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  1. #1

    Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Current glyphs, as we all know, are as follows:
    Mind Flay (30 yard range, sigh), Shadow (10% spirit to SP), Pain (10% MF damage on targets with Pain)

    With Mind Flay going baseline 30 yards, and its glyph getting Pain's current glyph, Shadow getting buffed to 30%, and Pain's new glyph to be a mana restore (1% base every tick), do we want to keep the Pain Glyph? Or swap in for a lolspersion or Death (pretending to have an "execute" : ). I dunno, what're your thoughts for magic slot number three now that you finally have it?
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  2. #2
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    With the new haste scaling, the pain glyph may be a passive answer to a more mana intensive rotation.

  3. #3

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    thats my thought as well
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    gee thx Brox...

  4. #4

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Yeah, since all our DoTs will scale with haste, we will probably really need that new Glyph of Shadow Word: Pain for more mana regen. Mana's really not a problem right now, but that's a lot more casts of VT and the immensely expensive DP.

    IMO, stick with Mindflay (10% more damage to mindflay when SW:Pain is on), Shadow (Seriously, it's getting buffed by 300%), and Shadow Word: Pain (we'll probably need more mana regen)

    EDIT: Once we get our T10 4-piece bonus we'll also be casting Mind Flay more (with a reasonable amount of haste you'll get in 3 mind flays instead of 2 in between each mind blast). So yeah, definitely stick with the mana regen from SW:Pain glyph.
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  5. #5

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    SW:P is 1% of your base mana per tick, a priests base mana at 80 is 3863, so every 3seconds we get 38.6mana. 38.6/3 x 5 is 64.3 MP5. So shadow word pain glyph is worth 64.3Mp5, and nothing else.

    SW glyph is 10% more damage under 35%, so this is basically a dps increase after 35% only. Considering we will more than likely MF spamming in full T10 gear, i would see no need for this glyph. At the moment though 10% more damage on SW would mean it does around...85% of MB damage, might use this till 4piece tier 10...maybe...

    Dispersion glyph scales with your mana meaning, that even though shadowpriests dont have mana issues, this will provide more mana than SW:P glyph, at the cost of some dps. Assume a priest has 25k in a raid, this will bring back 9k mana every 75seconds, which is 120mp5. (Again you wont use this on CD, but it is worth more mana than SW:P glyph). The important side to this glyph is that it provides 90% damage reduction every 75seconds, rather than 120seconds.

    Personally i would go with dispersion > SW > SW:P
    Priest - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenalol
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  6. #6

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Don't forget that that with Glyph of Dispersion that it might be more mana regen but it's also more time when you're unable to do anything other than let dots tick.
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  7. #7
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Weena
    Dispersion glyph scales with your mana meaning, that even though shadowpriests dont have mana issues, this will provide more mana than SW:P glyph, at the cost of some dps. Assume a priest has 25k in a raid, this will bring back 9k mana every 75seconds, which is 120mp5. (Again you wont use this on CD, but it is worth more mana than SW:P glyph). The important side to this glyph is that it provides 90% damage reduction every 75seconds, rather than 120seconds.

    Personally i would go with dispersion > SW > SW:P
    You're forgetting that you don't have to do anything but cast SW:P once to gain that mp5. Dispersion requires you to give up 6 seconds of dps time to gain that mp5. Also, you say that you won't use Dispersion, but just having it available is ok.

    Personally I'd rather have the consistent, 100% chance of having 60 something mp5 rather than the off chance I'd use Dispersion on some rare occasion other than a potential Algalon or way too much movement.

    EDIT: Spelling.

  8. #8

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Shadow
    Mindflay
    Shadowform

    Since spirit is better for us, spirit gear isn't incredibly awful to use, mana wont be an issue, only reason you would use dispersion would be for incoming high burst dmg situations, that being the case, would swap out glyph of MF on a movement fight or Glyph of shadowform on a stand around fight.

    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Strykie

  9. #9

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    .......Shadowform?

    Not sure if you noticed this or not...

    "Shadowform now let the periodic damage of your Shadow Word: Pain, Devouring Plague, and Vampiric Touch spells benefit from haste. "

    Not listed as a Glyph.

    A passive change to Shadowform.

