is merlin's robe bis?... or close?

[Lark]

If you can't get a robe off togc icehowl you have no business being concerned with 'BiS' gear since you're not in a decent enough guild for it to matter. You should be worried about getting into a guild where people don't routinely get mashed into the wall by yetis and think snobolds are like pokemon.

And no I'm saying anyone in here is that bad, I'm saying if you regard 258 gear as hard to get you need to get your head checked.

Stat weights are dynamic and vary with every gear change, they are not static like talent points

The value of your talent points change with every patch! Especially for warlocks eeeee


Crusader orb value isn't going to get any lower especially at 3.3. And there will be better gear to get anyway. Pay a lot now for something pretty damn good or pay almost as much later for something you should have been using a month ago? Hmm. Interesting choice.

[Joelene]

ofc. the crusader prise will plummet.. AH will be floading with those

[Evictoray]

The value of your talent points change with every patch! Especially for warlocks eeeee

Your comparing the ability to swap gear around with occasional changes to our talent trees? More insightful info :

[harky]

I know for my setup it's 4th in slot and 2nd at 245. So it's BiS pre-heroic pre-hardmode for me.

1) Robes of Ascent (258)
2) Skyweaver (258)
3) Robes of Ascent (245)
4) Merlins

It's ranked much lower if you need hit as far as I know. Even under the T9 245 chest.

[Peepo]

If you can't get a robe off togc icehowl you have no business being concerned with 'BiS' gear since you're not in a decent enough guild for it to matter. You should be worried about getting into a guild where people don't routinely get mashed into the wall by yetis and think snobolds are like pokemon.

And no I'm saying anyone in here is that bad, I'm saying if you regard 258 gear as hard to get you need to get your head checked.The value of your talent points change with every patch! Especially for warlocks eeeee


Crusader orb value isn't going to get any lower especially at 3.3. And there will be better gear to get anyway. Pay a lot now for something pretty damn good or pay almost as much later for something you should have been using a month ago? Hmm. Interesting choice.

i'm simply weighing if it's worth it to keep a merlin's robe for myself or cash in on the market need... i'm not sure what being able to farm icehowl has to do with anything... personal goals may be to acquire the best gear whether it in the end helps the guild or not... and yeah 258 gear isn't hard to get if you are in a hardcore raiding guild, but for casuals it's a bit tougher (and i'm willing to bet there are far more casuals then hardcores, otherwise blizz wouldn't be spending so much time on this new pugging system)... so step off your elitist stool and either add something constructive to the thread or stfu?...

crusader orb value will drop like a rock within a week of 3.3 dropping... just like frozen orbs, and runed orbs did before it...

[harky]

If you're worried about a month from now and not right now, then don't worry about BiS gear. It won't be BiS when ICC is released. If you actually care about working hard now, then do that. Don't worry about playing the market.

[frozenvoid]

http://maxdps.com/warlock/destruction.php

There you go bro

Also it is best for arcane mages and if your not arcane your doing it wrong

[harky]

Hurray for maxdps.... :-\ You realize how incredibly inaccurate that is... maybe not? Rawr is a vastly better tool and even that is highly inferior to making a wowhead profile and importing it to simcraft to experiment. Maxdps breeds bad dps... and ruins their gear.

[Menestheus]

Rawr is great for mages. Almost as bad as maxdps and its ilk for warlocks. Get Simcraft and call it a day, nothing else is even CLOSE to as accurate or useful.

[zuxia]

If you can't get a robe off togc icehowl you have no business being concerned with 'BiS' gear since you're not in a decent enough guild for it to matter. You should be worried about getting into a guild where people don't routinely get mashed into the wall by yetis and think snobolds are like pokemon.

As most people will not see 258 gear...you remove that tier and find out what is BIS for ilvl245 gear..So ya it is still a BIS list. Alot of us include ilvl 258 gear since and make the disclamers as such..myself and ghkerin in addition for both types of players. So you have no business telling others not to worry about BIS, since there is a BIS list for ilvl 245 gear and ilvl 258 gear.

