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  1. #21
    Dreadlord thundercles's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by lyraorpheus
    well..but there is no other good stats for us.

    what else can blizzard give? haste instead of crit? holy pally has too much haste already and get soft cap easily.

    more sp? overhealing No. 1 is paladin. FoL spec is not viable for endgame raiding since lvl 70, unfortunately due to the easy mode of FoL, as a healer you don't need to watch your mana. many noobs think it's powerful spec for raiding.

    give int only? it makes gear look stupid anyway.
    This. If the OP is trying to say "yea crit just isn't as good as it used to be..." then I totally agree.
    But it isn't as if they have given us a better stat in place of crit.
    Not as good as it used to be? Sure. But our WORST STAT? HARDLY.

    MP5 is still the worst pally stat.

    Furthermore, I'm already at the haste soft cap in full t9. Pushing it beyond that is silly. Do you really think you'll get that much out of mp5?

  2. #22
    219 posts and still cunting MildCorma's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    I was going to write out a whole wall of text thing here about Blizzard using our gear to nerf us, but instead I'm just going let the example do all the talking.

    http://db.mmo-champion.com/items/4/?...64&itemset=899

    The tier 10 Holy set. And EVERY piece with Crit. Of all the currently discovered spell plate, only ONE doesn't have Crit.

    Hope everyone likes mail. Cause it's shaping up to be the only place we can get SP/Haste/MP5.

    Loot is supposed to be our reward. Not our punishment. Nerfing a class through its gear is ridiculous.
    I hate to say it but if Blizzard wanted you to play with those stats then the tier gear would have them. It just so happens that paladins raiding at the top end highly value crit, nd it suits their playsyles perfectly so you must be doing - something- wrong somewhere.

  3. #23

    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Immamoonkin
    ..you realize they're they will be balancing the game and changing the classes a bit for the big stat change.... right?

    I hope you do.
    I thought about this as a possibility. But in the end, it doesn't make sense. Just as BC gear didn't last long in WOTLK, the likely hood of any of us using T10 very far into 85 is remote at best.

    Besides, the stat distribution Haste/MP5 does exist (and hopefully will exist on more). Completely removing it from our Tier doesn't have anything to do with Cata.
    <WHAR LEWTS PLZ HALp>
    I'm bitter by default. Don't take it personally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stir View Post
    Either give an argument, or be automatically wrong. Your choice.

  4. #24
    Mechagnome Immamoonkin's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Why are people STILL arguing over this?

    THEY ARE GOING TO CHANGE EVERYONE WHEN CATA COMES OUT. YOU WILL NOT BE GIMPED. THINGS WILL WORK OUT. STOP FEARING WHAT MIGHT BE.

    If we were already in Cataclysm, and the stats did nerf you, then I would totally understand this post.
    But you guys are acting like they're changing nothing else in this game other than the stats. Come on guys! If something that hasn't been done yet strikes so much fear into you that you have to post a rage thread, go outside and breathe.

    Okay, it's about the new tier set. My bad.

    ...you still need to relax though.

  5. #25

    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronark
    More Int or SP.

    Just allocate the "gear points" from Crit over to either of these and it is fine.
    It doesn't work that way :>
    Base stats on items are always similar and moving point from Extra stats to base stats would usually greatly impact the total item value, because the Extra stats are usually cheaper than the base stats.

    Quote Originally Posted by Firecrest
    Haste/MP5
    I'm not saying that every single piece of gear or every single piece of our tier gear should be perfectly itemized. All I'm saying is the fact that NONE of out tier gear has our best itemization on it is ridiculous.
    Is haste still better than crit after you pass the soft haste cap?
    If not the itemization would be :
    Haste/Mp5 (until cap) > MP5/Crit > Haste/Crit
    Armories:
    Pally: Chiaki
    Dk: Telare
    Warrior: Irlida

  6. #26

    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    How often does your 30k mana run out?

    T10 stats currently add 553 intellect. What's that in mana for you guys, 15 each? More because of talents? So at least 8000 mana from FIVE pieces of gear?

    And how could you not like critical heals?

  7. #27
    Dreadlord thundercles's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Firecrest
    I thought about this as a possibility. But in the end, it doesn't make sense. Just as BC gear didn't last long in WOTLK, the likely hood of any of us using T10 very far into 85 is remote at best.

    Besides, the stat distribution Haste/MP5 does exist (and hopefully will exist on more). Completely removing it from our Tier doesn't have anything to do with Cata.
    I made the grind from 70 to 80 wearing mostly lvl 70 pvp gear. It was far better than any of the higher ilvl quest greens and blues. My assumption would be that the next xpac will be similar.

  8. #28
    Mechagnome Immamoonkin's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Firecrest
    I thought about this as a possibility. But in the end, it doesn't make sense. Just as BC gear didn't last long in WOTLK, the likely hood of any of us using T10 very far into 85 is remote at best.

    Besides, the stat distribution Haste/MP5 does exist (and hopefully will exist on more). Completely removing it from our Tier doesn't have anything to do with Cata.
    BC gear did last very long... if you had T6. I didn't have to change gear until Naxx 10 (except maybe.. trinkets and rings, but that's because I never got the good stuff there).

    And I'm sorry if I misread that it's your new Tier set. But come on, I see pallies with full mana bars during the entire raid. You guys aren't going to be crushed. Things will be okay.

  9. #29
    I am Murloc! Fenixdown's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Firecrest
    Pretty sure that all of the tier is there. Let me check. Yup. All there. And all with loads of our very worst optional stat.

    Just like I said already. Good job reading and all though, "brosef".

    The current examples in the loot table is just more examples of what the entirety of the tier set already proves.