    There's no Glyph of Shadowform, to the best of my knowledge.
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  10. #10

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    So far there is not many fights where you cant use dispersion due to it being a major dps loss, and i dont see this changing in ICC. I'll use dispersion due to the damage reduction, and not the mana return part - when a fight comes along where i have to be dpsing 100% of the time and dispersion is not an option then the SW:P glyph in my bag can come out in its place; until then its 37.5% reduction on the CD of dispersion>64.3 mp5.
    Priest - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenalol
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  11. #11
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Weena
    So far there is not many fights where you cant use dispersion due to it being a major dps loss, and i dont see this changing in ICC. I'll use dispersion due to the damage reduction, and not the mana return part - when a fight comes along where i have to be dpsing 100% of the time and dispersion is not an option then the SW:P glyph in my bag can come out in its place; until then its 37.5% reduction on the CD of dispersion>64.3 mp5.
    So...

    You'd rather take less damage rather than do more damage? Last I checked, the point of a damage dealing class (i.e. the shadow tree for a priest) is to deal damage; not take less damage (last I checked, tanks are the people who do that).

    By the way, you completely contradict yourself in the very first sentence. So there aren't many fights where dispersion is viable without being a dps loss, but that's ok? And you want to let that continue being ok and part of a non-dpsing rotation?

    Clarification would be greatly appreciated.

  12. #12
    Fluffy Kitten Marest's Avatar
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    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Since SW:P now benefits from haste, wont the MP5 that the glyph offers increase the more haste you have?

    In previous replies the mp5 was 60 something, but with more haste, meaning more ticks, the glyph should proc more often and therefore you should gain a higher MP5 value. Correct me if I'm wrong.

  13. #13
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marest
    Since SW:P now benefits from haste, wont the MP5 that the glyph offers increase the more haste you have?

    In previous replies the mp5 was 60 something, but with more haste, meaning more ticks, the glyph should proc more often and therefore you should gain a higher MP5 value. Correct me if I'm wrong.
    Without doing any napkin math, Marest is very correct. MP5 values would vary from person to person based on their haste.

  14. #14
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Radux
    Without doing any napkin math, Marest is very correct. MP5 values would vary from person to person based on their haste.

    EDIT: Alright it's Tuesday night and I have nothing better to do. At 20% haste (random number I chose), it amounts for about 77 mp5.

    @ 100% haste (not even doing napkin math) it will equal the 120 something mp5 that is the glyphed dispersion. However, anyone who is good at math and hasn't been drinking that is willing to run some numbers on dps time with SW:P mp5 vs. non-dps dispersion time mp5 over the course of a 5 minute fight or something?

  15. #15

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marest
    Since SW:P now benefits from haste, wont the MP5 that the glyph offers increase the more haste you have?

    In previous replies the mp5 was 60 something, but with more haste, meaning more ticks, the glyph should proc more often and therefore you should gain a higher MP5 value. Correct me if I'm wrong.
    You are correct, I totally forgot about this, assuming 20% haste raid buffed, average tick is 2.4seconds, mana per tick = 38.63. (38.63/2.4)x5=80.5mp5.

    Quote Originally Posted by Weena
    So far there are not many fights where you cant use dispersion due to it being a major dps loss
    Can’t = Can not. So far there are not many fights where you can not use dispersion due to it being a major dps loss. Let me break it down more – THERE ARE NOT MANY FIGHTS WHERE YOU, THE SHADOWPRIEST, CANNOT FIND TIME TO USE DISPERSION DUE TO IT BEING A DPS LOSS. Just once more written differently for the mentally handicapped, most fights allow you to use dispersion without losing to much dps, if any.

    Quote Originally Posted by Radux

    So...

    You'd rather take less damage rather than do more damage? Last I checked, the point of a damage dealing class (i.e. the shadow tree for a priest) is to deal damage; not take less damage (last I checked, tanks are the people who do that).
    Taking less damage is something that everyone should look at, wether it’s a talented/glyphed way or simply moving from AOE, it’s not only the tanks that would worry about this. Don’t understand that? Try tank an Algalon’s Big Bang without dispersion, CONSIDERING THAT THE SHADOW TREE FOR A PRIEST IS NOT A TANK CLASS, THEY SHOULD NOT WORRY ABOUT USING DISPERSION SINCE ONLY TANKS TAKE LESS DAMAGE. RIGHT?? RIGHT??

