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  1. #1
    The Patient
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    Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Alrighty, so....
    While I haven't downloaded Landsoul's spreadsheet yet, I figured I'd get some feedback on what you other Warriors would think/do.

    Would you replace your Dual-Blade with Bryntroll, gaining the lifesteal (average around...3.5-5% of my total dmg), and losing around 2.5% Crit and close to 5% Armor Penetration.

    I haven't had a good chance to test it and spreadsheet the differences yet.
    Let me know what you think.

  2. #2

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Short answer, Bryntoll.

    Bryn gives you ~40 more base wep dps, the proc, 20 more base strength, and a extra socket on top of that. Making it better than Dual-Blade.
    <Decidedly Uncouth> Horde Mal'Ganis

  3. #3

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    I <i>think</i> that as Arms the non-heroic Bryntroll is stronger than the heroic Dual-Blade Butcher for Arms, and that the situation is reversed for Fury (albeit not by a ton). As always, though, your best bet involves using the spreadsheet.
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  4. #4
    Dreadlord B@nj0 P3do's Avatar
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    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by RPZip
    I <i>think</i> that as Arms the non-heroic Bryntroll is stronger than the heroic Dual-Blade Butcher for Fury, and that the situation is reversed for Fury (albeit not by a ton). As always, though, your best bet involves using the spreadsheet.
    WAT?

  5. #5

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by pangeltveit
    WAT?
    Whoops, the first one was supposed to be Arms.
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  6. #6

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    For Arms, Bryntroll > Heroic Justicebringer.
    For Fury, Bryntroll > Heroic Justicebringer.

    You gear around white DPS of weapons. You can get +8% ARP from other places... however, your rings do not add +20 or +40 white DPS. If you're right at 100% ARP with proc, then take Bryntroll, bank it, and use it as soon as you can get 100% w/o JB.
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  7. #7

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Hi I would like to ask a similar question, but this is regarding using Bryntroll as a offhand.

    I will be getting Shadows Edge this week if my guild manages to kill the first 2 new bosses (which is likely) and was wondering what I should be using as my offhand. Currently I'm deciding between QuelDelar (str one, which I already have) and Byrntroll as my offhand. Ive looked at both landsouls spreadsheet and rawr and both say queldelar is better but im unsure if this is correct because it may not take into account the proc (how much will it proc as a offhand wep?). Also I am an orc so I will benefit from being easily expertised capped by dual wielding axes. Unfortunately, . It also seems that if I have Shadow's Edge and Bryntroll, putting Bryntroll in MH actually gives higher dps than equipping them the other way round. I cant link my armory profile because I am currently wearing my tanking gear

    Please let me know which you think the better offhand is.


  8. #8

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by Fible
    Hi I would like to ask a similar question, but this is regarding using Bryntroll as a offhand.

    I will be getting Shadows Edge this week if my guild manages to kill the first 2 new bosses (which is likely) and was wondering what I should be using as my offhand. Currently I'm deciding between QuelDelar (str one, which I already have) and Byrntroll as my offhand. Ive looked at both landsouls spreadsheet and rawr and both say queldelar is better but im unsure if this is correct because it may not take into account the proc (how much will it proc as a offhand wep?). Also I am an orc so I will benefit from being easily expertised capped by dual wielding axes. Unfortunately, . It also seems that if I have Shadow's Edge and Bryntroll, putting Bryntroll in MH actually gives higher dps than equipping them the other way round. I cant link my armory profile because I am currently wearing my tanking gear

    Please let me know which you think the better offhand is.

    Off hand doesn't affect dps so much. That's why you usually want to use an OH weapon that gives you better stats. The health proc on the byrntroll is pretty usless for pve, you would probably want something that gives you Crit + something else.
    Fury warrior - http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Malfurion&n=Sogord

  9. #9

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Except that the health proc is a steal health proc... so it deals that much damage and heals you with it. From all recounts coming in its got a pretty high rate too. I would say its at least worth looking at in comparison to the ilvl 258 Justicebringer.
    When you shoop da whoop, you feel powerful and don't want to lose it, and then a guy in plate armor comes and turns your woop against the shoop, hence, making you got laz0red.

