Cataclysm Stats Changes, Masteries, Terrain Phasing

[Meddling Mudd]

I'm going to miss the stats, this raises a lot of questions such as:
Without DEF, what is the benchmark of a capable tank? Do tanks have to be specced a certian way?
I'm going to keep my eye on the new "interesting talents." Will new talents removed the need of the current itemization, and encourage people to deviate from cookie-cutter builds? If Blizz can do that I will be very happy!
I suppose if the simplified stats make class balance easier, there's not much to QQ over. I'll give the Devs some rope and see what they do with Cata.
At least phasing is looking amazing!

[Klarth]

Removing spell power, mp5 and attack power will be a wash, as your stat sheet should remain more or less the same.

As for the concerns about int and agi becoming 'super stats', I remember blizzard stating that they might scale back the crit and mana from int, and the dodge and crit form agi. But with no spellpower and ap, there is more item budget for int and agi, so things should remain the same.

Remember, blizzard is not intentionally trying to nerf us; at the very least it should be a sidestep from where we are right now.

[Krypt]

I'm going to miss the stats, this raises a lot of questions such as:
Without DEF, what is the benchmark of a capable tank? Do tanks have to be specced a certian way?

Either; having the crit immune talent or having enough points in the tank-tree to make them crit immune (if they make mastery do that)

He means should people gather Arp gear since it's going to be *replaced* in Cat with Mastery. Meaning if there is Arp on the gear now, it will become (presumably, given the blue comments) Mastery once it's patched. Hard concepts are harder than reading I guess.

Doubt that it will be, as casters benefit from mastery, as there isn't much cloth with arpen on it atm.

What about HITrating?

Probably stay.

well, since hunters are gonna get focus and shamans are supposed to get spirit, i wonder how majorly fucked up shaman itemization will be... enhas either no longer sharing all loot with hunters = more QQ about 1 spec items OR they will share same items, but will be way weaker, unless blizzard also reworks completely how enha works. ans ele and resto with spirit? well it might help eles o get some decent gear without waiting for 3 drops in whole instance, but i already see lots of clothies QQing about "shamen stole my gearz!!11" And it didnt solve holy pala "gear for only one spec" question at all, paladins will want cloths, too, since now those will be worth it even more, yet they will have their unique gear noone can take fom them.

talent tree bonuses pretty cool (tho it might discourage hybrid dps to specc few points in off trees, if bonuses from main one will be superior to those minor talents from off trees...), phasing pretty cool, warlocks no longer needing loads of shards cool, overall meh.

Resto/Ele Shaman will want Int,Crit,Spirit,Haste,Mastery in varying degrees.

Hunter/Enh Shaman will want Agi,Crit,Haste/Mastery (and exp for shamans). So the 1 item per spec thing shouldn't be too severe? Enhances have talents to regen mana, they won't need spirit.

[Laita]

No more SP? No more Def needed... It's apparently to hard to hit deff cap for people, or to mathy for ArP? Good job Blizzard on killing the game in 1 swift expansion... Afk face rolling Content.

HAHAHA, you tell them mate, i totally agree with ya there, so much i'm looking forward to and so much that i'm just gonna wanna /facepalm over. i mean come on, dropping defense coz its too hard to reach cap... are ppl fuckin retarded, i easily reached 540 defense in full blues, wasn't hard at all, just grind a few instance til you get the item you need to hit defense cap, then start raidin same shit goes there, grind the raids til you get the gear you want, and getting shit crafted has never been easier... come on Blizzard, don't make this game anymore FACEROLL than it already is... make it fuckin way harder, like in BC, now that was fun, i've pretty much given up on 80 raiding because it is FUCKIN BORING... everything is faceroll, not strategy required, healers stand there, caster DPS stand there, tank boss over here, off tank over there, 3rd off tank over here, melee DPS spread out behind boss in a arc must stay 10 yards away from each other, when trash mob spawns, off tanks will pick it up, caster DPS burn add, melee DPS stay on main boss... the difficult strategies of the BC bosses no longer exist anymore... everything is too easy these days... and i'm sick and tired of getting stuck in guilds that have ppl with 5K gear scores and don't know how to fuckin DPS, its like that gear they are wearing isn't actually epic, i've honestly seen ppl in blues and Naxx 10 epics do sweet DPS, coz they know "HOW" to play their class, instead of facerolling and hoping for the best, it sickens me that there is no more challenge to this game... so fuckin suck it up blizz and bring some of the challenge back... at least for the hard core raiders anyways... maybe there might be more ppl like me who actually get back into raiding coz there will be a challenge there... maybe you should read forums that aren't blizz controlled and you could see where everyone is actually bitching at you to make it harder... but no... you don't fuckin listen, its all about making it easier for the new player... FUCK THAT, i had to learn how to play the hard way... so can the new ppl, and if they can't handle it... then they shouldn't be playing

[justwealth]

I thought they were also going to remove resil? Are they still doing that or no? If not the pvp is still not gonna be fun for the average player

[Wyrmking]

No more SP? No more Def needed... It's apparently to hard to hit deff cap for people, or to mathy for ArP? Good job Blizzard on killing the game in 1 swift expansion... Afk face rolling Content.

