When crit is too much?

[Liviu]

Hey,

After getting my 2pc t9 bonus I saw that crit favors us a lot more and so I went for some leather/mail gear and crit/str gems on some yellow sockets.
Atm the moment I`m sitting at 44.31% crit and 4825 AP unbuffed, so I go 50+ crit in raids.
My armory is: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...flight&n=Liviu
I used rawr to sort my gear decision, but some other retri palas are telling me that I went too far with crit and lost str/ap. I could probably go to 5.3k AP with plate gear, but I`d lose around 8-9% crit.
I`ve read, on elitistjerks I think, that over 50% crit starts to lose his effectivness.
So, where do I have to stop with crit? How much I can rely on rawr for that?

Thx.

P.S. Not native english so........

[Nillo]

The only thing, that doesn't gain anything from going over 50% crit is Hammer of Wrath- considering, that it's only a minor part of damage done (especially with t9 2p favoring other abilities) you shouldn't worry too much about that.

And as far as I know, both Rawr and Elitist Jerks have lots of Leather stuff in their t9 BiS lists => Agi (=crit)/AP ftw => Str sucks balls.




PS: I think Glyph of Consecration is still a lot better than Glyph of Exorcism (at least until you get t10 2p)

[Xs]

I remember reading a value somewhere for crit with the 2 piece (probably in the Ret sticky) but I believe its around 1/3rd better once you get the bonus, but still not worth gemming away from pure Stren in most cases.

As for when crit gets better or worse, it gets better the further you get from 1% until ~50% then it starts to go the opposite way I believe, but its not a massive increase or decrease so don't worry too much.

[GeBBrY]

crit get better with 2p T9 cause of just thoose dots critting,
though gemming for str is always better.
it really depends on ure gear alot but rings,necks and backs with AP crit agi and haste are imba itemised and have always been caseu of so many classes can use em.
but even better now after u get T9.
it changes back some with t10 and haste becomes really good after that too.
about the crit over 50% start beeing bad after a while casue of mele has always a chance of Glancing Blows..if u get to much crit that crit get useless cause u will always have an amount on ure hit table that is glancing blows

hope this helps alot
/Gebb

[Baabinator]

about the crit over 50% start beeing bad after a while casue of mele has always a chance of Glancing Blows..if u get to much crit that crit get useless cause u will always have an amount on ure hit table that is glancing blows

Glancing blows are always at 26%. And only affect auto-attack.

My suggestion would be to get plate gear nevertheless. Plate with alot of strength, and devoid of ArP. (meaning no ArP)

Since you'll gain alot more attack power from strength, right up to 25% more.

Stack strength though i think. It'll be better in the end, since it affects all abilities, and the ticks from Seal of Vengeance and Consecration can't crit (correct me if i'm wrong)

[GeBBrY]

you are also right in what u say m8
its only with t9 that crit gets a little better.
though alot of str item and plate are itemized with more stamina and often TOO much..so the same item lvl gear rings and neck´s and BiS gear are itemized better for every physical damage dealing class..hope i make some sense..im tired ^^
short..crit has become a little better for thoose with 2 piece T9 though not best AND some leather and mail items +rings etc CAN be better itemised
example in my gear setup http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...cream&n=Gebbry

/Gebb

[Simqn]

crit get better with 2p T9 cause of just thoose dots critting,
though gemming for str is always better.

it changes back some with t10 and haste becomes really good after that too.
about the crit over 50% start beeing bad after a while casue of mele has always a chance of Glancing Blows..if u get to much crit that crit get useless cause u will always have an amount on ure hit table that is glancing blows

hope this helps alot
/Gebb

Two things for clarity incase anyone is actually reqading this forum for information:

With two set bonus T9 yellow sockets with 4+ str it is better to use +10str +10crit

WIth Tier 10 Haste in fact becomes no more powerful, in fact according to EJ arm pen becoms more powerful relative to Haste and in fact at 402 arm pen it overtakes hastes in stat priority all things being equal.
Crit only becomes totally useless after 74% which is hard cap because of glancing blows,
50%+ is quoted a lot becuase at this level the value of the crit starts to decline but doesnt bottom out till the hard cap

Please if your going to try and post facts guys lets try and get them right

[GeBBrY]

Thanks for the clarify..now that i read through what i typed it seems a little hard to understand what im talking about hehe
i didnt say it was after 50% crit though..i just added something that some peeps says about getting crit over 50% so it might been that he read something about..but i didnt say it was bad after 50%
but again thx for the clarify m8

[Xs]

Crit only becomes totally useless after 74% which is hard cap because of glancing blows,

Please if your going to try and post facts guys lets try and get them right

That is not the hard cap, its the hard cap for auto-attack swings.