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  10. #10

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kysimir
    You gear around white DPS of weapons. You can get +8% ARP from other places... however, your rings do not add +20 or +40 white DPS. If you're right at 100% ARP with proc, then take Bryntroll, bank it, and use it as soon as you can get 100% w/o JB.
    Uh, you really don't. Let's assume for just a second that you're at the ArP hardcap (or softcap) with your Dual-Blade Butcher, which means that you need to convert some gem slots from +94 STR to +94 ArP to cover the loss of the DBB/JB. 94 STR with Imp. Zerker and Kings is 248 AP, or ~17.7 character sheet DPS. Bryntroll is only 13 character sheet DPS over the heroic DBB/JB... which means that you're effectively using a higher DPS weapon with the heroic DBB than you are with the Bryntroll. This is completely ignoring the effect of STR on special attacks (and a potential second weapon), the crit on the heroic JB/DBB and the proc on the Bryntroll, but if you just gear based on the listed DPS on the weapon you're ignoring some incredibly obvious factors that should impact your decision.
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  11. #11

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by RPZip
    Uh, you really don't. Let's assume for just a second that you're at the ArP hardcap (or softcap) with your Dual-Blade Butcher, which means that you need to convert some gem slots from +94 STR to +94 ArP to cover the loss of the DBB/JB. 94 STR with Imp. Zerker and Kings is 248 AP, or ~17.7 character sheet DPS. Bryntroll is only 13 character sheet DPS over the heroic DBB/JB... which means that you're effectively using a higher DPS weapon with the heroic DBB than you are with the Bryntroll. This is completely ignoring the effect of STR on special attacks (and a potential second weapon), the crit on the heroic JB/DBB and the proc on the Bryntroll, but if you just gear based on the listed DPS on the weapon you're ignoring some incredibly obvious factors that should impact your decision.
    For starters... you said it yourself. "some incredibly obvious" factors. Obviously, I am not condoning dropping your ARP to 90% from 100%, or taking a +5 white DPS upgrade with zero stats over a something itemized like Shadowmourne (extremism to prove a point). Obvious statements are typically left out because they are obvious.

    That being said... +13 white DPS isn't exceptional, but it is there. You're ignoring the incredibly obvious effects of increased rage generation from a +13 character sheet DPS, and effects like heroism (etc) where white DPS will trump 284 AP. Nevermind the fact that the OP is referring to NORMAL JB.

    In addition, the health proc is steal health and based on last night's raid, at 9k (Arms) DPS on a single target boss, it accounted for 6% of my DPS. Now, unless you're suggesting that when I lost 284 AP and 2% crit I lost >6% of my DPS; so the 6% of my DPS I gained with the proc, and X% (I'm lazy) DPS I gained from using a +13 white DPS weapon was a bad move... then the choice is obvious.
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  12. #12

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kysimir
    That being said... +13 white DPS isn't exceptional, but it is there. You're ignoring the incredibly obvious effects of increased rage generation from a +13 character sheet DPS, and effects like heroism (etc) where white DPS will trump 284 AP.
    No, I'm actually saying that you're kind of an idiot. 13 white DPS will never trump 284 AP. 13 white DPS (ignoring factors like it not effecting a second weapon, if present) is equal to 182 AP, as every 14 Attack Power is equivalent to 1 weapon DPS. In the worst possible scenario (normalized special attacks, where AP is added as if it were a 3.4 speed weapon and the actual weapon was 3.7) it'd still be equal to ~200 AP. You simply do not just ignore the stats on a weapon in favor of the white DPS or pure item level considerations; while those are often the deciding factor, especially when the item level is fairly close to another weapon the stats can easily outweigh it.

    In addition, the health proc is steal health and based on last night's raid, at 9k (Arms) DPS on a single target boss, it accounted for 6% of my DPS. Now, unless you're suggesting that when I lost 284 AP and 2% crit I lost >6% of my DPS; so the 6% of my DPS I gained with the proc, and X% (I'm lazy) DPS I gained from using a +13 white DPS weapon was a bad move... then the choice is obvious.
    Actually, my original post said that it was better than a heroic JB/DBB for Arms but was inferior for Fury (which would see fewer procs out of it than Arms would, for one thing). Given that my statement is in fact, you know, accurate I'm feeling fairly confident about it.
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  13. #13

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    According to most DPS sites (maxdps.com is one i checked first) Bryntroll is BiS of the available weapons. Only Shadowmourne and Shadow's Edge are better. This goes for all melee classes, warrior pally, DK.