[Linwelina]

Merlin's robe is not BiS even for a 245 "list"

[Menestheus]

As most people will not see 258 gear...you remove that tier and find out what is BIS for ilvl245 gear..So ya it is still a BIS list. Alot of us include ilvl 258 gear since and make the disclamers as such..myself and ghkerin in addition for both types of players. So you have no business telling others not to worry about BIS, since there is a BIS list for ilvl 245 gear and ilvl 258 gear.

There was no disclaimer in this thread. And, really, even with a disclaimer it's kind of stupid to call it a Best in Slot list if it's not actually listing the Best in each slot.

[torny]

The EJ list is BiS 245Gear not BiS (the list with merlin robe)
So in a way its BiS .. for 245 gear.. Not BiS overall

People just learned a new word and they're using it (BiS (which isn't even a word))

[gherkin]

People who have to ask "Is this BIS?" are asking "Is this BIS for me, someone who cannot plan on seeing heroic rated gear, let alone winning the roll?". They just don't want to end up in the following conversation:

Asker: Is this the best choice for me?
People: No, 258 is
Asker: I won't see 258 any time soon.
People: LOLFAILSCRUB
Asker: So... is it?
People: /argue incoherently over crafted vs random drops
Asker: /applies godwin's law


Also, people who want "BIS Period" know where to look and won't post here. Or are lazy :P

[Peepo]

i think your very first response was exactly what i was looking... didn't mean to spin off 3 pages of 245 vs 258 battles...

[zuxia]

There was no disclaimer in this thread. And, really, even with a disclaimer it's kind of stupid to call it a Best in Slot list if it's not actually listing the Best in each slot.

To quote myself "It is BIS till ilvl 258 gear according to elitistjerks.com" pg 1 about 3rd post.

Actually no it is not stupid to call it best in slot in reference to certain attainable gear levels...I.E. If you will not ever see heroic 25 TOC...Then your best in slot ilvl is 245 not ilvl 258.

[zuxia]

Merlin's robe is not BiS even for a 245 "list"

see http://elitistjerks.com/f80/t74095-w...endium_v3_2_a/

[harky]

It's worth noting that the list you posted is out of date and is not a '245' list. It's also inaccurate as a 'true' BiS list however as it still lists double Reign as BiS as well as a few other options with clear upgrades. The other main problem is it lumps BiS gear together for Suppression and non-Suppression specs. Their BiS setup for 0/13/58 is not hit capped, but values Hit above Haste and SP, while gemming Haste in yellows. It's also why you can take the simcraft thread's gear setup, regem or swap a few pieces off and get a DPS gain in the simulation from the numbers provided. IE; The tests are optimized for 3/13/55, not 0/13/58. It's also why the current numbers they have showing 3/13/55 ahead of 0/13/58 are suspect. Shifting gems to hit instead of haste for the 0/13/58 spec results in 0/13/58 being ahead.

Anyway, only point was that link is both out of date and not even a link to a 245 list as you implied.

[burek]

of course that 258 gear is better than 245 one, but it was pretty obvious that we were all supposed to get that robe and bracers crafted as soon as possible to boost our dps. after a few months, its expected for people to have some better items in those slots, but still, for new people, they are the way to go at the beginning

[zuxia]

It's worth noting that the list you posted is out of date and is not a '245' list. It's also inaccurate as a 'true' BiS list however as it still lists double Reign as BiS as well as a few other options with clear upgrades. The other main problem is it lumps BiS gear together for Suppression and non-Suppression specs. Their BiS setup for 0/13/58 is not hit capped, but values Hit above Haste and SP, while gemming Haste in yellows. It's also why you can take the simcraft thread's gear setup, regem or swap a few pieces off and get a DPS gain in the simulation from the numbers provided. IE; The tests are optimized for 3/13/55, not 0/13/58. It's also why the current numbers they have showing 3/13/55 ahead of 0/13/58 are suspect. Shifting gems to hit instead of haste for the 0/13/58 spec results in 0/13/58 being ahead.

Anyway, only point was that link is both out of date and not even a link to a 245 list as you implied.

I was not meaning to imply a comprehensive bis ilvl 245 list, so I do apologize for that.
Was just attempting to show the value of Merlins versus the alteratives. In addition you could go to maxdps.com and see the same thing for each slot...now I will grant you that maxdps is not the best, but it does show ilvi 245 and 258 gear together and the releative dps between items for the same slot.