[Nillo]

1) My suggestion would be to get plate gear nevertheless.
2) Plate with alot of strength, and devoid of ArP. (meaning no ArP)
3) Since you'll gain alot more attack power from strength, right up to 25% more.
4) Stack strength though i think. It'll be better in the end, since it affects all abilities, and the ticks from Seal of Vengeance and Consecration can't crit (correct me if i'm wrong)

1) Leather/Mail >> Plate (especially with t9)
2) The more Str an item has (compared to the other stats) the worse it gets. And ArP is just about as good as Haste (slightly better with t10 probably) => items with Crit/ArP are decent (something like Exp+ArP is still awful)
3) So what? I gain tons of Crit from Agi and the AP loss is not that big.
4) The good old "it affects all abilities" , which has no meaning - at all (could as well say SP affects 70% of my damage => it must be good, but in fact it's far from useful, because the scaling is horrible)

[Liviu]

The only thing, that doesn't gain anything from going over 50% crit is Hammer of Wrath- considering, that it's only a minor part of damage done (especially with t9 2p favoring other abilities) you shouldn't worry too much about that.

And as far as I know, both Rawr and Elitist Jerks have lots of Leather stuff in their t9 BiS lists => Agi (=crit)/AP ftw => Str sucks balls.




PS: I think Glyph of Consecration is still a lot better than Glyph of Exorcism (at least until you get t10 2p)

I know consecrate glyph is better but I used Exo glyph for Deathbringer Saurfang, since I have to avoid having consecrate down when adds show up.

[Liviu]

One thing to add:
I noticed that with higher crit I can keep the RV dots rolling for a longer period, especially if I prioritize Judg when they are about to expire. I guess those dots stacking generate a lot of dmg since in some fights I had RV count for 10% of my total dmg.

[Xs]

One thing to add:
I noticed that with higher crit I can keep the RV dots rolling for a longer period, especially if I prioritize Judg when they are about to expire. I guess those dots stacking generate a lot of dmg since in some fights I had RV count for 10% of my total dmg.

It doesn't roll like that, having it be 10% of your damage is just crit luck

[Nillo]

I know consecrate glyph is better but I used Exo glyph for Deathbringer Saurfang, since I have to avoid having consecrate down when adds show up.

If I remember correctly they take -95% damage from aoe effects => there's no way your consecration is going to pull aggro.

One thing to add:
I noticed that with higher crit I can keep the RV dots rolling for a longer period, especially if I prioritize Judg when they are about to expire. I guess those dots stacking generate a lot of dmg since in some fights I had RV count for 10% of my total dmg.

I'm not going to explain how RV works, but to keep it short: It doesn't matter if it falls off and you must absolutely not change your rotation to "keep it up".

It doesn't roll like that, having it be 10% of your damage is just crit luck

10% should be doable with a high amount of crit. (and some 15-20% against Twins )

[Liviu]

If I remember correctly they take -95% damage from aoe effects => there's no way your consecration is going to pull aggro.

I'm not going to explain how RV works, but to keep it short: It doesn't matter if it falls off and you must absolutely not change your rotation to "keep it up".
10% should be doable with a high amount of crit. (and some 15-20% against Twins )

I think I read on a post here something like: "Crit refreshes the timer adding the new dmg". So that must have been confused me

[Xs]

It does refresh the timer but the damage it does stays the same, it just rolls like ignite doing the same damage over X seconds, just spread to different times

[Requital]

Refreshing the timer and adding new damage is how Deep Wounds works which when Warriors got the new Deep Wounds we got the old one named RV.