Is Destro REALLY 'The' Raiding Spec?

[Archcorrupt]

I've been wondering lately, is Destruction really 'The' spec a raiding warlock should have.

All the theorycrafting and Simulations put Destro at highest DPS output with Affliction and Demo and any other Hybrid build trailing behind.

However... I have and probably always will raid as Affliction, just purely cause i don't like raiding as Destro, it's boring as anything. Now those of you who use Elitistjerks and other such sites as their Bible are probably sniggering now thinking 'Lol he does fail dps in raids' but thats the thing. So far from my raiding experience I don't see this whole 'Destro does more' trend.

In my guild atm there is only really 2 or 3 warlocks, of which im the only really active one (Good for Loot, Bad for Competition) and i'm also the only Affliction lock in my guild, and looking at www.wow-heroes.com im the only Affliction Warlock in the top ~75 Warlocks on the entire server (Taking Both Horde and Alliance into consideration) however whenever the Destruction lock does actually make an appearance to our raids, he very rarely beats me. Before you jump to conclusions, my gear is ever so slightly better then his atm (only cause i actually have 100% attendance unlike him) but with what all the Theorycrafting and Simulations say, if his gear is slightly behind/on par with me he should still be beating me as Destro because it does 'more dps' but he never does, infact he never comes close. For instance, ToC 25 this evening went very well, and he was actually online to put my dmg into perspective (its not gd going 'oh look im 3rd on dmg done' if your class with your current gear should be topping the meters or vice versa and your class in your gear is usually bottom) so having another Warlock there was nice.

Not only did i beat him on every boss, but with the twins i was 3rd on damage done and he came out on 13th. With me doing 7.2K DPS (Top spot being hunter on 8.2K) and him doing 4.8K. Now obviously thats just one fight and he could of had a off game or any number of reasons but the fact that this is becoming a general trend is starting to make me wonder. Its not just that he's a shit player either, i personally don't know whether he's any good or not i haven't spent alot of time talking to him but i compare myself to Destro locks from other guilds on our server, who are on par/better geared then myself and I do the same as or more dps as Affliction then they do as Destro.

Now my proposal is this (yes there is a point to this whole wall of pointless text) could it possibly be not that Destro is better then Affliction but quite simply and rather harshly, don't get offended if this doesn't apply, but more a case of Destro is higher dps because people don't know how to play Affliction properly?

I personally consider myself to be an Affliction pro, i've played it from day 1, i know every single possible in and out of Affliction and i have many many many a time had /w during raids from people asking simply how the fuck i get the DPS that i get as Affliction.

I just wanted to get this out there cause i am genuinely curios as to what people think about the whole Affliction/Destro decision.

The mages also love having me in the raid cause it means they don't have to Glyph Imroved Scorch cause i can apply the 5% crit debuff for em.

[Voodoo328]

At this point, the raids seem to require burst damage (via switching targets and burning them down) so therefore Destro has been needed.

[op3l]

Meh, who cares. Just play what you enjoy regardless of what others say about how a Spec X is better than Spec Y.

If you love affliction, but destro according to math did twice as much damage, you will put out the damage but hate the spec. Last I checked, wow is still a game and a game is played for fun.

[Jobusan]

And a wall of text it is where it seemed like 25% of that was you flexing your epeen.
To the point, I played affliction for a very long time and like many affliction locks am still a big advocater of the class. There could be a lot of contributing factors as to why this other lock does less dps. Aside from just being a shit player, it could be gear issues, it could be that he doesn't manage the destro rotation very well, it could be that he has higher latency or/and fps. It could be that he doesn't flask, or that he uses the wrong spellstone(or none at all), could be that he uses the wrong pet, etc.
There could be a lot of contributing factors. As an affl. lock changed to destro because I keep it varied I can honestly say that I put out just as dps destro as I did affliction.
I higher gear standards affliction is just as compromable to destro so there isn't necessarily one that is better than the other.
Also, he might have "good" gear, but if he doesn't have hit cap, over 2k spell power, high crit and high haste these factors will also contribute to a destro lock having low dps.

[zcks]

Sadly yes it is the raiding spec.
I kinda wish they would change the coloring of allot of the spells to look like fel fire instead of just regular fire.
When you think of warlocks you think of power over shadow & fel fire, not regular fire.

[harky]

The point is... at the current gear level even with a Doomguard out Afflic is 5% behind Destro. Without the Doomguard out it's around 10%. The difference is also much higher in fights with adds, which is very much the norm now. Considering people will expend tons of effort for things that are even 1% more DPS it shouldn't be surprising that Destro is much, much more popular for high end raiding.

I spent a long time at 60 as Hemo. Does that mean I should magically be able to raid DPS as 17/0/54? It just doesn't work that way. You may love Afflic, but at this point you're hurting yourself by not learning something else.

[Melonberry]

If you played destro as well as you played affliction, you'd do more dps than you do now.

[Archcorrupt]

Nice to see its getting some replies, however i have some things to say.

First @ Jobusan, No... this was not a wall of text to flex my 'Epeen' it was to show the comparisons. kk? And do you really think i'm that stupid as to not factor in every single point you made.

Ofcourse he was flasked if was a bloody guild raid, ofc he was using the right pet i was there... i saw... yes he had the right spellstone. He also uses the correct rotation cause i stood next to him and could see what he was doing as i was playing. And as far as Lag is concerned, he didn't say anything so unless he just suffered in silence then no he didn't have any lag. And plus with my piece of poo computer i barely muster more then 5 FPS in a 25 man raid so im playing with shitty conditions so even if he was too it would bring him down to my level.

