Bloodlust (moonkins)

[Deleted]

Bloodlust is a great spell. No doubt it increases our damage, but it doesn’t quite offer the same benefits to us as it does to other classes. It’s like getting the smallest piece of cake. Sure, you get some cake, but not as much as all the other kids!

Why am I complaining about bloodlust? During a 40 second bloodlust, we can expect to have two eclipse buffs – 15 seconds of lunar eclipse, 15 seconds of solar eclipse and give or take 10 seconds to spare. While we are spamming starfire under lunar eclipse, with almost a 100% chance to crit, with a cast time of under two seconds, and our damage flies upwards. That’s great, and its great for everyone. But then the long haste buff is ripped away from us, like the class bully stealing our lunch money, when solar eclipse procs.

What to do? Continue casting faster starfires with 45% less chance to crit (with tier 8 2-piece bonus) or switch to wrath to benefit from the +45% damage increase. Our damage is dependant on taking advantage of eclipse, and while Mr. Mage and Mrs. Rogue gets a flat benefit to their damage for the full 40 seconds, we are at a loss once lunar eclipse falls off.

Bloodlust is absolutely useless when we are spamming wrath, because we will usually have a constant buff from Nature’s Grace, bringing our cast time down to the global cooldown, regardless of having bloodlust or not. We gain absolutely nothing from the 30% haste increase when we are spamming wrath, and we have to either let go of half of the duration and gain from bloodlust, or continue casting starfire without the benefit of eclipse. Fast starfires are nice and all, but 1,7 (ish) second starfires still struggle to live up to +45% damage 1 second wraths.

How do you handle it?

Shamelessly stolen from my blog, to spike the conversation.

[Fonzey]

WiseEclipse can be configured to cancel your solar eclipse as soon as the lunar eclipse cooldown finishes, providing you've got bloodlust up.

This means that you're eligible to proc Lunar more frequently when BL is up, but you're potentially opening yourself up to some RnG punishment if you fail to proc back into Lunar within a couple of casts.

Also, I'm the raidleader for my guild - so have the advantage of calling on BL whenever it suits me :P (when solar is about to end).

[Deleted]

Whats the point? When we go from Lunar into Solar with WiseEclipse, then the CD for lunar eclipse will be up when solar ends. At best case, we get bloodlust just as lunar procs, which is 15 seconds of benefit, then 15 seconds of not, and then we magically, instantly proc lunar eclipse again, giving us another 10 seconds of casting. So at best, we can benefit from bloodlust for a maximum of 25 seconds. That is the point of the post.

[Drakuru]

It’s like getting the smallest piece of cake. Sure, you get some cake, but not as much as all the other kids!

Well you aren't the only 1 who don't get a lot think about spriest pre- 3.3 they only get faster mind flays. think about death knights, they only attack faster, which doesn't increase theire dps that much. Don't QQ please that much.

[Fonzey]

Whats the point? When we go from Lunar into Solar with WiseEclipse, then the CD for lunar eclipse will be up when solar ends. At best case, we get bloodlust just as lunar procs, which is 15 seconds of benefit, then 15 seconds of not, and then we magically, instantly proc lunar eclipse again, giving us another 10 seconds of casting. So at best, we can benefit from bloodlust for a maximum of 25 seconds. That is the point of the post.

Yeah I understand with the point of your post, and I agree we're gimped during BL - but I was stating how I dealt with it, which was what you were asking.

The WiseEclipse cancel Solar function is only of use if you have downtime between Lunar/Solar - which yes is rare, but it does happen (target switching, moving, etc)

[Lightfist]

I'm a prot Paladin. Heroism/bloodlust totally helps me.


Totally.

[Master Guns]

Why are you complaining then if you benefit from it for 25 seconds? Not ever buff in this game does 100% the same thing for every class and spec. That includes Bloodlust. Be glad you aren't an aff lock. Guess how much they benefit from bloodlust.

[Dapuh]

Well you aren't the only 1 who don't get a lot think about spriest pre- 3.3 they only get faster mind flays. think about death knights, they only attack faster, which doesn't increase theire dps that much. Don't QQ please that much.

The Gargoyle gets the haste bonus of Bloodlust if you summon it when the buff is up. I think we actually get alot of Bloodlust, more than others. (Think about those Autohit "procs" like Necrosis.)

But i do not think that you have to complain about Bloodlust if your raid gets better, stop QQing and be happy about phat lootz and achievements.

[Ryuuou]

I know that cat druids must LOVE blood/hero. I mean, going from 1second to .7 seconds is huge right? Most casters benefit from this more than melee. Big exceptions are probably fury warriors and enh shaman. Maelstrom procs are great.

[Deleted]

Well you aren't the only 1 who don't get a lot think about spriest pre- 3.3 they only get faster mind flays. think about death knights, they only attack faster, which doesn't increase theire dps that much. Don't QQ please that much.

What, a constructive post regarding things that hinder our DPS is just QQ? A DK's melee swings are still a large, and constant, part of their DPS. They are balanced around having bloodlust for the full duration, and they benefit from it for the full duration. We get 15-20 seconds of actual benefits from bloodlust. Besides that, comparing a ranged to a melee is not the way to go.

Shadow priests gain a HUGE buff next patch so haste benefits their dots. I cannot even begin to explain how big a buff that will be for them, and that will only be a lot more evident during bloodlust.