    I also don’t think you understand, dispersion is usable on most fights so far, without it hindering your dps to much. There are periods in most fights where you can use it whilst on the run, waiting, etc. Find that hard to comprehend? Here:

    OS 3D – Running to portals and running from flame wall
    XT – The few seconds he stands around when he reaches 75%, or when you get light spark, or when you get a dark thingy and have to run from the raid.
    Razorscale – When the adds are dead, or she throws you into the air.
    Ignis – Flame Jets or Slag pot.
    IC – Overload eating to stay on a blue zone so you don’t have to move, getting out of death runes.
    Kologarn – When you get eyebeam and have to run away, or tank it.
    Auriaya – On the fear or moving from void zone.
    Hodir – Moving to a flash freeze or moving to people with the buffs.
    Thorim – In the tunnel can be used on the run, on the floor while the adds are dead and when its just you and thorim moving from the thunder.
    Freya – When there are no adds up, and when she casts ground tremor.
    Mimiron – Between phases, moving from fire, moving from frost bombs, moving from lazors which I forgot the name of, etc.
    Vezax – Wouldn’t recommend using it..
    Yogg – Running to portals, running to tentacles, running to brain link, sanity wells, etc.
    Yogg 0 keeper (watch a video, you probably haven’t done it) – Same as above + in phase 3 turning away and not being able to cast MF/MB.
    Algalon – Eat big bang, running to black holes or even running from crashes.
    Beasts – Transition phases, when the worms have dug, icehowls charge, etc
    Lord Jaraxxas – Running from inferno, running to ports to kill them
    Faction Champs – When you are being targeted, or running back from a fear, mana in this fight is hard to come by and dispersion glyph would help a lot. And trust me I know how to dps this fight properly to the point of being oom - http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/k...e/topdpsFC.jpg
    Twin Valkyr – Running to the portals to change colour, eating balls
    Anub – In phase 2 when you are kiting him and nothing is up

    So far every fight allows you to disperse, unless they change things in ICC, i’m right, your wrong. Next time try ask a bit nicer and I might not burn you as hard; any more concerns feel free to ask me

    Thankyou
    Priest - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenalol
    Druid - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Barthilas&n=Weenah
    DK - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Jubei%27Thos&n=Weenalol

  16. #16
    Fluffy Kitten Marest's Avatar
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    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Weena
    You are correct, I totally forgot about this, assuming 20% haste raid buffed, average tick is 2.4seconds, mana per tick = 38.63. (38.63/2.4)x5=80.5mp5.
    Alright, cheers.

    I guess the choice between the SW:P glyph and the Dispersion glyph will come down to how the fights will look in ICC, especially the hardmodes. I personally agree with you that Dispersion seems to be the far stronger one due mainly to the damage reduction perspective while comparing to the development of current content (3.0.1 -> 3.2.2).

    Edit: Let's just hope that our viability as shadow priests will increase enough so that we will be brought to raids. I read up on Ensidia's site that they are currently running with only one shadowpriest (down from 3). Do you think that the changes to how haste affects our DoT spells will prove to be a significant dps increase, and thus fix our scaling to some extent?

  17. #17

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    The SW:P glyph is meant to directly offset the haste shortening of VT/DP on mana. With the SW:P glyph you shouldn't need to Disperse unless you're deliberately soaking an attack that would otherwise kill you in order to maximize DPS time. Shadow may have huge problems on live, but mana isn't one of them. Honestly, I doubt most well geared Shadow Priests need the SW:P glyph, much less Dispersion. Also keep in mind that in raid gear the Dispersion glyph if used on cooldown is only around 100 mp/5 higher than SW:P. If you're not casting on cooldown the difference becomes negligible and at about a minute and 35 seconds you gain more mp/5 from SW:P.

  18. #18

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    weenalolrage !


    But hes right, I think im going for the dispersions Glyph. Mana wont be an issue on single targets fights anyway even with hasted Dots.

    But in Multidotting Fights the manaregen will be doubled if u always have two sw:"p" up. Another question, the haste to Dots buff, is it a real buff for vT or DP? I dont thinks so or am I wrong?

  19. #19

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Of course it is a "real buff" to VT and DP. They will do more damage over the same amount of time. The only loss is to mana efficency, and a slight loss based on you having to recast them more often.
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  20. #20

    Re: Shadow's new glyph slot?

    Erm just a point, it doesn't say anything about 'this ability only works every 3 seconds' or anything. The only time we have mana issues is multidotting and if you are multidotting then you have more than 1 SWP up at a time therefore giving you n*(mp5) return.
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