Does Divine Sacrifice / Divine Guardian Become the mandatory filler for prot?

[Evereghalo]

The change seems very nice for 10mans to reduce a nice burst of raid damage,

I already use it stand alone when doing 25man ToGC twin valks when the other tanks Valk does the aoe vortex.

Thoughts

[Ronark]

If you go for a 0/53/18 for max TPS, you only have point to play with to put in either:
1/5 Divinity
1/2 Guardian's Favor
1/3 Stoicism
1/1 Divine Sacrifice

Given these choices, Divine Sacrifice is obviously the best choice.

Depends on spec and raid size I guess. I'd grab it with Prot likely with Holy but not sure. As for retri on 25man I think Aura Mastery will be better but on 10man DS/DG may be worth the trouble.

For Ret it is a DPS loss, where (depending on your makeup) AM is not.

[Evereghalo]

If you go for a 0/53/18 for max TPS, you only have point to play with to put in either:
1/5 Divinity
1/2 Guardian's Favor
1/3 Stoicism
1/1 Divine Sacrifice

Given these choices, Divine Sacrifice is obviously the best choice.
For Ret it is a DPS loss, where (depending on your makeup) AM is not.

1) Agreed, thats why I said prot like twice in my post.

2) Max threat spec would be 3/5 Reckoning, though because of 1) BR is gonna come back into play 2) Because of the nature of SoV

[Ronark]

1) Agreed, thats why I said prot like twice in my post.

2) Max threat spec would be 3/5 Reckoning, though because of 1) BR is gonna come back into play 2) Because of the nature of SoV

Does Reckoning proc the 33% Seal hit as well? I thought it didn't.

[DaGhostDS]

Does Reckoning proc the 33% Seal hit as well? I thought it didn't.

wait what Reckoning proc !?

[Ronark]

wait what Reckoning proc !?

With the DR on Dodge in 3.3, you'll be getting hit a lot more from Bosses, which leads to reckoning procing more to the point where it is somewhat useful.

[Raptorg]

Does Reckoning proc the 33% Seal hit as well? I thought it didn't.

It just causes you to swing twice with your main hand.

So it probably will.
Unless it's hit for "yellow" damage, I don't see why it couldn't.

[Lightfist]

Alright, I'm going to go ahead and end the Reckoning Versus Crusade debate right here.

Mobs affected by Crusade: +200 TPS over Reckoning

Mobs not: -1 TPS under Reckoning.

There we go.

[Evereghalo]

Alright, I'm going to go ahead and end the Reckoning Versus Crusade debate right here.

Mobs affected by Crusade: +200 TPS over Reckoning

Mobs not: -1 TPS under Reckoning.

There we go.

That is not the debate idiot.

The debate was if Reckoning proc'ed SoV secondary ability.

Which was a secondary comment I made about 3/5 reckoning being better for a max threat than DS/DG.

And thanks for input on the primary subject matter.

- - - -

Agreed,

So for max threat Reckoning will come into play.

But for survival I think the new DS will be too good.

[Lightfist]

That is not the debate idiot.

The debate was if Reckoning proc'ed SoV secondary ability.

Which was a secondary comment I made about 3/5 reckoning being better for a max threat than DS/DG.

And thanks for input on the primary subject matter.

- - - -

Agreed,

So for max threat Reckoning will come into play.

But for survival I think the new DS will be too good.

Well, ya' got me there - I was popping in and out of game, so I didn't really read the entirety of said post. I apologize, and as for the initial topic, yes, I think it will be the mandatory fill talent. Even on single tank fights, your other tank can pick up and you popping it would be a nice little piece of mitigation until the heals get back under control or whatever the case may be.

[Offhand]

For progression, and especially hardmodes, DS/DG was already a way better option then the other two possible choices (3/5 divinity or reckoning).

[cappytoi]

I guess reckoning is proccing from any damaging (including full blocks) attack, making reckoning worth on the constant AoE fights, I still think DS is a bit risky in ToC and not really necessary, it is only essential at champions but that is where you are going to your off-spec (if you have any) anyway. The new DS+DG combination seems interesting and quite useful especially if you will get the raid dmg reduction yourself, giving us another cooldown which is 6 sec. I guess this may be a bit OP and leads to a nerf on AD.

[jenseits]

I currently use it when i dps in raids because i find that buffer really helps when i use it. Now im very happy that i can use it practically every CD and won't have to worry about being gibbed, as long as i get in the tank group

[Raiss]

Hi, I'm a Paladin. I can make my raid group imortal for 10 seconds.

Yes, it's mandatory.

[G l o w y r m]

Hi, I'm a Paladin. I can make my raid group imortal for 10 seconds.

Yes, it's mandatory.

Isn't it party only in 3.3 or am I mistaken?

I wouldn't say immortal really, but it does make healing a little easier for a while during the right situations. I'm talking 3.3 changes of course.

[YouMadMan]

Its already mendatory for Holy that are doing heroic modes of toc. Its getting changed to something even better and more reliable. Right now as holy during a divine shield you can lower the damage so much the HPS that comes from this ability on fight like twin valkyr is extremly high and a holy paladin would be hard pressed to not want this ability.

For Prot is a very good talent for an off tank and generaly when i main tank i barely ever use it. The 3.3 version however is much more useful to tank and it will be used as often as needed by an offtank and mt. The ability can reduce the damage on the whole party and since the paladin also benifite from the spell itself the damage returned is actualy pretty low and the damage cap is now much higher so you dont need divine shield to have a full duration.

Ret, should be getting this as well since it will never one shot you. The thing cannot kill you anymore and the damage on yourself is so reduced any ret paladin in serious raiding will not pass this ability. Put the ret in the tank party and this is an extra mini shield wall.

PVP the ability main power in pvp is still the same. Undispellable version of hand of sac. Break all the on damage cc with it. Reduce the damage greatly and this time around it doesent wreck your hp so bad. Then again it didnt realy do that much in pvp since you usualy beacon yourself.

[Raiss]

Isn't it party only in 3.3 or am I mistaken?

I wouldn't say immortal really, but it does make healing a little easier for a while during the right situations. I'm talking 3.3 changes of course.

We are still at 3.2.

[Nillo]

Ret, should be getting this as well since it will never one shot you. The thing cannot kill you anymore and the damage on yourself is so reduced any ret paladin in serious raiding will not pass this ability. Put the ret in the tank party and this is an extra mini shield wall.

I prefer aura mastery for magical damage heavy fights.

For progression, and especially hardmodes, DS/DG was already a way better option then the other two possible choices (3/5 divinity or reckoning).

Yep 1 min Sacred Shield > 3/5 of something that's not needed.

[arel00]

Isn't it party only in 3.3 or am I mistaken?

It is. But the new Divine Guardian becomes insanely good, because you can blow it without bubbling.

[Lebeau]

Divine Sacrifice is party only. NO one cares about DSac.

Divine Guardian however is 20% raidwide damage reduction. This is what people want. Any sane tank shouldn't even have to ask if they should get 2/2 DG. ESPECIALLY now that you can do it without having to bubble AND it can now be done every 2 mins instead of 5.

The same tanks that don't see any worth in DG are the same idiot tanks that refuse to Sacred Shield themselves.