  14. #14

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    maxdps.com
    :
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  15. #15

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kysimir
    For starters... you said it yourself. "some incredibly obvious" factors. Obviously, I am not condoning dropping your ARP to 90% from 100%, or taking a +5 white DPS upgrade with zero stats over a something itemized like Shadowmourne (extremism to prove a point). Obvious statements are typically left out because they are obvious.

    That being said... +13 white DPS isn't exceptional, but it is there. You're ignoring the incredibly obvious effects of increased rage generation from a +13 character sheet DPS, and effects like heroism (etc) where white DPS will trump 284 AP. Nevermind the fact that the OP is referring to NORMAL JB.

    In addition, the health proc is steal health and based on last night's raid, at 9k (Arms) DPS on a single target boss, it accounted for 6% of my DPS. Now, unless you're suggesting that when I lost 284 AP and 2% crit I lost >6% of my DPS; so the 6% of my DPS I gained with the proc, and X% (I'm lazy) DPS I gained from using a +13 white DPS weapon was a bad move... then the choice is obvious.
    Wow your bad. And a liar.

    Why does your guild give you gear?

    And what fight did you do 9k single target dps on? The top 25 world records for arms only have 2 fights in ICC (Saurfang) where only 9 arms warriors have broken the 9k. On Marrowgar theres only 7 people in the world who play arms that can break 9k. No fights in TOC are single target fights, unless you count twins depending on how your guild does them, in which 9k dps is pretty lawl.

    WWS or WOL please, or stop your BS now.

    http://www.wowmeteronline.com/rank/c...ps/war/9/0/3/3

  16. #16

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by sogord
    The health proc on the byrntroll is pretty usless for pve,
    I wouldn't say that, especially for blood knights. One of our biggest priorities is staying above 75% health for blood-gorged.

  17. #17

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Bryntroll > DBB for both specs. (It may not be so on off-hand though)

    When it comes to Shadow's Edge (not mentioning Shadowmourne as it's BiS and we are pretty far away from it), I have both Ramaladni's and Citadel Enforcer along with a Bryntroll. The best setup is Bryntroll on MH, Shadow's Edge on OH from these 4 for me, even though I drop under the expertise cap. Max weapon damage is still a good indicator so ilvl differences between weapons do tend to favor the higher one, most of the time.

  18. #18

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    bryntroll as offhand is pretty much dumb , because you don't maximize the procc then , thus lowering the dmg potential of the whole weapon then. Of course its Bryntroll mainhand and shadows edge/whatever offhand.

  19. #19

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by 5ergio
    Bryntroll > DBB for both specs. (It may not be so on off-hand though)

    When it comes to Shadow's Edge (not mentioning Shadowmourne as it's BiS and we are pretty far away from it), I have both Ramaladni's and Citadel Enforcer along with a Bryntroll. The best setup is Bryntroll on MH, Shadow's Edge on OH from these 4 for me, even though I drop under the expertise cap. Max weapon damage is still a good indicator so ilvl differences between weapons do tend to favor the higher one, most of the time.
    Can I see some numbers? because if that is the case I will go ahead and try to get the Byrntroll as my mh and put Shadowsedge in off

  20. #20

    Re: Bryntroll VS Dual Blade Butcher (non-heroic)

    Quote Originally Posted by Fible
    Can I see some numbers? because if that is the case I will go ahead and try to get the Byrntroll as my mh and put Shadowsedge in off
    I'm basing those facts on the spreadsheet, with my OWN gear. So it's better for you to download the spreadsheet, import your armory and see for yourself.

    For reference;

    Shadow's Edge MH, Ramaladni's OH ---> 8181 dps
    Shadow's Edge MH, Bryntroll OH ---> 8170 dps
    Bryntroll MH, Shadow's Edge OH ---> 8222 dps
    Bryntroll MH, Ramaladni's OH ---> 8042 (this is the setup I'm using now)

    Un-equpping Ramaladni's drop me under the expertise cap. Even though I'm under it, Bryntroll & Shadow's Edge is the best duo for me.

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