I'm a prot Paladin. Heroism/bloodlust totally helps me.


Totally.

I dont think bloodlust is generally cast for tanks much

Why are you complaining then if you benefit from it for 25 seconds? Not ever buff in this game does 100% the same thing for every class and spec. That includes Bloodlust. Be glad you aren't an aff lock. Guess how much they benefit from bloodlust.

Next patch, warlocks can glyph corruption to benefit from haste, much like the buff spriests are getting. (Glyph of Quick Decay: This glyph allows for the warlock's haste to reduce the time between periodic damage effects of Corruption.)

Even disregarding this, imagine a mage during bloodlust. They benefit the full 40 seconds, as does elemental shamans, warlocks of different specs and so on. We are restricted, and that is the issue i bring up here.

The Gargoyle gets the haste bonus of Bloodlust if you summon it when the buff is up. I think we actually get alot of Bloodlust, more than others. (Think about those Autohit "procs" like Necrosis.)

But i do not think that you have to complain about Bloodlust if your raid gets better, stop QQing and be happy about phat lootz and achievements.

We're talking about class balance here. We are on a downward slope, and with the upgrades coming in ICC, we are still going to try to be around 400 haste, crit is going to be worth only half of its current bonus because we are so close to 100% even without T82P bonus, and we don't benefit as much from raid buffs as other casters do.

I know that cat druids must LOVE blood/hero. I mean, going from 1second to .7 seconds is huge right? Most casters benefit from this more than melee. Big exceptions are probably fury warriors and enh shaman. Maelstrom procs are great.

Again, i dont condone comparing a caster to a melee. Cats still benefit the full 40 second duration, and their melee swings are about 33% of their total damage.

[shags the penguin]

Dam Qieth, you are one funky chicken!

[enotsdarb]

WiseEclipse can be configured to cancel your solar eclipse as soon as the lunar eclipse cooldown finishes, providing you've got bloodlust up.

This means that you're eligible to proc Lunar more frequently when BL is up, but you're potentially opening yourself up to some RnG punishment if you fail to proc back into Lunar within a couple of casts.

Also, I'm the raidleader for my guild - so have the advantage of calling on BL whenever it suits me :P (when solar is about to end).

wow, what a great raid leader you are!

[Dapuh]

Dam Qieth, you are one funky chicken!

kfc - kill the funky chicken?

[Deleted]

kfc - kill the funky chicken?

I thought about Kalimdor Fried Chicken :P

[Whistler]

God what a bunch of douchebags.
OP playing own class comes to HIS CLASS forums to discuss with other players of his class how to deal with totally reasonable concern about his class mechanics and bloodlust.
And suddenly alot of randoms playing warriors/deathknights/paladins and other dumbasses which can add ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to discussion jump in and start random flame train.
Seriously GTFO.
If you post something like

I mean, going from 1second to .7 seconds is huge right?

you already showed that you are absolutely clueless.

To OP - yeah it sucks but reason lies in way how Eclipse mechanics implemented and how broken Wrath+NG interaction is.
I tried experimenting a bit with keeping just Starfire and renewing dots when we fall from Lunar during bloodlust and still it falls behind proper rotation.
Only way to fix it imo is to increase Eclipse durations by 10 seconds (while increasing it's cooldown respectivly) and doing something about Wrath (totally reworking how it interacts with Nature's grace - for example making NG provide spellpower boost for next cast instead of haste). This might solve boomkin dps scaling problems.

[Gilian]

I am an elemental shaman and i don't get any benefit from spirit buffs while moonkins benefit from it the whole fight. It hinders my dps. This is not just QQ.

Oh wait... elemental dps really does suck. Even compared to a moonkin.

[Gilian]

Shadow priests gain a HUGE buff next patch so haste benefits their dots. I cannot even begin to explain how big a buff that will be for them, and that will only be a lot more evident during bloodlust.
I dont think bloodlust is generally cast for tanks much
Next patch, warlocks can glyph corruption to benefit from haste, much like the buff spriests are getting. (Glyph of Quick Decay: This glyph allows for the warlock's haste to reduce the time between periodic damage effects of Corruption.

They needed the buffs. You don't.

[Deleted]

Again, i dont condone comparing a caster to a melee. Cats still benefit the full 40 second duration, and their melee swings are about 33% of their total damage.

Yeah cats hit for ~33%, and heroism gives us +30%, that's a 30%*33 = ~10% dmg increase and 30% more Clearcasting procs which might be 2-3% more dmg. Compare that to say, a mage casting 30% more fireballs and pyroblasts, therefor increasing their dmg by 30% and u'll notice that u'r not the only one unhappy about it.

[AscenStormRage]

Don't forget trees can benefit from it if summoned before bloodlust, and we all know Trees are the best DoT in the game ^.^ mine fir for about 600 a piece and crit for 1200 and they hit once per second

[Goatonlb]

Qieth everytime I see you post here I cringe. Probably just a change in perspective, but I can't imagine the responses you'll get here are going to be any sort of help compared to the EJ thread. Although I enjoy watching people try to argue with you 8)

On topic, as someone else mentioned, extending the length of the buff would help. I really don't see any way around this problem without drastic changes to the talent itself though. We'll always have to live with RNG the way it's set up, and we'll always benefit less from Blood/Hero than other classes/specs.