You fucking shit. ArP is not only mathy, it's also fucking useless to some specs. Enhancement Shamans share gear with Hunters yet Hunter gear has so much ArP which is useless to Enhancement Shamans that mainly uses magic attack.

You whiny ass shitheads need to kill yourselves.

[Wyrmking]

HAHAHA, you tell them mate, i totally agree with ya there, so much i'm looking forward to and so much that i'm just gonna wanna /facepalm over. i mean come on, dropping defense coz its too hard to reach cap... are ppl fuckin retarded, i easily reached 540 defense in full blues, wasn't hard at all, just grind a few instance til you get the item you need to hit defense cap, then start raidin same shit goes there, grind the raids til you get the gear you want, and getting shit crafted has never been easier... come on Blizzard, don't make this game anymore FACEROLL than it already is... make it fuckin way harder, like in BC, now that was fun, i've pretty much given up on 80 raiding because it is FUCKIN BORING... everything is faceroll, not strategy required, healers stand there, caster DPS stand there, tank boss over here, off tank over there, 3rd off tank over here, melee DPS spread out behind boss in a arc must stay 10 yards away from each other, when trash mob spawns, off tanks will pick it up, caster DPS burn add, melee DPS stay on main boss... the difficult strategies of the BC bosses no longer exist anymore... everything is too easy these days... and i'm sick and tired of getting stuck in guilds that have ppl with 5K gear scores and don't know how to fuckin DPS, its like that gear they are wearing isn't actually epic, i've honestly seen ppl in blues and Naxx 10 epics do sweet DPS, coz they know "HOW" to play their class, instead of facerolling and hoping for the best, it sickens me that there is no more challenge to this game... so fuckin suck it up blizz and bring some of the challenge back... at least for the hard core raiders anyways... maybe there might be more ppl like me who actually get back into raiding coz there will be a challenge there... maybe you should read forums that aren't blizz controlled and you could see where everyone is actually bitching at you to make it harder... but no... you don't fuckin listen, its all about making it easier for the new player... FUCK THAT, i had to learn how to play the hard way... so can the new ppl, and if they can't handle it... then they shouldn't be playing

You whiny ass shithead. You don't even do the fucking math in the game. You go to Elitist Jerk and do whatever they say.

And if you do the math yourself, why don't you fucking use your fucking math skills to help NASA build a fucking rocket ship instead of a fucking MMO game?

Shit!

[Krypt]

I thought they were also going to remove resil? Are they still doing that or no? If not the pvp is still not gonna be fun for the average player

No they wont remove resil.

[Krypt]

HAHAHA, you tell them mate, i totally agree with ya there, so much i'm looking forward to and so much that i'm just gonna wanna /facepalm over. i mean come on, dropping defense coz its too hard to reach cap... are ppl fuckin retarded, i easily reached 540 defense in full blues, wasn't hard at all, just grind a few instance til you get the item you need to hit defense cap, then start raidin same shit goes there, grind the raids til you get the gear you want, and getting shit crafted has never been easier... come on Blizzard, don't make this game anymore FACEROLL than it already is... make it fuckin way harder, like in BC, now that was fun, i've pretty much given up on 80 raiding because it is FUCKIN BORING... everything is faceroll, not strategy required, healers stand there, caster DPS stand there, tank boss over here, off tank over there, 3rd off tank over here, melee DPS spread out behind boss in a arc must stay 10 yards away from each other, when trash mob spawns, off tanks will pick it up, caster DPS burn add, melee DPS stay on main boss... the difficult strategies of the BC bosses no longer exist anymore... everything is too easy these days... and i'm sick and tired of getting stuck in guilds that have ppl with 5K gear scores and don't know how to fuckin DPS, its like that gear they are wearing isn't actually epic, i've honestly seen ppl in blues and Naxx 10 epics do sweet DPS, coz they know "HOW" to play their class, instead of facerolling and hoping for the best, it sickens me that there is no more challenge to this game... so fuckin suck it up blizz and bring some of the challenge back... at least for the hard core raiders anyways... maybe there might be more ppl like me who actually get back into raiding coz there will be a challenge there... maybe you should read forums that aren't blizz controlled and you could see where everyone is actually bitching at you to make it harder... but no... you don't fuckin listen, its all about making it easier for the new player... FUCK THAT, i had to learn how to play the hard way... so can the new ppl, and if they can't handle it... then they shouldn't be playing

Did they say defence was too hard to cap? I can't remember those exact words.

Edit: Upon re-reading they said 'juggling aroud the cap'. My interpretation is removing the need to re-gem for defense after changing from a blue to purple that has bings more dodge/parry/stamina but less defense. I sure as hell found that annoying.

[Wyrmking]

Removed.

