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  1. #1

    Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    so whats a good amount of crit to stay around? want to use some haste gear i have, dont know how much crit i can get rid of. not an amazing toon at all, just one my mah alts

    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...gramar&n=Magoc

    24.63% with mah firestone

  2. #2

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    There has been a discussion about that. There is no optimum level of crit, most will say 30%, but that still is not a cap. Personally I try to keep haste at 550 and let the rest fall where they may. With the release of ICC 550 haste goes out the window in raid gear.

  3. #3
    Scarab Lord bahumut5's Avatar
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    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Basicly, the crit cap for destro seems to be around 35%, and everything else in Haste.

    As soon as you start going above 35%, you will crit all the time, but your SP and Haste would slack to much, which causes you to be lower on DPS than that you might think.

    Haste is more important for Warlocks atm. For both Destro and Affliction.
    Dawwwwwww

  4. #4

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by bahumut5
    Basicly, the crit cap for destro seems to be around 35%, and everything else in Haste.

    As soon as you start going above 35%, you will crit all the time, but your SP and Haste would slack to much, which causes you to be lower on DPS than that you might think.

    Haste is more important for Warlocks atm. For both Destro and Affliction.
    This might have changed...for dest..since your conflag dots do not benefit from alot of crit buffs in addition now to imp crit scaling...I don't think anyone has done the actually math or even gone and looked at the value of crit to haste.

  5. #5
    Scarab Lord bahumut5's Avatar
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    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by zuxia
    This might have changed...for dest..since your conflag dots do not benefit from alot of crit buffs in addition now to imp crit scaling...I don't think anyone has done the actually math or even gone and looked at the value of crit to haste.
    Very much true. My data is from patch 3.2.0
    However, I am most curtain that Conflagrate does not benefit from Haste (due to corruption being glyphed and Conflagrate being Instant), so Crit will still be of the same importance as it was.

    I believe Conflagrate CAN Crit however, but I would think that its DoT would be able to crit, or that EVERY tick will Crit if the attack crits. I personally ditched Destro after the Conflag "Nerf" (I just liked seeying the big numers), and went with Affli and Demo. I wondered if Destro was still fun enough though (to easy rotation etc etc, I really just played it for the numbers).

    Anyway, OP: Remember that a lot of raid set-ups will buff your Crit chance as well (Shammy, Boomkin, Mage affli lock etc etc), try to get your Crit chance somewere near those buff stats. Like: Focuss less on hit if you are a 25 man raider (10% hit UB & Untalanted), and focuss more on Crit and Haste. If you are a 10 man raider, try to get a bit more hit instead of Crit and Haste (or SP really). Goodluck with raiding and everything else
    Dawwwwwww

  6. #6

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    If I was destro I'd aim for about 650+ haste about 25-27% crit you should be fine with that as long as you optimize right

  7. #7

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    man ,remember this rule for caster
    hit>sp>haste>cri

  8. #8

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    dont try for crit at all at anytime for any reason on any peice of gear always take the haste/spirit version of whatever over the crit/dmg one. raidbuffs + the crit that doesnt show on character doll will give you plenty. period. haste is just better ....


  9. #9

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by ruowei
    man ,remember this rule for caster
    hit>sp>haste>cri
    Quote Originally Posted by infinitis
    dont try for crit at all at anytime for any reason on any peice of gear always take the haste/spirit version of whatever over the crit/dmg one. raidbuffs + the crit that doesnt show on character doll will give you plenty. period. haste is just better ....

    Neither of these are totally correct...there are many cases where crit is better than haste due to game mechanics. Don't generalize..that is how end-game locks got in trouble with dps.

  10. #10
    Deleted

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    I rate crit and haste about the same... role with about 750+ haste and ~27-28% crit (cant remember exact numbers and logged out in pvp gear :/)

    More crit will get you better burst during those backdrafts, but haste will stop you from casting like a granny between them

    Hit(to cap) > SP > Haste/Crit

  11. #11
    Deleted

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by zuxia
    Neither of these are totally correct...there are many cases where crit is better than haste due to game mechanics. Don't generalize..that is how end-game locks got in trouble with dps.
    yes, warlocks underestimate the importance of crit on there gear.
    I see alot of warlocks stacking only Spellpower and haste ( over the 800 haste even ), have max 20% crit.
    There gear is totally unbalanced that way, i outdps them even lal.

    Try to stay at about 26% crit indeed.

  12. #12

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Darknazgul
    yes, warlocks underestimate the importance of crit on there gear.
    I see alot of warlocks stacking only Spellpower and haste ( over the 800 haste even ), have max 20% crit.
    There gear is totally unbalanced that way, i outdps them even lal.

