How can a mage help you?

[Haydarsadig]

I am a destruction lock... And in being such, I am specced 3/3 in Empowered Imp.

"Increases the damage done by your Imp by 15%, and all critical hits done by your Imp have a 100% chance to increase your spell critical hit chance for your next spell by 100%. This effect lasts 8 sec."

I have found that if I get Focus Magic put on the imp, the amount of times it crits increases, thus my amount of guaranteed crits increases, and my dps increases.

Any thoughts?

[dreadful]

orrrrr you could just have it put on yourself

[harky]

orrrrr you could just have it put on yourself

^

Although, if you have two Arcane Mages you can have both. That would be pretty awesome.

[KhameleonN]

Nah, I just put it on my mr. chilly.

[Deleted]

Unless your Imp does more damage then you I see no reason for putting it on him.

[Raptorg]

The imp probably won't crit every 10 seconds, so it won't be very beneficial to the mage..

Focus Magic isn't just about you, it's also about the mage.
You are very likely to crit every 10 seconds.

^

Although, if you have two Arcane Mages you can have both. That would be pretty awesome.

They would probably use it on eachother then..

[harky]

Yeah, well screw them. I want my double FM buff. :P

[vision2]

basically everything scales better with crit than warlocks


Normaly the buff is placed on ele schamans or other mages

[Joarrak]

How do ele shamans who have a major spell that is not affected at all by crit benefit more than warlocks? Or why mages, it should be the same pretty much (maybe not including increased crit percentage for ffb mages or fire mages with ignite etc), but otherwise there's nothing wrong with giving it to a warlock.

In theory what he says is correct, that by having it put on the imp you both have a 3% greater chance to crit since if the imp crits your next spell will be a crit. The reasons not to are as said before the imp probably won't crit every 10 seconds so the mage will lose 3% crit part of the time and also imps do do that much damage, 3% crit chance on the imp will barely increase its and therefore your dps, but the loss of dps from the mages lower crit will negatively impact the raid dps.

So basically, yes a mage can marginally help you, but not without a cost to himself, so it is not worth it.

[harky]

Ele Shamans get slightly more out of crit than Locks do based on scaling factors for the two classes. Destro has one of the lowest scaling factors not due to what we have that doesn't scale with Crit (Corruption, CoA, Immolate DoT depending on the fight), but because of our natural crit rate. Yes, Shaman have an auto-crit ability. On the other hand without FM I already crit nearly 60% of the time (and much more with Conflag). Shaman really don't have that going for them. Keep in mind that raid buffed, but naked you'd crit 40-50% on most spells. Since crit's worth diminishes as crit% rises we start out with a lot poorer crit scaling than others. Last I knew the highest scaling on crit was FFB and FB Mages, but neither is exactly common anymore.

[Joarrak]

Hmm I was just speculating, I'm not exactly sure how it is data wise, as crit basically only effects flame shock Dot if they are glyphed and lightning bolt whereas for warlocks it affects incinerate, immolate initial, chaos bolt, and conflagrate, and I'm pretty sure that those warlcok abilities would do more dps added together than a shamans lightning bolt and flame shock. This could but wrong but its just what I think would seem to make sense, maybe its more equal than I thought or even the other way around like you say.

And just btw, since when do warlocks crit 40-50% of the time with spells while naked but with buffs? I would imagine that number to be more around 5% + any raid buffs, so not more than 20% in any case. And also how do warlocks start at a higher crit chance than other classes? I feel like maybe i'm just missing something here but those thing confused me.

[harky]

Base crit alone is higher than 5%. Take off all your gear and look at your crit rate. Add in the 8% from talents. Now add the 3% minor and 5% major debuffs. Now the 5% debuff. Add FM for another 3%. That's 24% already without your base int/crit modifiers involved. Figure that out by just getting naked and add it to that 24%. Should be around 10%. So that's up at 34% right off the bat. Now check your Imps crit percent (keep in mind with 2p T9 this would be another 10% higher). Take that crit and apply that percentage to your non-crit mean. We're at ~34% and your Imp should be critting at least 20%. So that's an extra ~13% crit for you as well. You're already up at 47% crit. Your Conflag will distort the overall percentage though because Conflag will be at +25% crit. You can't really use the same crit rate for that though, you need to apply that before the Imp. So that puts Conflag at ~67%. Conflag is going to make up roughly 15% of your casts (being conservative). That puts your average crit at ~50%. Naked.

[Rajadin]

.... Mages help me by giving me something to drink!


back on topic, it would be more of an increase to put it on you.

[Dominate]

.... Mages help me by giving me something to drink!


back on topic, it would be more of an increase to put it on you.

Warlocks don't eat or drink they feed on the souls of their enemies *burp*

[gherkin]

Why would a mage help you? They can just focus magic each other.

[Zamfix]

orrrrr you could just have it put on yourself

But since everytime the imp crits, the warlock crits too, so putting it on the imp would be like giving the buff to the imp AND the warlock. Why wouldn't you do this if you were going to give it to the warlock anyway?

[harky]

Because of how Empowered Imp works it's not as good as you're thinking. The Imp will gain 3% crit, yes. Let's assume you have fairly low crit, which puts you at lets say 60% average. That means the 3% gain to your Imp is a 1.2% crit rate increase to you. That's because 60% of the time when Empowered Imp procs you would have crit anyway. So is 3% extra crit for your Imp going to make up for 1.8% lost crit for yourself? Highly doubtful.