[Piptooth]

You fucking shit. ArP is not only mathy, it's also fucking useless to some specs. Enhancement Shamans share gear with Hunters yet Hunter gear has so much ArP which is useless to Enhancement Shamans that mainly uses magic attack.

You whiny ass shitheads need to kill yourselves.

I sense a little rage? It's not my fault your probably an enhancement shaman who can't gear himself.

[Piptooth]

Shithead.

Vanilla had horrible itemization while some of the stats introduced in BC are useless to some specs. Armor Penetration = useless to Rets and Enhancement.

And they're removing AP and SP because when you get new gear, you have to make a choice but it's harder to do that when one gear has more agility but the other gear has more attack power and you have to do the math.

This is an effing MMO game not NASA. If you want to do a math go to college or build a rocket ship for NASA.

Shitheads like you need to die.

Can't do 7th Grade math? lolumad?

[Sarevokcz]

Resto/Ele Shaman will want Int,Crit,Spirit,Haste,Mastery in varying degrees.

Hunter/Enh Shaman will want Agi,Crit,Haste/Mastery (and exp for shamans). So the 1 item per spec thing shouldn't be too severe? Enhances have talents to regen mana, they won't need spirit.

thanks Captain Obvious for point that out! ... i KNOW what caster shaman will want, all i wonder is why, since this change WILL mean more stoen clothes for shaman/paladins

regarding enha, right now, they have pretty big bonuses from int, not to mention they cant work with only base mana quite well, less manapool = less replenishment, less whatever else %mana based, unless their system is reworked to work without intelect on gear, they will be either underperforming or there will be 2 types of agi mail gear...

[Wyrmking]

I sense a little rage? It's not my fault your probably an enhancement shaman who can't gear himself.

LOL, yeah 'coz you know choice between a lower level gear that's better itemized than going for a better gear with a useless stat is totally my fault! I wait, no! It isn't!

Shithead.

Go quit the fucking game.

[Wyrmking]

Can't do 7th Grade math? lolumad?

It's a video game! lolumad?

Not to mention you just go to Elitist Jerk and you do what they say anyway. Stop trying to act like your fucking hardcore you fucking bitch.

[Krypt]

thanks Captain Obvious for point that out! ... i KNOW what caster shaman will want, all i wonder is why, since this change WILL mean more stoen clothes for shaman/paladins

regarding enha, right now, they have pretty big bonuses from int, not to mention they cant work with only base mana quite well, less manapool = less replenishment, less whatever else %mana based, unless their system is reworked to work without intelect on gear, they will be either underperforming or there will be 2 types of agi mail gear...

I think blizzard will just delete enhance shamans. Adding a few more % mana returned to Shamanistic rage is too complicated.

[Krypt]

Can't do 7th Grade math? lolumad?

i didn't learn how to code excel spreadsheets that could incorporate the armory + talent specs + different buffs, then run a test based on rotation and mob factors, over a period of hours you can define, to give an overall DPS as well as stat weights. Might just of been my school though.

[Piptooth]

LOL, yeah 'coz you know choose between a lower level gear that's better itemized than going for a better gear with a useless stat is totally my fault! I wait, no! It isn't!

Shithead.

Go quit the fucking game.

I don't know all the enhance shamans I know got around there gear without qqing. Sorry your bad.

It's a video game! lolumad?

Not to mention you just go to Elitist Jerk and you do what they say anyway. Stop trying to act like your fucking hardcore you fucking bitch.

And you can't do the same why? Stop crying cause you can't add numbers.


and lol@ the 12 year olds swearing, it's cute.

i didn't learn how to code excel spreadsheets that could incorporate the armory + talent specs + different buffs, then run a test based on rotation and mob factors, over a period of hours you can define, to give an overall DPS as well as stat weights. Might just of been my school though.

Dl Rawr, it does it for you.

I'm clearly just stating that they are making the game to simple just for the casuals. Wtb Hardcore Mode...

[dew]

I don't understand how anyone can complain about "dumbing the game down".

Mana regen will work for all healers the way it works for Priests.

Everyone will get Attack Power and Spell power the same way Plate classes get their AP.

All Tanks will get their anti-crit the same way Druids do.

Armor Penetration will work the same way it does now for specs that need it, it's just that it won't be a completely useless stat for classes that don't need it, but one stat on gear that's individualized for every spec.

Notice a common theme? Everything they're doing is already being done in-game! They're just expanding on what works and removing what isn't working so well.

Haste gets buffed to benefit melee classes more, Block gets a much-needed scaling change, and Stamina is absolutely needed to keep the PVP fights from lasting 3 seconds between fresh 85's with no resilience.

[Krypt]

Dl Rawr, it does it for you.

I'm clearly just stating that they are making the game to simple just for the casuals. Wtb Hardcore Mode...

Yes, Rawr does everything for you. When cataclysm hits, you won't need to use Rawr. How is that bad? And no matter how simple(read:more useful) they make the stats it won;t make people move from fire faster...