How good/bad is ArP for enhance?

[sethers656]

Before, I was avoiding ArPen like the plague. I just didnt like it on my gear. For a while, I was able to avoid it almost completely. But almost every piece of gear has ArP on it now....

I am only at 121 ArPen because I still try to keep it off my gear as much as possible. At one point, I heard that 2 ArP was worse than 1 haste.... Is this true? Should I try to be avoiding it still?

Or is it an actual good stat? I just dont like upgrading ilvls but gaining ArP.... It almost feel like im not upgrading when I trade crit/haste/or AP for ArP....

It really makes armor decisions hard for me. Like should I go for my next piece of T9 with my emblems of triump or go for the ring even though it has 50 ArP on it. Id porlly go for the T9 pants replacing my conquest badge ones, or i can replace my valor badge ring.....

Not only this choice, but a lot of others have come up with ArP making it hard for me to decide.... Please help me with this decision and hopefully give me a good basis on deciding.... I have tried downloading Rawr but it doesnt seem to work for me. I can try again, if it will really solve my problem that easily.

P.S. I raid ToC 10 mans every week with my guild. Trying to start ToC 25, but the gear is coming slowly

My armory is in my siggy if you click on the picture. I should be in my PvE enhance gear/spec. I will take any other advice you guys see fit.

[Jebuz]

Generally speaking its not a stat you want to gun for, since alot of our damage comes from shocks and lightning bolt. Comparing items of similar quality/ilvl you're going to usually want the ones without arpen. I don't think getting the badge ring would be the best since there's better things you could spend your badges on.

[Deleted]

There are numerous tools that demonstrate exactly how good or bad individual stats are. I've recently spent a lot of time adding a new graphing feature to Rawr so that users can see which stat performs best. Try it out its REALLY easy to use - link is in my sig.

The issue with ArP is that it affects only ~50% of our dps and so scales really badly compared with other stats. AP & Haste both effect all our attacks and so scale a lot better. (AP gives 30% SP with Mental Quickness and is why it scales for spells as well as physical attacks).

[Deleted]

ArP doesn't do anything for Lava Lash, that deals Fire Damage. Only makes autoswings/SS/WF hit harder.

[sethers656]

ok, well I just downloaded Rawr. I was being stupid with it before. I usually dont have to deal with unzipping files.... I will mess around with it later, it seems pretty complex....

But if I shouldnt get the ring what should I get? Would the T9 pants be better for me? How do I use Rawr to figure it out?

[Deleted]

1) Unzip Rawr v2.2.27 to a directory you have write access to - in Vista this will NOT be c:\program files. If you have Vista or Windows 7 I'd suggest c:\users\YourUserName\Rawr v2.2.27

2) Run Rawr

3) Use the Load from Armoury option and load your character

4) view the charts to see what items would be upgrades, NB. you can use the filter options to filter out content you are unable to do

5) mark gear you have available (eg: in bags/bank as well as equipped)

6) Run the optimiser to select from the marked gear and built a best in slot from that gear.

7) View your character in 3d for fun.

Watch the video provided to see exactly how all that works.

[sethers656]

TYVM Levva. I have always wanted to try and get Rawr but never really put in the time for figuring out how. It seems very interesting, and I am sure I will be messing with it a lot in my spare time.

[Gorobei]

My beef is that most of the badge gear has ArP on it. >

Even the new badge gear coming out in 3.3

Looks like the only non-ArP piece is the Belt again...

This makes for a Sad Panda. :'(

[thehoodie]

My beef is that most of the badge gear has ArP on it. >

Even the new badge gear coming out in 3.3

Looks like the only non-ArP piece is the Belt again...

This makes for a Sad Panda. :'(

Why? It's not like it's bad just to HAVE it. If it's an overall better item than what you're wearing, then it's never a reason to avoid an upgrade.

[Monticristo]

My beef is that most of the badge gear has ArP on it. >

Even the new badge gear coming out in 3.3

Looks like the only non-ArP piece is the Belt again...

This makes for a Sad Panda. :'(

Is that not because ArP is good for Hunters? I do not play a Hunter and have no clue whether or not a Hunter might make use of ArP. I do know that Hunters do have quite a few elemental attacks themselves(fire, nature, shadow, and frost), but I cannot remember the optimal rotations for each tree.

[Karnadas]

Is that not because ArP is good for Hunters? I do not play a Hunter and have no clue whether or not a Hunter might make use of ArP. I do know that Hunters do have quite a few elemental attacks themselves(fire, nature, shadow, and frost), but I cannot remember the optimal rotations for each tree.

Marksman likes ArP past a certain point, and Surv doesn't iirc.

Thanks for the advice about the shamans btw, I'm leveling one myself so I check here from time to time, and a huge thanks to Levva for all the work you do!

[sethers656]

To my knowledge, yes Arp is much better for hunters, espicially MM. But I don think it is that good for survival. I just dont get why Blizz would put ooo much arp on so much of our gear knowing that enhance and surv can live without the arp....

[Gorobei]

Why? It's not like it's bad just to HAVE it. If it's an overall better item than what you're wearing, then it's never a reason to avoid an upgrade.

I don't avoid ArP like the plague. I have 2 ilvl 245 pieces with ArP on it, and a ring with ArP from 10man ToC.

But would i be stoked if the ArP on the gear was Haste or Crit instead?

Hell yes i would!

Hence my saddness when i saw that most of the new Badge gear has ArP on it again.

[Fornaw]

Why? It's not like it's bad just to HAVE it. If it's an overall better item than what you're wearing, then it's never a reason to avoid an upgrade.

Basically all mail pieces have Agi, Stam, Int, and AP, then they add 2 stats from the set {Haste, Crit, ArP, Hit}. Of those ArP is the worst stat for enh by a pretty good margin. Considering hunters also like Crit, and need a certain amount of Hit and Haste it seems fair that some of the badge gear would have 2 of those three stats. Looking over some of the other pieces though, it's pretty clear that many of the badge rewards are not done yet, so we shall wait and see.

@the OP, the triumph ring is better than the valor ring, but upgrading tier slots first is most likely your best option.

[Eyetotem]

I think the whole thing is, do not try to avoid the ArP. Sure it is not optimal but do not keep an Ilvl 219 piece if a 232 piece is overall better. It is like a STR ring, it sucks by all means but if no one else is going to take it and it is better than what you are wearing then you take it.


and to the person talking about the ArP ring from ToC10.......that socket will make you overlook a few stats on that item.

[Mestlaul]

I'd like to call this a flaw in itemization, however it'll probably be smoothed out with Cataclysm. Reason for me thinking this:

Enhancement hates Arm Pen but loves Haste
MM hunters hate Haste but love Arm Pen

If you ask me, they're currently catering towards MM hunters, which makes me a sad panda aswell

It's not long left for Arm Pen in the game however... What I do hate is Expertise tho!

[Gorobei]

and to the person talking about the ArP ring from ToC10.......that socket will make you overlook a few stats on that item.

I agree, that is the only reason i'm using the ring LOL.

without that socket... the ring kinda sucks. :'(

[Fornaw]

I think the whole thing is, do not try to avoid the ArP. Sure it is not optimal but do not keep an Ilvl 219 piece if a 232 piece is overall better. It is like a STR ring, it sucks by all means but if no one else is going to take it and it is better than what you are wearing then you take it.


and to the person talking about the ArP ring from ToC10.......that socket will make you overlook a few stats on that item.

Conversely though an item with appropriate stats (Agi+AP) and no ArP is almost always better than an item of the same ilvl without ArP. So yeah in the case of 219->232 its okay to get some ArP, in the case of 219->226 it most likely isn't.