Paladin new baseline abilities in Cataclysm

[sharkethic86]

not gonna lie all those trees made me drool too bad they are just some guy's wet dream.. and if anyone watched the blizzcon coverage they already talked a lot about what they are doing with new talent trees and how they are working on getting rid of all passive increases from talent trees and rolling that into increases you gain as you spend points in a tree, making talents less convoluted and paragraphs long as well as making some talents a must have just because of a passive increase even if the talent itself is somewhat useless for the spec

[Horn]

Found on War Tools, very nice Talentree

http://www.war-tools.com/t66061.html

I like the reckoning Idea, but the RNG execute is meh.

[DaGhostDS]

abbreviation for Shield of Righteousness is ShoR.

thanks sir :P

I like the reckoning Idea, but the RNG execute is meh.

love the reckoning too even if il never respec to prot, its something i would like to see ingame

[Astray]

Found on War Tools, very nice Talentree

http://www.war-tools.com/t66061.html

One of the better ones on the internet. Sadly, still the usual type of idea.

I imagine someone sitting there, thinking of abilities and find out "hey, my idea would be cool and strong and i have more of these, i am so great i should work for blizzard!"

The easiest thing in the world, is inventing something incredibly strong, its as easy as inventing something useless. Right in this moment, i could think of a hundred things that would make paladins stronger, but thats not the goal. I guess some people think of the problems a class has in their eyes and solves them. Do you know hat happens, if you take all wisdom about problems and how to make a class deal with them and integrate them into a single class? Unnerfed deathknights.

Just making strong abilities, more flexible scaling, utility and anti-utility makes a class stronger, without a doubt, but it does not make a better, more fun, game.

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Shield + Polearms aka Spartanadin
may sound cool and strong, but think of weapons. In Cata more Agi will replace all attack power. There will be a stricter line between plate wearing classes and the agi girls. Right now prot paladins/warriors and dw dks use tank weapons. Thats few enough, it should not be reduced any further.
They should try to improve the weapon-choices by making hunters use two 1H weapons instead of screwing every 2nd 2H weapon with agility (and stop dropping more daggers than anything else)

Reckoning:
As it is, is a leveling talent and a good one. Should be fused into one talent with redoubts block% effect.

[Copain]

One of the better ones on the internet. Sadly, still the usual type of idea.

I imagine someone sitting there, thinking of abilities and find out \"hey, my idea would be cool and strong and i have more of these, i am so great i should work for blizzard!\"

The easiest thing in the world, is inventing something incredibly strong, its as easy as inventing something useless. Right in this moment, i could think of a hundred things that would make paladins stronger, but thats not the goal. I guess some people think of the problems a class has in their eyes and solves them. Do you know hat happens, if you take all wisdom about problems and how to make a class deal with them and integrate them into a single class? Unnerfed deathknights.

Just making strong abilities, more flexible scaling, utility and anti-utility makes a class stronger, without a doubt, but it does not make a better, more fun, game.

Nice to know someone actually gets it, but sadly I still see so many people who take actual balanced ideas then keep trying to beef them up to ridiculous levels.

[Deleted]

Priority
#1 : Healing spell/spells! ! !
#2 : Offensive pvp utility

Would be awesome, also some frikkin logic in pvp... Protholy? ridiculous!?! To me that is seriously stupid. Same thing is starting to happen with prot in full ret gear, not quite there yet but soon ):

[ScatteredBWL]

Looking at the TBC and WotLK abilities, it seems TBC was mainly aimed at Ret, while WotLK introduced mainly Prot abilities, sooo.. maybe it's Holy's turn to get something neat

Uhm, Though I did play ret in tbc from the second the expansion came out...even got my amani war bear as ret but did you really just say that TBC was aimed at rets? Plz get off pally forums.

[Vasti]

Im hoping for a new 30cd Judgement spell (30yrds range preferably, btw 24 sec CD with talents that puts all 3 debuffs on the target, wisdom, light, justice)

And a baseline AOE heal (perhaps a AOE heal that unables you to use LoH for 1 min, so spamming that AOE heal wont let you use LoH ever!)

And finaly a utility ability, a AOE interupt or a Death grip like ability. (holy chains of GET OVER HERE!)

[Ronark]

Im hoping for a new 30cd Judgement spell (30yrds range preferably, btw 24 sec CD with talents that puts all 3 debuffs on the target, wisdom, light, justice)

Will never happen.

And finaly a utility ability, a AOE interupt or a Death grip like ability. (holy chains of GET OVER HERE!)

Lol how about a Holy Grapple Beam?

[belfpala]

Lol how about a Holy Grapple Beam?

Instant. Pulls all enemies within 30 yards to the paladin, silences them, and dazes them. Your next Divine Storm or Hammer of the Righteous has its target cap removed and does over 9000 times more damage. Buff lasts 10 seconds. If at least one target is killed by the the empowered Divine Storm or Hammer of the Righteous, the attack's cooldown is reset and Holy Grapple Beam automatically casts itself again.

