the Spellpowers used? Or in general after that first super one is a Meta buffed one going to be the best every time?
    Last I bothered to look at shadowflame, it was demo only while in meta and was ginormous. But that was a while ago. Honestly, I don't follow MoP stuff because I won't be playing in MoP. I don't even play now lol, but things aren't changing yet. But they are doing something to it.

    Depends on the DS. DS:Felguard matters to us, hence why you don't clip the last tick your first BoD. The first one will be your biggest 95% of every fight, unless stars align a second time to give you meta + DS + all procs, and you've pet swapped back to the felguard for some reason.

    As for DS:Felhunter, it's just buffed periodic shadow damage. So while it's still shadow damage, our periodic shadow damage isn't buffed a lot in the first place like affliction, so you can't consider the effects equal between the specs. A DS:Felhunter buffed BoD beats a non buffed BoD. A meta buffed BoD beats a DS:Felhunter BoD. As for how a PT buffed BoD, a Volcanic Destruction buffed BoD, and a PT/Volcanic Destruction buffed BoD compared to a DS:Felhunter BoD, I don't know. Never bothered to do that math. Personally I play it by ear, if I know the BoD is unbuffed then I'll clip with a DS:Felhunter buffed one. If I know it's buffed with two procs (PT/LW), I'll just wait until it falls off to recast it with a fresh BoD or unless meta comes off CD soon then I'll pop it with meta and refresh whatever BoD is up there.

    I know it gets pretty complicated, hence why they call it micromanaging. So like I said, when in doubt, don't clip.

    Just remember that for whatever you do end up doing with DS:Felhunter, it does NOT go into effect until dots are refreshed. Same with all other CDs you pop.

  3. #1863
    Alright, all my questions have been answered. Thanks again. Very sad you aren't playing in MoP sounds like the Warlock community is losing a great player . Also that being said, thanks for taking the time to help me out your not even playing and aren't in MoP. Very nice thing to do sir. Thanks again and gluck hope you return!

  4. #1864
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    Ok So I am a Destro lock and something just does not seem right. I should be doing alot more dmg than I currently am. I understand the spell priorites. Not sure if its a scaling issue or is it just a Wall that Destuction hits at a certain gear lv. Please take a look and tell me if you see anything out of place. I sit at dummy for hours and just cant figure out why my dmg is not higher than it is. On a dummy self buffed I avg out around 30 - 32k depending on procs.

    WoL: worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-7kz4ytxuc8rlqnnp/details/31/
    Armory: us.battle.net/wow/en/character/silver-hand/Xanuri/simple

  5. #1865
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanuri View Post
    Ok So I am a Destro lock and something just does not seem right. I should be doing alot more dmg than I currently am. I understand the spell priorites. Not sure if its a scaling issue or is it just a Wall that Destuction hits at a certain gear lv. Please take a look and tell me if you see anything out of place. I sit at dummy for hours and just cant figure out why my dmg is not higher than it is. On a dummy self buffed I avg out around 30 - 32k depending on procs.

    WoL: worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-7kz4ytxuc8rlqnnp/details/31/
    Armory: us.battle.net/wow/en/character/silver-hand/Xanuri/simple
    Looking at Ultraxion and Morchok:
    Watch your DoT uptimes (80% uptime on Immolate and BoD on Ultraxion), you're missing Shadowflame, Conflagrate more (22 Conflags on Ultraxion in a 4:02 fight is an 11s interval on an 8s spell), line your DoTs/DG up with procs (1.5k DPS for your DG on Ultraxion is very low), keep your ISF up (36.1% on Morchok).

  6. #1866
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rustjive View Post
    Looking at Ultraxion and Morchok:
    Watch your DoT uptimes (80% uptime on Immolate and BoD on Ultraxion), you're missing Shadowflame, Conflagrate more (22 Conflags on Ultraxion in a 4:02 fight is an 11s interval on an 8s spell), line your DoTs/DG up with procs (1.5k DPS for your DG on Ultraxion is very low), keep your ISF up (36.1% on Morchok).
    Is there anything else I can do with enchants or reforging. I think I am pretty up to date where that is concerned. Also thank you for the comments on the dot uptimes. The only problem with H Morchok is there is ALOT of movment. DO you have any tips to maybe have that up time better?

  7. #1867
    Stood in the Fire gracfuldeath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xanuri View Post
    Is there anything else I can do with enchants or reforging. I think I am pretty up to date where that is concerned. Also thank you for the comments on the dot uptimes. The only problem with H Morchok is there is ALOT of movment. DO you have any tips to maybe have that up time better?
    More haste. There is no cap for destro, or any of the specs really. People use the word "cap" too literally when it comes to destro and the number 2681.