    Even if every single piece of remaining undiscovered gear turns out to be well optimized, am I supposed to e happy that Blizzard purposely turned Crit into our worst stat and now is loading it onto our tier?
    Of all cloth gear at current levels, I'd say about 60% of it has haste. Haste is a priest's worst optimal stat, moreso for discipline because our soft cap is very low (11%).

    I don't go on the forums and go "QQQQQ haste on cloth makes me wanna nerdrage". I find a way around it.

    Do you need to be in FULL ICC25 gear to feel some form of accomplishment has been obtained? You can't just get some pieces out of 10-man to fill slots for better optimization? Also, you do know you only need 4 pieces of tier to get a set bonus, you can't just pick the four that best fit your personal setup and fill in the last spot with a better non-tier piece?

    I mean, I do all those things. It seems, you know, logical.

    Would you rather have old-school tier stats? I hear spirit was a pro stat for holy pallies back in vanilla, true story!

    From your OP you said "of all the gear so far shown", meaning that you realize that the entire loot table isn't even close to finalized. Yet, here you are, crying over the loot already.

    Let them finish the damn loot table first, at least. It's not that hard, is it?


  10. #30

    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Firecrest
    Just as BC gear didn't last long in WOTLK
    ...I've seen people level all the way to 80 still in their SSC/BT gear.

  11. #31

    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenixdown
    Of all cloth gear at current levels, I'd say about 60% of it has haste. Haste is a priest's worst optimal stat, moreso for discipline because our soft cap is very low (11%).
    Orly? I'd prefer Haste over crit on gear any time as a Holy Priest.
    Armories:
    Pally: Chiaki
    Dk: Telare
    Warrior: Irlida

  12. #32
    Immortal Ronark's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Immamoonkin
    Why are people STILL arguing over this?

    THEY ARE GOING TO CHANGE EVERYONE WHEN CATA COMES OUT. YOU WILL NOT BE GIMPED. THINGS WILL WORK OUT. STOP FEARING WHAT MIGHT BE.

    If we were already in Cataclysm, and the stats did nerf you, then I would totally understand this post.
    But you guys are acting like they're changing nothing else in this game other than the stats. Come on guys! If something that hasn't been done yet strikes so much fear into you that you have to post a rage thread, go outside and breathe.
    One thing: It is only 3.3, not 4.0.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nillo
    It doesn't work that way :>
    Base stats on items are always similar and moving point from Extra stats to base stats would usually greatly impact the total item value, because the Extra stats are usually cheaper than the base stats.

    Is haste still better than crit after you pass the soft haste cap?
    If not the itemization would be :
    Haste/Mp5 (until cap) > MP5/Crit > Haste/Crit
    Not if you proportioned it right, no.

  13. #33
    Mechagnome Immamoonkin's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronark
    One thing: It is only 3.3, not 4.0.
    I edited that post.

    I still stand by the "chill the hell out" concept.

  14. #34
    I am Murloc! Nienniora's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Firecrest
    Wow. Really? ROFL. NEWSFLASH: Crit has been our worst stat for months. Welcome to the last patch. Everyone who's been here for almost half a year already says hi.
    NEWSFLASH : Firecrest says the truth!

    and sunwell gear (with wotlk gem/enchant) = heroic lvl200 gear + bonus of the set

  15. #35

    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronark
    Not if you proportioned it right, no.
    I doubt , that it would be possible to allocate the stats in a way, that would make that possible. (Haste will be overcapped if you have it on each item)
    Armories:
    Pally: Chiaki
    Dk: Telare
    Warrior: Irlida

  16. #36
    Dreadlord Elessa's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Firecrest
    The tier 10 Holy set. And EVERY piece with Crit. Of all the currently discovered spell plate, only ONE doesn't have Crit.
    Quote Originally Posted by FRONTPAGE
    The stats of the first two tiers of T10 armor sets have been discovered for all classes. Some of these stats are most likely placeholders.

  17. #37
    Immortal Ronark's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by Immamoonkin
    I edited that post.

    I still stand by the "chill the hell out" concept.
    It would be like America telling Iraq "Don't worry Bro, you will not have any more suicidal bombings in December of 2013. Until then deal with it".

  18. #38

    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    can anyone please explain to me how the MP5 is worth anything? sorry, but when i do anub HM 10man on my pala i can relax and whack him at least once every 20 seconds with my weapon. thats around 2.4k mana (32k mana raidbuffed). to get this much mana in 20 seconds i would need 800 MP5, which is insane, when i think that i could just stack more int/haste/crit. so i actually believe that MP5 is actually quite bad for my paladin... but that just may be me...

  19. #39
    Stood in the Fire palamanian's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    I was going to write a wall of text but instead I'll sum it up:

    It has crit on it because Blizzard wants it to. If you feel like for some reason you are better than Blizzard and your opinion is worth more than theirs, feel free to try and change it yourself. Crit is fine, you'll have what 35k mana in full 264 gear? Oh last thing, Blizzard doesn't care that you don't like it.



  20. #40
    Immortal Ronark's Avatar
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    Re: Holy - Sick of Blizzard Nerfing Us Via Stats

    Quote Originally Posted by elcher
    can anyone please explain to me how the MP5 is worth anything? sorry, but when i do anub HM 10man on my pala i can relax and whack him at least once every 20 seconds with my weapon. thats around 2.4k mana (32k mana raidbuffed). to get this much mana in 20 seconds i would need 800 MP5, which is insane, when i think that i could just stack more int/haste/crit. so i actually believe that MP5 is actually quite bad for my paladin... but that just may be me...
    I'd like to see you heal a level 80 heroic version of Shade of Aran, then.

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