    Try to stay at about 26% crit indeed.
    Having over 800 haste and less than 20% crit is using some kind of gear I don't know where to find... [sarcasm]I sure hope you outdps quest greens warlocks lal[/sarcasm].
    On a sidenote, crit values less than haste for every warlock spec, even destro though the gap is smaller for that spec.
    And the ONLY reason for the high scaling factors of crit in the 3.3 sims is that every BiS profile uses double Reign of the Dead\Unliving whichs make crit scales better. If you don't have those trinkets 1 crit point is worth roughly 50-75% of a haste point (again, depending on spec).
    That said, one stat value increases the more you have of the other. Meaning if you have 800 haste and 20% crit (very unlikely, but nvm), 1 additional crit point will grant you more than 1 haste point.

  13. #13

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Form my personal opinion haste should be around 550 650 around i have diferent set haste and crit and in destro you need keep this pyrocla proc is where you dps go up my personal number are 25% crit 600 haste other problem is Hight crit = Agro whore

  14. #14

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by ~Thalia~
    Having over 800 haste and less than 20% crit is using some kind of gear I don't know where to find... [sarcasm]I sure hope you outdps quest greens warlocks lal[/sarcasm].
    On a sidenote, crit values less than haste for every warlock spec, even destro though the gap is smaller for that spec.
    And the ONLY reason for the high scaling factors of crit in the 3.3 sims is that every BiS profile uses double Reign of the Dead\Unliving whichs make crit scales better. If you don't have those trinkets 1 crit point is worth roughly 50-75% of a haste point (again, depending on spec).
    That said, one stat value increases the more you have of the other. Meaning if you have 800 haste and 20% crit (very unlikely, but nvm), 1 additional crit point will grant you more than 1 haste point.
    The scaling factors are incorrect to begin with for the listing they are using...since it is setup as a 5 min tank and spank fight...SO CRIT IS MORE VALUED THAN CREDIT IT IS GIVEN..maybe not equal to haste..but alot closer than many think..oh and conflag dot is effected by our crit not our haste thus raising crit values up..regardless of trinkets.

  15. #15

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by zuxia
    The scaling factors are incorrect to begin with for the listing they are using...since it is setup as a 5 min tank and spank fight...SO CRIT IS MORE VALUED THAN CREDIT IT IS GIVEN..maybe not equal to haste..but alot closer than many think..oh and conflag dot is effected by our crit not our haste thus raising crit values up..regardless of trinkets.
    So because half a spell scales only with crit, crit is better ?
    Actually in non tank-and-spank fights haste value is even higher, allowing you to cast more spells during the time you're not moving. Haste rating increases your crit chances too.

  16. #16

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by ~Thalia~
    So because half a spell scales only with crit, crit is better ?
    Actually in non tank-and-spank fights haste value is even higher, allowing you to cast more spells during the time you're not moving. Haste rating increases your crit chances too.
    Yes the value is higher, but the interpetation is incorrect, for instance in a very short fight crit will beat haste...why because it takes more casts of non-crit spells to make up for the damage the crit...that is a problem that many make in reading simcraft values...thus you need more haste to offset the damage of a crit.

  17. #17

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    well assuming most poeple have the t9 2 set your paper doll crit doesnt need to be as high as normally but a safe number is about 25-30% never go over 35, never gem for it, haste has always trumped crit in all lock specs esspecially in movement fights(whichis about 95% of all current content)
    He who is truly mediocre exerts himself 100%, it is not his efforts that fall short but his ability. Don't be a mediocre poser.
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Shattered+Hand&cn=Brootalkid
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Shattered+Hand&cn=Kidvicious

  18. #18

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by kidvicious
    well assuming most poeple have the t9 2 set your paper doll crit doesnt need to be as high as normally but a safe number is about 25-30% never go over 35, never gem for it, haste has always trumped crit in all lock specs esspecially in movement fights(whichis about 95% of all current content)
    Going over 35% crit is actually fine..since emp imp does not affect conflag dot at all. Haste does not always trump crit in movement fights, actually alot less than you think it does.

  19. #19

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by zuxia
    Going over 35% crit is actually fine..since emp imp does not affect conflag dot at all. Haste does not always trump crit in movement fights, actually alot less than you think it does.
    id love to see this
    He who is truly mediocre exerts himself 100%, it is not his efforts that fall short but his ability. Don't be a mediocre poser.
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Shattered+Hand&cn=Brootalkid
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Shattered+Hand&cn=Kidvicious

  20. #20

    Re: Warlock PvE Destro - how much crit?

    Quote Originally Posted by kidvicious
    id love to see this
    Well since most fights that take alot of movement, have switch targeting...ect... particularly on short death mobs...crit wins versus just stacking haste...very basic example...you get to cast 2 spells at a mob, 2.5 stacking haste well now..since you can't cast half a spell you lose that part of haste and have to start over on boss. Crit example I crit with both spell that time allows and start on the boss dpsn. So which was better for the game mechanic. Prime example of this is portals and infernal volcano in togc10..now the same basic principal can be applied to movement.

    Haste is actually better for tank and spank with longer fights. Crit is actually better for shorter movement type fights...since haste loses time to dps due to movement..but the crit extra damage covers the time you had to move.

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