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  1. #21

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    40 man raids
    25's
    10's

    72 man raids in EQ were harder yet. So what.

    I can say this much with absolute precision, it's much easier to carry scrubs through 25man content, than it is through 10s. Just like there were almost always 3-5 scrubs in a 40 man back in BWL days.

    Referring to everyone that does 10's because the don't have the opportunity to do 25man content, as scrubs, is ignorant and foolish.

    In a well organized 25 man, you have every class buff there is. Not always so in 10mans. By numbers alone, you have less personal responsibility in 25's.

    Caveat: Hard modes are a different story.

  2. #22

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelgo
    so then, in practice, it's easier.

    by the numbers
    A Tribute to Insanity (10) - ~5000 guilds worldwide
    A Tribute to Insanity (25) - ~300 guilds worldwide
    by the numbers, how many 10 man raiding guilds are there worldwide? 25 man raiding guilds?

    I'd like to see the percentages. I bet your point would be moot then.

  3. #23

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    10 man content is easier than 25 man content.
    This is true, but only if we're talking about the same difficulty. No one is going to argue that TotGC25 is harder than it's 10man counterpart. But who does really think that ToC25 is harder than TotGC10? Both reward ilvl245 gear. (mostly even better itemized than 25man gear) So far I don't see any valid reason why it shouldn't be obtainable from 10man heroic ICC. (it would be entirely different if the last step required you to kill 25HC Arthas, but well... it doesn't)

  4. #24

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by urdaddy
    by the numbers, how many 10 man raiding guilds are there worldwide? 25 man raiding guilds?

    I'd like to see the percentages. I bet your point would be moot then.
    I gotta agree with this, as i highly doubt there are as many 25-man guilds as there are 10-mans guilds. Mainly because of the number of players required for each, and because it can be hard enough to find/hold 10 competent players.

    I just can't believe that Blizzard would even consider such...such.....

    Damn, can't think of a word that describes these doings. :-\

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyou
    [Shadowmourne, I went to Icecrown and was hoping for The Ashbringer but all I got was this lame axe]
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  5. #25

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by urdaddy
    by the numbers, how many 10 man raiding guilds are there worldwide? 25 man raiding guilds?

    I'd like to see the percentages. I bet your point would be moot then.
    So you are impling that there 16 times as many 10 man raiding guilds as there are 25 man raiding guilds? Sorry, but I don't need to see any numbers to tell you that you are wrong about that.

    People got the idea that 10 man raids are easier because they have done both and found that the 10 man version was easier. How is that so hard to figure out?

  6. #26

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    10man raiders should get legendaries, your lucky you have 10man raids.

    Not saying 10man guilds are casual, but just because you'd 'rather' do 10mans rather than 25mans doesnt give you a reason to get a legandary

  7. #27

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelgo
    so then, in practice, it's easier.

    by the numbers
    A Tribute to Insanity (10) - ~5000 guilds worldwide
    A Tribute to Insanity (25) - ~300 guilds worldwide
    Which would actually be relevant if we were comparing 10H ro 25H. But we aren't.

    Going by the statistics I've found, it would seem that 10H is harder than 25.

    http://wow.guildprogress.com

    Trial of the Grand Crusader 10 - 8.26%
    Trial of the Crusader 25 - 15.30%

    Three Lights in the Darkness 10 - 6.48%
    Yogg-Saron 25 - 7.56%

    So yeah, I do feel that 10H should be allowed to get Shadowmourne. My original post explains how it could be set up without encouraging 25-man players to run 10-mans any more than they already will. Heroic 10-man raiders have put forth the work to down bosses that the statistics show are harder than their normal 25-man equivalents. They should be rewarded by being allowed to get the same Legendary weapon that 25-man Normal raiders will have access to.

  8. #28

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pally power
    I gotta agree with this, as i highly doubt there are as many 25-man guilds as there are 10-mans guilds. Mainly because of the number of players required for each, and because it can be hard enough to find/hold 10 competent players.

    I just can't believe that Blizzard would even consider such...such.....

    Damn, can't think of a word that describes these doings. :-\
    Strict 10 man guilds? Barely any. Guilds that focus only on 10s? Still next to nothing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelgo
    so then, in practice, it's easier.

    by the numbers
    A Tribute to Insanity (10) - ~5000 guilds worldwide
    A Tribute to Insanity (25) - ~300 guilds worldwide
    Just looking at that, the 25 man guilds make up a good portion of the 10 man clears, and that's not counting the 25 man guilds that have cleared togc10 but not 25.

    There are almost no 10 man guilds.
    Nom Nom Nom [NNF] (2 points) - When you Ferocious Bite a target at or below 25% health, you have a 50/100% chance to instantly refresh the duration of your Rip on the target.

  9. #29

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonberry
    Strict 10 man guilds? Barely any. Guilds that focus only on 10s? Still next to nothing.
    Just looking at that, the 25 man guilds make up a good portion of the 10 man clears, and that's not counting the 25 man guilds that have cleared togc10 but not 25.

    There are almost no 10 man guilds.
    Almost all of the guilds i have been in are 10 man only.

  10. #30

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Casual wow player
    Almost all of the guilds i have been in are 10 man only.
    By your name I think you're a troll.