    2681 is the point that haste generally starts to decrease in value (based on you gear, it might not even decrease, depends on your other stats). If it would a true cap, any haste beyond 2681 is worth 0 in stat weights, but 95% of the time it's still 1.5 or greater. If you even look at the BiS profile on simcraft, the destro profile has 27?? ish haste. This is of course assuming a completely standstill, single target fight.

    So what about fights with heavy movement or adds? The value of haste, one that can't be put into a number so easily, greatly increases with the amount of movement and the number of targets.

    Personally, unless I wanted to just perfect my gear for Ultrax, I ran with 2800-2900 haste as destro for all times. Worked out nice.

    Gear is fine, whenever you can get it, spine gloves and heroic tier shoulders is BiS, but until then it's tier gloves and morchok shoulders just like you have. Greater Mastery to gloves is the correct way to go regardless of what haste you decide. You'll most likely get a bit more bank for your buck if you put a red int gem in that yellow ring socket, generally +10's aren't worth it when we're starting about matching socket bonuses.

    ---------- Post added 2012-07-26 at 01:06 AM ----------

    The other thing about Morchok is getting a feel for exactly when it matters that you're somewhere. Just because the tank moves your target 5 yards, it doesn't mean you have to immediately stop your casts and move closer. What matters is that you've moved in and are in range for the stomp. After a while you should be able to get a feel for how fast it takes you to get in range of his stomp from your current distance vs the time before that stomp happens. Ofc, you'd rather be there early than miss the stomp. But in the long run it helps you figure out how to cut out some movement.
    Last edited by gracfuldeath; 2012-07-26 at 01:08 AM.

  8. #1868
    Quote Originally Posted by gracfuldeath View Post
    More haste. There is no cap for destro, or any of the specs really. People use the word "cap" too literally when it comes to destro and the number 2681.
    More precisely, destruction uses soft caps (no other spec has a cap as such), meaning that the value of haste greatly increases near the cap (to the point where it is worth sacrificing intellect for it if required) but greatly decreases immediately when you hit the cap, in this case to the point where mastery is worth more.

    This is because (unlike any other spec), gaining extra ticks on immolate will also increase the damage of your conflagrate due to how it is based off of the total damage of immolate. However, haste that does not provide an extra tick will not increase conflagrate damage beyond lowering the GCD on it.

  9. #1869
    Stood in the Fire gracfuldeath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inactivity View Post
    More precisely, destruction uses soft caps (no other spec has a cap as such), meaning that the value of haste greatly increases near the cap (to the point where it is worth sacrificing intellect for it if required) but greatly decreases immediately when you hit the cap, in this case to the point where mastery is worth more.

    This is because (unlike any other spec), gaining extra ticks on immolate will also increase the damage of your conflagrate due to how it is based off of the total damage of immolate. However, haste that does not provide an extra tick will not increase conflagrate damage beyond lowering the GCD on it.
    Apologizing in advance if I'm reading this beyond just a more precise description/explanation of the destro and 2681 the haste threshold.

    Just because haste over that threshold does not provide additional conflag damage or extra ticks, doesn't mean it's actual or theoretical value drops to 0 after a threshold. Gear itself has a factor, I can't say this applies to everyone, but personally I've seen sims of my character where haste was at least tied for the highest stat weight after the 2681 rating. (Technically it was the lowered goblin rating). I've also seen where it was second in terms of stat weights. And for this Xanuri, haste being the lowest current value in a quick sim.

    Fights with external factors, such as heavy movement, change stat weights in ways that cannot always be easily measured. From my experience, thinking specifically of HM Morchok being the example asked about, I saw great improvements when I bumped my haste up several notches. (This was during the time where tanks would not listen, and it felt like they were trying to kite the bosses. And by improvements I mean 80% rank limit to 30-50 ranged rank parses around the 5-10% nerf, with no gear changes) It wasn't just randomly bumping up the amount of haste, I did several sims/reforge options for a better fit with higher haste. But for a fight with heavy movement, more haste is how I found improvement. Which is what was asked about.

  10. #1870
    Hi guys,

    Looking for some hints and advice on how to improve my DPS/Damage. I do feel I should be pulling a lot more than I currently am.

    My rotation - Pull, CoE > DS/glove tinker > SB > SS > Haunt > MG.

    Using MG for the duration of Haunt then manually refreshing DOT's if below 10 sec before applying Haunt. MG as filler above 20% and DS below 20% - refreshing DOTs SB>SS.

