Paladin new baseline abilities in Cataclysm

[RGeneral24]

soooo... 1st i've seen on the other classes forums starting this topic so i decided 2 make this 1 4 paladins aswell ;D

as other ppl are saying we getting again 3 according 2 blizz so what would u want new 4 us?
what new buffs and on-demand-damage/heal u guys think we can get from 81 to 85?

this are the BASELINE abilities given 2 us in last 2 expansions:

TBC :
-> Crusader Aura
-> Seal of Vengeance/Seal of Blood
-> Avenging Wrath

WotLK:
-> Divine Plea
-> Shield of the Righteous
-> Sacred Shield

SHOOT THOSE IDEAS FOLKS ;D

PS: i kinda dont have ideas atm so i aint posting mine
PS no2: i think those are all the baseline abilities correct me if i am wrong

[dulci5]

Tip: Writing 2 instead of 'to' and 4 instead of 'for' makes you seem like, well.. an idiot ;D

Anyway, on topic.. I'd love to see an Avatar type of ability, like the mountain king from WC3. I know we already have wings that boosts our damage, but this one would share cooldown with wings and also increase health, size and runspeed or something. I bet Warriors would get this though, and not Paladins, but you can always hope

Would also love to see some sort of AoE-ability similar to Holy Wrath, but one that deals damage to any type of creature/player, like the one Eadric the Pure casts in TotC 5-man, with some shiny spell effect.. This would be mainly for ret though, if they were thinking of making all classes equal in AoE damage output, as consecration and Divine Storm (that only hits 4 targets) can't keep up with FoK, Cat Swipe, Living Bomb.. list goes on!

My 2 cents

[Apostolic]

Plz uz real wurdz when trying 2 have a srs discussion. KKTHX.

[dulci5]

Looking at the TBC and WotLK abilities, it seems TBC was mainly aimed at Ret, while WotLK introduced mainly Prot abilities, sooo.. maybe it's Holy's turn to get something neat

[Critterbot]

I just want an interupt/silence ability! Then I can die happy...'cuz liek seriously, we need one...bad.

[ewhenn]

Looking at the TBC and WotLK abilities, it seems TBC was mainly aimed at Ret, while WotLK introduced mainly Prot abilities, sooo.. maybe it's Holy's turn to get something neat

LOL what?

Yes, Sacred shield which scales with spell power is a "tank" ability. So is divine plea too right? I mean regaining 25% of your mana, what healer would want that?!

/facepalm

[Sanguissa]

Hard to say without knowing the new talents and new paths. We can exept a lot of redesigned abilitys, some a bit, some completly. They are kinda starting new system there, i think that we will actually feel it same like when paladin changed from tbc to wotlk.

But overall, in my opinion: All tank specs will have the choice to profile even more into some playstyle. I mean that druids will be able to add more avoidance at the cost of pure stamina, and paladins for example will have the chance to lost some of their avoidance to get more stamina( i know its basicly in gems enchants and bit in specs today, but i mean that the choie and specialisation will be even bigger). This would fit into kinda messed up bring the player not the class. I mean you dont have to have special class on some hardmodes encounters as long as you have tanks prepared to change a bit their patchs etc..

This should bring tank paladin some spells that would bring him even closer to multi-functionality on all encounters and stuff, but also saved his cool originality at the same time. Though one

But i think some kind of magic reduction damage would be cool, like that all friends around 15 yards of you will have increased ressistance by 50 to all schools of magic for 10 seconds, and the number is increasing with your stamina or armor. This effect would stack with ressistance aura and some glyph could boost both auras and this abilitys, making it powerfull tool for some kind of encounters(for example malygos deep breath, if it would be more deadly, this would be very handfull). Maybe its too op, but balancing numbers and stuff around would solve it.Now i dont know, we propably doesnt need a new seal or aura, i dont see why.

Only thing i can think about is arcane ressistance aura, and some interupt.

Interupt is hard one, it would mean a boost for paladin in pvp and balancing it out shouldnt affect pve. But, the whole system changes a lot, so..

I liked the idea like you have on jaraxxus. You get debuff, and whenever you will cast any spell, you will get silenced. This debuff lasts some limited amount of time, so lets say it would last 3 seconds and hold for another two if you cast a spell. But, again, the balancing would be veery important here..

[Copain]

LOL what?

Yes, Sacred shield which scales with spell power is a \"tank\" ability. So is divine plea too right? I mean regaining 25% of your mana, what healer would want that?!

/facepalm

Not that I agree with the person much or anything, but Divine Plea is more used as a Tank spell, as we would not have enough mana to do much without it (Even more so later on gear wise since we would not need as much healing, and thus get less mana). Also the minus healing done for a bit of your mana back over a long period of time typically causes healers to save it for a break in a fight (when the boss decides to talk or phase shift), or put it on and take it off after a few secs.

[Sphincter]

I'm hoping they make some major changes to the seals. Vengeance is awesome for PVE but when it comes to PVP our seals are lacking. The only real options for ret are Command & Righteousness(which requires several points in Holy to become decent).

