Hard Modes vs. Heroic Modes

[ryuke09]

well the thing with heroic modes in toc is...there's only 5bosses. i mean, 3.2 overall is for the most part something to keep us going until ICC opens up. and i thought the concept of heroic instances was better then heroic modes in ulduar. but what people should try and see is blizzard was just testing the concept of hard mode instances instead of hard mode options in "normal" instance to see how we liked it over the "option"

i believe it was made to stop the "well we wiped a few times on this hard mode lets just say fuck it and go normal mode" that was happening in ulduar.

what i am trying to say here is TOC was blizzard testing a new concept like sartharian was made to test the original thought of hard modes. when ICC comes out i bet the heroic version or hard modes will be better tuned and much more different compared to TOC normal& hard modes. well most of them probably, probably on par with ulduar's verity

[LeperHerring]

The hard mode system is going to be the death of my guild, we cleared tbc together with 3 bosses in SWP, and all in wotlk but with long timers leaving wow or stopping raiding there just is not enough talent to recruit from to fill the gaps for hard mode standard of performance, so it is currently a one hour clear of toc 25, 2 groups of 10man toc, voa and ony and that's it we are a mere 3 day guild which is plenty and always has been but seriously the above barely lasts us 1 day.

This is precisely the case for my guild as well... 3 nights per week, did SWP in TBC. Core raiders have started leaving because the current raiding model of "do everything 4 times" is just too damn boring. Fortunately we have a very good reputation so it's been possible to keep recruiting, but the quality of available recruits is going down the toilet as well.

When TBC and WotLK were coming out people were excited, now multiple people have already said that they're unlikely to get it unless the raiding model is changed. Unfortunately I feel the same way, because even though the idea of revamping the old world rather than building these small expansion islands is something I've been advocating for a long time, the raiding model is just too broken the way it is right now to justify all the time and effort that goes into maintaining an end-game raiding guild.

[Atty]

Fail to see your arguement here.

Hard mode = heroic mode.

[Leipäkone]

I also miss the days of TBC (having done up through SWP) where the boss was simply the boss, and there was no easy mode or hard mode or heroic, it was just the boss. With Hard Modes they also add a hint of logic; why are they more powerful given these circumstances?

Hard Mode Freya - Keepers make her more powerful.
Hard Mode Thorim - Sif is another boss doing damage and here presence increases his hp and damage.
Hard Mode FL - Towers increase the amount of abilities he has from outside sources.
Heroic Anub - ??? It's Heroic!
Heroic Beasts - ??? It's Heroic!
Heroic Jaraxxus - ??? It's Heroic!

Heroic Anub:
-Instead of 2 adds there will be 4 adds
-In normal you have unlimited amount of ice and in Heroic you have only 6
-In normal adds stop spawning in p3 but in Heroic they will continue spawning

Heroic Beasts:
-you dont have speed buff in Icehowl

Heroic Jaraxxus:
-portals and vulcanos have HP and they need to be destroyed since otherwise they will keep spawning more and more adds

I didnt mention those "more hp and more dmg" since its in every encounter

[Fenixdown]

Heroic Anub:
-Instead of 2 adds there will be 4 adds
-In normal you have unlimited amount of ice and in Heroic you have only 6
-In normal adds stop spawning in p3 but in Heroic they will continue spawning

Heroic Beasts:
-you dont have speed buff in Icehowl
Each boss is on a 2 minute time window. If the previous boss is still alive, the new boss comes out regardless.

Heroic Jaraxxus:
-portals and vulcanos have HP and they need to be destroyed since otherwise they will keep spawning more and more adds
Succubi have an extra ability.

I didnt mention those "more hp and more dmg" since its in every encounter

Bold for a couple of things you forgot.

But heroic mode = hard modes without a starting method. You just go straight into them instead of pushing a button, leaving up extra minibosses, or DPSing a heart fast enough.

SO it's like comparing red apples to green apples. The only difference is one is red and one is green, they are both still apples.

[Gilgemesh]

just think... There might be, hiding somewhere in the near future... normal hard modes and heroic hard modes.
Holy confounding compounded compound difficulty levels.

[Johvendi]

There is no real distinction between harde mode and heroic mode. They're the same, only difference is that Blizz wasnt very creative with the hard versions of these bosses.

I like this system, now u can clear it normal (get some emblems, some gear perhaps,...) then focus on hard mode. In Ulduar u always had to decide to go for a hardmode but then potentially miss a YS (and other bosses) kill etc.

So, new system: good, Blizz creativity: bad if u wanna bash something.

PS: dont go 10man if 4x is to much.