    The two kills below last night are in Affliction, did have a couple of attempts on Elegon as Destruction. When in this spec my rotation is:

    CoE > Dark Soul /Glove Tinker > Immloate > Conflagrate > Incinerate until two embers then CB. I think am going wrong here in not building up embers, I usually find myself casting CB with 2 embers up. How much do you guys build up before casting CB?

    Links to logs and character.

    Cheers
    Rev


    worldoflogs.com/reports/ls2w8teyw1at88ot/sum/damageDone/?s=1491&e=1799
    worldoflogs.com/reports/ls2w8teyw1at88ot/sum/damageDone/?s=3728&e=4312

    eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/azuremyst/Revlovjoy/advanced

  11. #1871
    Revlov, couple quick gearing things, didn't get a chance to look at logs yet.

    1. spirit does nothing for you. so replace the 600 spirit gem in your helm with hit and try to get a ring without spirit
    2. you should be able to get very close to hit cap without putting that 320 hit gem in a red socket, so if you can, replace that gem with an int gem
    3. on your bracers you want a +170 mastery enchant
    4. ideally you want the mastery/run speed enchant on your boots for progression
    5. you're missing belt buckle, nitro boost, and goblin glider
    6. on your gloves you can put the +170 expertise enchant on there to help you get hit cap, as expertise is essentially the same as hit now
    7. work towards getting 1 of the 2 heroic ilvl trinkets to replace the iron ghostling

    will take a look at the logs later, but i don't play affliction right now so i may not have much info to give

  12. #1872
    Log: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/c...wv1/details/0/

    Doing 42k dps on a dummy, 5 mins, have low dot upkeep at the end because I was stopping the log.

    I know I could do way more damage(ilevel 466) If you check my log my dot damage ticks are really low especially corruption. My other two guildies locks have my same gear and same rotation/dot upkeep but outdps me by ATLEAST 10k I've been spending sleepless nights trying to understand what I'm doing wrong >_<.
    Last edited by Chaosshadow; 2012-10-09 at 07:04 PM.

  13. #1873
    I've selected some lines from the beginning of your log:

    [03:59:50.259] Xomnus casts Dark Soul: Misery
    [03:59:50.259] Xomnus casts Blood Fury
    [03:59:50.742] Xomnus casts Summon Doomguard on Training Dummy
    [03:59:51.368] Xomnus casts Soulburn
    [03:59:51.935] Xomnus casts Soul Swap on Training Dummy
    [03:59:52.851] Xomnus begins to cast Haunt
    [03:59:53.999] Xomnus casts Malefic Grasp on Training Dummy
    [03:59:56.858] Xomnus casts Malefic Grasp on Training Dummy
    [03:59:59.995] Xomnus begins to cast Haunt
    [04:00:01.474] Xomnus begins to cast Haunt
    [04:00:02.717] Xomnus casts Malefic Grasp on Training Dummy
    [04:00:03.693] Xomnus begins to cast Unstable Affliction
    [04:00:04.872] Xomnus casts Corruption on Training Dummy
    [04:00:05.897] Xomnus casts Malefic Grasp on Training Dummy
    [04:00:08.756] Xomnus casts Malefic Grasp on Training Dummy
    [04:00:11.499] Xomnus casts Malefic Grasp on Training Dummy

    This translates directly to your opener. Some of it is fine - you pop all CDs, SB:SS, Haunt, MG...But then you double up on Haunt, which is obviously a waste of a shard. You channel MG for 1 second, and then you cast UA and Corruption, and then you channel MG, and then your DS runs out. Everything I said after the 'But' is wrong.

    There are a few goals/things you have to keep in mind to get great DPS when you play Affliction:
    1) Every time you stop channeling MG or DS, you are losing DPS.
    2) Whenever Haunt is on the target, you want to be channeling MG the entire time.
    3) Don't waste shards
    4) Extend your procs

    Therefore, don't double Haunt (probably an accident). Time your breaks in between channeling MG so that you refresh most/all of your DoTs, followed by Haunt. Make Haunt the last thing you do before you MG. Don't MG for 1 second and stop. And finally, before your procs and DS/Lust/whatever run out, refresh all your DoTs, and don't refresh them again - wait for them to fall off before you reapply.

  14. #1874
    Quote Originally Posted by Rustjive View Post
    And finally, before your procs and DS/Lust/whatever run out, refresh all your DoTs, and don't refresh them again - wait for them to fall off before you reapply.
    Even Agony? I'm pretty sure refreshing Agony late and not having to build it to 10 stacks again is better than 1 supercharged tick of Agony and a fresh one from 0 stacks.

  15. #1875
    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    Even Agony? I'm pretty sure refreshing Agony late and not having to build it to 10 stacks again is better than 1 supercharged tick of Agony and a fresh one from 0 stacks.
    Sorry, yes. Excepting Agony.