[DaGhostDS]

Not that I agree with the person much or anything, but Divine Plea is more used as a Tank spell, as we would not have enough mana to do much without it (Even more so later on gear wise since we would not need as much healing, and thus get less mana). Also the minus healing done for a bit of your mana back over a long period of time typically causes healers to save it for a break in a fight (when the boss decides to talk or phase shift), or put it on and take it off after a few secs.

a dps who dont use DP end up doing thread like : ret paladin with mana issues, wait that remind me of something..
Holy paladin without DP would screwed lol
Sacred shield is used by all

SoRight only used by holy in pvp, and prot everywhere

[thoramus]

I don't care, I'm sure the class will work just fine. I just want to see Librams added to the player model.

Also, so people keep the discussion relevant, I read that there will be no new talents added, just everyone given 5 additional talent points as they level to 85 so they can be a little more versatile with their spec.
So new talents=no. New abilities=yes. Discuss.

[Krekko]

We will receive a sweeping overhaul, particularly ret. It is really hard to speculate when you have no idea the direction they are taking our class in. I am sure with mastery they will go ahead and work something out to help specialize certain things more towards PvE and others towards PvP.

That being said, I want a spell like Eradric the Pure's shiny light blindy thingy.

[Copain]

We will receive a sweeping overhaul, particularly ret. It is really hard to speculate when you have no idea the direction they are taking our class in.

The only way this post could be more awesome is to say Ret has really low DPS.

[Lumidar]

i just want a distance closer. tired of being the only tanking class without one.

and an interrupt would be nice too. (but not as high in my priority list)

[Vasti]

I hope some offensive ability, preferably a short cd mediocre damage tool with a nice utility tied into it

They shud rename Avenging Wrath to Avatar (so ppl wont ever ask for that ability ever again!)

And maybe a "fun" ability, such as invisibility/mirror immage/blink/shadowstep/deathgrip/heroic leap/levitate/mind control etc etc etc

Something that isnt:
"stand in melee range, click ability, watch the enemys hp go down and/or get a debuff and/or watch the paladin get a buff".

We need something that actually is unique to watch for a paladin.

[Krekko]

i just want a distance closer. tired of being the only tanking class without one.

and an interrupt would be nice too. (but not as high in my priority list)

Heroic leapppp

[Mistress Elizabeth]

TBC :
-> Crusader Aura
-> Seal of Vengeance/Seal of Blood
-> Avenging Wrath

WotLK:
-> Divine Plea
-> Shield of the Righteous
-> Sacred Shield

Based on these skills, I would have to say that we are over do on a "Holy Only" and a "Ret Only" usable ability.

Crusader aura: Usable by all specs
Seal of Vengeance: Ret paladin's pve damage seal, prot paladin's pve threat producer seal.
Avenging Wrath: Holy paladin's Increase Healing cooldown, Ret paladin's DPS increase cooldown, Prot paladin's Threat increase cooldown.

Divine Plea: Holy paladin's mediocre (yes, mediocre, because no other healer has to self inflict a 50% ms on themselves to get mana back) mana regen, Ret paladin's mana regen, Prot paladin's Main and Off tank mana regen.
Shield of the Righteous: Prot paladin's threat rotation skill (without it there wouldn't be 9696), I dont count holy here because let's face it, how much damage will you do with it with ZERO BV from gear or STR?
Sacred Shield: Holy Paladin's PvP/PvE damage intake control tool, Base of Holy FoL spam on PvE, Ret paladin's PvP survivability tool, Prot paladin's PvE tanking added mitigation.

There's many multiple spec usable spells that are baseline, but there's only ONE true ability that you can't just say with a straight face "Ret with shield will use it" because 1h weapon dps is making your dps weak, and Holy paladins will do barely any damage because of lack of BV from neither gear nor STR.

There should be a pure Ret DPS or PvP utility spell (maybe some sort of interrupt which would be helpful for them in PvE as well, but it could be something else), a new HEALING spell (not a new "HUGE heal" or "small heal", something usefull... maybe tied with the usage of beacon (doing double healing to the target with beacon?) or with Sacred Shield (make it proc the absorb effect or the next one absorbs more than a normal one?), and finally a multi spec ability.

[Vasti]

I'll say it once and I'll say it again

baseline ability:

Bolvar's zeal:
Allows the paladin to equip a 2h+shield

and Shor only causes hight threat when under the +holy threat spell (forgot the name)

-Dk tanks won't be the only ppl needing 2h for tanking.
-Retribution will get to use Shor in their rotation and be a dps class that wears a shield, separating them from the other plate dps speccs. (warriors, go 2x 2h or 2h dps, DK, go 2x 1h or 2h, Dk goes 2h+shield, +1 for non-homogenization of classes)
-shor wont be a prot only ability
-Retri can offtank better for leveling purposes (levling in isntances)
-Holy can use a 2h spellpower mace (that boomkin/resto druids could also use) so they get use from the ability too.


prot gets +threat +better soling with a 2h
retri gets +survivability +stats +rotation
holy gets +stats +better soloing with a 2h

and its fair, because then we have 2 "specs" that tank with a 1h (Warrior and DK)
and 2 "specs" for 2h tanking (paladin prot and DK)

OPness can be combated by nerfs elsewhere I jsut wnat to wear a polearm+shield+(unequip my chest and shirt while putting on a red cape) and yell: "THIS IS SPARTAAAA"

[Vitamens]

I'd like to see some type of MS ability...

Along with maybe some type of Chain heal ability?? to give a lil more viability to grp heals.... neither one will

happen but just thoughts..

[Horn]

We should get a basic interrupt spell that heals for a trivial amount. That is all.