@ Hurky and Melonberry. I didn't say i don't play Destro, i have dual spec Affliction/Destro. I play Destro in heroics because of the very obvious fact that there isn't enough time to even get a single rotation out with Affliction. And i do know how to play Destro as well as Affliction but it still doesn't yield an improvement for me. I can understand the whole 'fights with alot of burst dmg needed means destro wins' for instance Lord Jaraxus. But the only time i've ever needed to swap to destro in a raid for the burst Dmg is Lord Jaraxus 10 Heroic to burn down the Nether Portal and Volcano. Other then that Affliction has never gimped me.

TBH so far no1 has answered my original question, 'Is Destro only better cause people don't know how to play Affliction'

Your all just qouting the same stuff i've heard over and over again.

And yes Op3l i do play the spec that i enjoy because it is indeed a game and nothing more. I just don't like the view that most top end guilds have of Affliction not being Viable when it very blatantly is.

[Warlocomotif]

Destruction is better, but its not much better. No serious theorycrafter ever said that destruction is far superiour to affliction (give or take some fights, ie: Jaraxxus, destruction is superiour because it can actually burst the portals down). Oh and, no you're not playing affliction better than a computer does.

[Archcorrupt]

Yeah but the computer/simulation can only play Affliction as well as the person that programmed it, correct?

[Grunthunter]

in my personal opinion its what you like, i have seen all 3 specs ( yes even demo) pull 7k+ dps so its just a matter of what you feel like using.

[telemain]

If you played destro as well as you played affliction, you'd do more dps than you do now.

Truth.

[Archcorrupt]

Truth.

"And i do know how to play Destro as well as Affliction"

[Archcorrupt]

in my personal opinion its what you like, i have seen all 3 specs ( yes even demo) pull 7k+ dps so its just a matter of what you feel like using.

Thats the thing, i believe that too. But alot of people don't 'because Elitistjerks says so'

[telemain]

"And i do know how to play Destro as well as Affliction"

Then you're asking stupid questions, because you're obviously pulling better DPS as destro than affliction. If you're not pulling better DPS as Destro than affliction, then you aren't playing destro as well as affliction.

If you prefer affliction, then play it. Do not try to pretend it is better DPS though. It isn't. Sorry to break the news to you. You are not some OMG AFFLICTION GOD that is doing something that no one else has ever thought of. The best of the best have tried affliction, destro, and demo. Destro came out on top in theory and in practice. Just accept the truth.

[Warlocomotif]

Yeah but the computer/simulation can only play Affliction as well as the person that programmed it, correct?

Unlike you, a computer can accurately tell whether UA will have 1.4 or 1.6 seconds left by the time your latency correction allows you to cast your next spell. You can take a pretty good guess, but you won't have a 100% accuracy rate on it.

"The person who programmed it" Is pretty much anyone who posts on the warlock forums of EJ. Seeing as everyone can run their own priority system through simulationcraft and see the results.

[Archcorrupt]

Did i at any point say 'LoL you all suck im the only person that can dps as affliction'...

No pretty sure i didn't say anything along those lines at any point. Because i don't claim to be any sort of 'God'.

And no i'm not asking stupid questions, stop hiding behind the ignorant 'Destruction is better end of' bullshit that im getting fed up with and made me make this post. I'm not trying to 'Prove' Affliction is better, i never said it was. As i've said twice before i'm trying to get across the point that Affliction is most definately Viable and is CAPABLE of the same results as Destruction when PLAYED CORRECTLY. Yes i do know how, and most definately can play Destro as well as Affliction but as i said, it yieded no "improvement" meaning i did the same dps, which means i put it to you NOT that i can't play Destro aswell as Affliction but like i've said, and my original point, the people playing Destro can't play Affliction aswell as they do Destruction.

[telemain]

Did i at any point say 'LoL you all suck im the only person that can dps as affliction'...

No pretty sure i didn't say anything along those lines at any point. Because i don't claim to be any sort of 'God'.

And no i'm not asking stupid questions, stop hiding behind the ignorant 'Destruction is better end of' bullshit that im getting fed up with and made me make this post. I'm not trying to 'Prove' Affliction is better, i never said it was. As i've said twice before i'm trying to get across the point that Affliction is most definately Viable and is CAPABLE of the same results as Destruction when PLAYED CORRECTLY. Yes i do know how, and most definately can play Destro as well as Affliction but as i said, it yieded no "improvement" meaning i did the same dps, which means i put it to you NOT that i can't play Destro aswell as Affliction but like i've said, and my original point, the people playing Destro can't play Affliction aswell as they do Destruction.

No. It isn't. Destro will do better if played properly. Period. Let me make this nice and simple for you

"Is Destro REALLY 'The' Raiding Spec?"
Yes.


Done..

If you can't understand this, you are doing something wrong. I don't care how many times you say "omg I'm doin it rite!" If destro isn't doing better, you're not doing it right.

[Archcorrupt]

Well i'm not here to try and change your mind cause clearly your Arrogance and Ignorance is showing the intellectual level that you are Capable of. So if you'd kindly leave this discussion to people with enough sense and maturity to actually DISCUSS without trying to flame. KkThx<3

[Knuffelbert]

Affliction has it's uses. We for example often run without a scorch mage as everyone switched to arcane and a warlock sacrifices himself to keep the 5% crit buff up. However except in very rare fights I have no problem beating him, whereas he is usually a bit over me. Never saw an affliction lock do even comparable damage in raids with anything requiring burst. Say like cobolts on first boss in totgc, portals/volcanos on the second boss, shields on fourth boss.

Look here: http://www.wowmeteronline.com/rank/c.../wrl/8/0/3/320

The reason why affliction lock is so high on anub is obviously drain soul since he stays forever at or below 25%.


Also while theorycraft is just theory, it is much easier to come close to the "theory" as destruction lock, while it is close to impossible as affliction (as someone already said, computers don't make errors of judgment if programmed right)