  16. #1876
    Need help on my DPS.

    http://worldoflogs.com/guilds/17736/


    Really not sure what I am doing wrong.


    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...zakia/advanced


    Also having trouble figuring out which trinkets I should use.

    I have the Dark Moon Fair one; Flash Reisn, Elegon Trinket, and Brewfest watch.

  17. #1877
    Quote Originally Posted by Rustjive View Post
    I've selected some lines from the beginning of your log:
    There are a few goals/things you have to keep in mind to get great DPS when you play Affliction:
    1) Every time you stop channeling MG or DS, you are losing DPS.
    2) Whenever Haunt is on the target, you want to be channeling MG the entire time.
    3) Don't waste shards
    4) Extend your procs

    Therefore, don't double Haunt (probably an accident). Time your breaks in between channeling MG so that you refresh most/all of your DoTs, followed by Haunt. Make Haunt the last thing you do before you MG. Don't MG for 1 second and stop. And finally, before your procs and DS/Lust/whatever run out, refresh all your DoTs, and don't refresh them again - wait for them to fall off before you reapply.
    Here's a new log of me applying this: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/y...um/damageDone/

    Still not good enough. Went from 42k to 45k though(again take into account ilevel466 gear).

    Was always reapplying dots before using haunt then letting MG go until haunt is done and until cast is done. What do you mean by extend your procs? Also why is my malefic grasp doing so much of my damage? My dots still feel like they do shit damage compared to other locks.
    Last edited by Chaosshadow; 2012-10-10 at 05:36 AM.

  18. #1878
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaosshadow View Post
    What do you mean by extend your procs?
    Dark Soul: Misery gives you 30% Haste. This Haste means your DoTs tick quicker, and they tick more over the duration, leading to more damage. If you cast a DoT during Dark Soul, it will keep that extra duration/tick speed/total ticks until the DoT is complete. DoTs will always snapshot whatever buffs you have on you at the time of cast, whether it be Haste, or Mastery, or Spellpower, or anything.

    To 'extend' your procs, what you do is you extend your DoTs right before your procs run out. Here's an example - you cast Dark Soul, and then Agony - it lasts 24 seconds. When your Dark Soul runs out, your Agony has 4 seconds left on it, and you've gotten 24 seconds of Agony affected by Dark Soul by the end. If you refresh Agony right before Dark Soul ends, however, your Agony has 48 seconds of Dark Soul's effect.

    You should try to do this with pretty much every single major buff - Dark Soul, Bloodlust, DMC, PvP trinket, Flashfrozen trinket, etc. Bonus points if you extend your DoTs with multiple buffs on you.

    Your DoTs are weak because you don't do this. Because they're weak, your MG looks relatively stronger.

    The rest of the gap between your performance and sim is probably due in large part to buffs - no Bloodlust, no Crit, no Spell Haste, no Stats, as well as pots and flask.

  19. #1879
    Hey,

    my warlock DPS right away sucks and I don't know why. I read every freaking thread about warlocks and try to get my outcome of it, I try to improve mysselve everytime I can, but I didnt catch up the 2 other warlocks in our guild. Both try to help me but its very hard for them to help.

    I am not allowed to post links, so pls look at my logs:
    WoL -> German -> Onyxia -> Innervision
    Elegon Kill Tuesday
    Last WOTE Try Yesterday

    As you see in Elegon I am around 10k to 15k DPS behind them, the same thing as in Will of EMpore.
    But I should be as same DPS as them, maybe in front of them, because I got DMC + Elegon Trinket.
    We all have same spec (ofc), same mastery-reforged.
    The only thing I know what is my problem is that I have a wand and waste 1% hit in not having a other weapon.

    Any ideas?

    My inputs:
    - For start I start with a single dotline of every dot with DS which I Update with SS:SB as soon as all trinkets are up (~5 seconds after pull) and try to refresh as last as possible and get them as long as possible to tick.
    - On Elegon adds I nuke with SS:SB without Hount and MG after this until dead of the add
    - On WOTE I try to get as much shards as possible and Multidot everytime 2 targets at the same time.

  20. #1880
    Hello all, AFF lock here looking for some help. I have been comparing logs and even though my dot uptimes are usually on par or even better than others, they seem to do far more dps than me. Below is my log for Stone Guard:

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/7...?s=5812&e=6180

    I went ahead and found a ranked lock (with similar kill time) and compared below:

    http://raidbots.com/comparebot/50759...e000561#damage

    Any help would be wonderful, I am very curious as to why his dots tick so much harder. Thanks all!

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