[Aluana]

i just want a distance closer. tired of being the only tanking class without one.

lol if the distance closing abilities i think your talking about are charge, intercept, intervene, stuff like that then DKs lose out as well, not just paladins...

[Slavemaker]

Righteous judgement:
You can now dual wield and dual wield two handed weapons!

No not really, paladins dual wielding is just stupid =).

A new seal would be nice just because it would give blizzard another reason to make us choose which seals to use and such.

[Munk]

One of the only changes id like to see is to see the stack of seal of vengence be a debuff on our character similar to arcane blast for mages or a buff like shadow weaving for spriets, thats independent of the target were attacking, so we stop being useless on any fight that requires target swaps.

Useless might be a little heavy of a term but point stands on fights where we have to swap targets multiple times we are WAY behind other classes dps (Heroic: Northrend beasts)

[belfpala]

A new seal would be nice just because it would give blizzard another reason to make us choose which seals to use and such.

The problem with more seals is that one will always come out on top given the situation. We're in the best place we've been in terms of seal diversity right now, since we were force-fed SoV and SoComm actually got a niche buff.

If you can think of a balanced seal that covers a niche left undercovered by SoR, SoV, and SoComm, be my guest. I can't, really.

One of the only changes id like to see is to see the stack of seal of vengence be a debuff on our character similar to arcane blast for mages or a buff like shadow weaving for spriets, thats independent of the target were attacking, so we stop being useless on any fight that requires target swaps.

Useless might be a little heavy of a term but point stands on fights where we have to swap targets multiple times we are WAY behind other classes dps (Heroic: Northrend beasts)

So it would DoT whichever thing you're currently targeting? There are serious ramifications to that (especially in PvP), considering DoTs have no range once applied.

Or did you intend to change what the buff would do?

If you mean it to be a stacking buff that gets used up when we do something else, I have two problems. First, it doesn't fit into our FCFS deal unless there's a new ability to go along with it. Second, if that, it starts to look exactly like Maelstrom Weapon.

[Ronark]

Instant. Pulls all enemies within 30 yards to the paladin, silences them, and dazes them. Your next Divine Storm or Hammer of the Righteous has its target cap removed and does over 9000 times more damage. Buff lasts 10 seconds. If at least one target is killed by the the empowered Divine Storm or Hammer of the Righteous, the attack's cooldown is reset and Holy Grapple Beam automatically casts itself again.

Grapple beam works the other way around, I.E. a reverse Death Grip.

[Munk]

It wouldnt impact our FCFS rotation at all although I wouldnt have a problem with an ability being added that we had to debuff our target with (once) to start recieving full benefit of the stack.

Second im sure it would have serious ramifications ..... but it still wouldnt be more powerful than seal of cleave on pve and wouldnt really be any different than how a prot pally can multidot people with HotR. Im not sure how dots having range is of any consequence to this since you would have to be within 10yards to judge, and 5 to melee.

[sinisterr]

Tip: Writing 2 instead of 'to' and 4 instead of 'for' makes you seem like, well.. an idiot ;D

Anyway, on topic.. I'd love to see an Avatar type of ability, like the mountain king from WC3. I know we already have wings that boosts our damage, but this one would share cooldown with wings and also increase health, size and runspeed or something. I bet Warriors would get this though, and not Paladins, but you can always hope

Would also love to see some sort of AoE-ability similar to Holy Wrath, but one that deals damage to any type of creature/player, like the one Eadric the Pure casts in TotC 5-man, with some shiny spell effect.. This would be mainly for ret though, if they were thinking of making all classes equal in AoE damage output, as consecration and Divine Storm (that only hits 4 targets) can't keep up with FoK, Cat Swipe, Living Bomb.. list goes on!

My 2 cents

you mean two cents

[Ronark]

you mean two cents

No, its currency so you use '2' instead of 'two'.

[Munk]

Wouldnt it then be proper to say "my $0.02" or "my 2¢"

[Deleted]

I'll say it once and I'll say it again

baseline ability:

Bolvar's zeal:
Allows the paladin to equip a 2h+shield

and Shor only causes hight threat when under the +holy threat spell (forgot the name)

-Dk tanks won't be the only ppl needing 2h for tanking.
-Retribution will get to use Shor in their rotation and be a dps class that wears a shield, separating them from the other plate dps speccs. (warriors, go 2x 2h or 2h dps, DK, go 2x 1h or 2h, Dk goes 2h+shield, +1 for non-homogenization of classes)
-shor wont be a prot only ability
-Retri can offtank better for leveling purposes (levling in isntances)
-Holy can use a 2h spellpower mace (that boomkin/resto druids could also use) so they get use from the ability too.


prot gets +threat +better soling with a 2h
retri gets +survivability +stats +rotation
holy gets +stats +better soloing with a 2h

and its fair, because then we have 2 "specs" that tank with a 1h (Warrior and DK)
and 2 "specs" for 2h tanking (paladin prot and DK)

OPness can be combated by nerfs elsewhere I jsut wnat to wear a polearm+shield+(unequip my chest and shirt while putting on a red cape) and yell: "THIS IS SPARTAAAA"

Just.. No.