    But there are seriously like 2 10 man focusing guilds on my server that have cleared togc10, while there are 50 25 man guilds that have cleared togc25, way more that have cleared toc25. I'd say there are more, but there is no way to keep track of them, and they don't clear content so they don't matter for this discussion anyways.
    Nom Nom Nom [NNF] (2 points) - When you Ferocious Bite a target at or below 25% health, you have a 50/100% chance to instantly refresh the duration of your Rip on the target.

  11. #31
    Mechagnome
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    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by FuriousFox
    Which would actually be relevant if we were comparing 10H ro 25H. But we aren't.

    Going by the statistics I've found, it would seem that 10H is harder than 25.
    So we're comparing 10man Heroic to 25 man normal? Then ya, ill agree 10 man H is likely harder, but the simple fact is, you can't get the legendary solely in 25 man normal, hence my comparison.


    As for the "lets compare the 10 man to the 25 man guild" numbers, that makes absolutely no sense.
    Little amount of 10 man guilds -> Lots of ppl doing 10 man achievement (high % of people able to do it - ie easier)
    Lots of 25 man guilds -> less ppl doing 25 man achievement (low % of people able to do it - ie harder)

    the simple fact there are considerable low amount of 10 guilds, its likely that 25 man guilds are largely getting these achievements (esp considering they have better gear) which leads to my original argument, in practice, 10 mans are easier

  12. #32

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Seriously.. How can you ask for this?

    Next thing you want is buying it for Emblems of Frost, right?

    10m content is so much easier than 25m.

  13. #33

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by ulrich
    10m content is so much easier than 25m when doing it in full 25man gear.
    Fixed that for you. Ever tried Algalon in 10 man with only gear from that instance? You might notice a slight difference.

    Problem with 10man heroic content is, that it is way to easy to get gear from 25man, that is on par/better than what you are expected to get from 10 man heroic.

    I always thought they should just step up 10 man heroic content in difficulty, so it's on par with 25man. Can't really figure out why it's not that way right now tbh.

    Btw, i'm in a pure 10 man guild.

  14. #34

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Nahh it wont ever happen, and tbh even though our guild mainly focus on 10mans i would rather have Shadowmourne be a 25HC only, legendarys should be awarded only to the best of guilds/players that's how its always been and that's how it should stay.
    Synit 110 - Orc Elemental Shaman [Active]

  15. #35

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    how does doing 25mans make you a better player rofl

  16. #36

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelgo
    So we're comparing 10man Heroic to 25 man normal? Then ya, ill agree 10 man H is likely harder, but the simple fact is, you can't get the legendary solely in 25 man normal, hence my comparison.


    As for the "lets compare the 10 man to the 25 man guild" numbers, that makes absolutely no sense.
    Little amount of 10 man guilds -> Lots of ppl doing 10 man achievement (high % of people able to do it - ie easier)
    Lots of 25 man guilds -> less ppl doing 25 man achievement (low % of people able to do it - ie harder)

    the simple fact there are considerable low amount of 10 guilds, its likely that 25 man guilds are largely getting these achievements (esp considering they have better gear) which leads to my original argument, in practice, 10 mans are easier
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/news-2/s...review-comics/

    Going by Boub's information, there is no point during the questline that you ever have to go into 25-man Heroic mode. As far as I can tell, it can all be done in 25-man Normal.

    Also, I don't quite understand what you're saying about the statistics. The statistics I provided for Heroic 10-mans included people that were in 25-man guilds. The stats were still lower than their 25-man Normal counterparts. I would think that would mean that 10-man Heroics are harder than 25-man Normals, which you seem to both agree and disagree with.

  17. #37

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Reinfall
    Fixed that for you. Ever tried Algalon in 10 man with only gear from that instance? You might notice a slight difference.

    Problem with 10man heroic content is, that it is way to easy to get gear from 25man, that is on par/better than what you are expected to get from 10 man heroic.

    I always thought they should just step up 10 man heroic content in difficulty, so it's on par with 25man. Can't really figure out why it's not that way right now tbh.

    Btw, i'm in a pure 10 man guild.
    10 man content is a lot easier than 25 man content even when you don't outgear it.

    It's not like you would know though, you don't raid 25 mans.

  18. #38
    Stood in the Fire Shiikarii's Avatar
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    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Join a guild and stop crying.
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...losophy/simple
    Philosophy, Worgen Mage of Magtheridon EU.Mokari, Nelf Hunter of Magtheridon EU (AKA Shikari @ Achindoun). [Currently inactive]

  19. #39

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Quote Originally Posted by FuriousFox
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/news-2/s...review-comics/

    Going by Boub's information, there is no point during the questline that you ever have to go into 25-man Heroic mode. As far as I can tell, it can all be done in 25-man Normal.

    Also, I don't quite understand what you're saying about the statistics. The statistics I provided for Heroic 10-mans included people that were in 25-man guilds. The stats were still lower than their 25-man Normal counterparts. I would think that would mean that 10-man Heroics are harder than 25-man Normals, which you seem to both agree and disagree with.
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?page=906

  20. #40

    Re: Shadowmourne from 10-man Heroic?

    Still not seeing it. Is there a specific quest that I'm just not seeing that requires 25-man Heroic?

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