Optional bosses in Heroics

[Iosif]

Its been stated before... Most Battle groups it takes 10-15mins to Q as a DPS... Healers and Tanks enjoy a cool 0-2min Q time, so for healers and takes it makes seance to skip the extra bosses that only take 2-5 mins each because they add 8-10+ mins to your run and only yield 1-2 more badges.

If your after the best time spent doing something for Triumph badges, you may want to look at Nax, Nax has 15 bosses each drop 2-3 badges it takes ~2hours for a "decent PuG" to clear if they are intersted in a speed run and not to many horrably geared Alts... thats ~40 badges / 120 mins or 1badge every 3 mins.

As a DPS if your speed running heroics as a PuG.. your looking at a 10-15min Q for about 15min run to get 4-6 badges...

5 (Badges) / 25 (Mins) = 1 badge every 5 mins...

If your a Healer/Tank it gets a bit better...
5 (Badges) / 15 (Mins) = 1 badge every 3 mins...

Last week my guild did a speed run to help some alts get geared.. it took us 68mins to clear all of Naxx with half Mains/Alts... 40badges / ~60mins = 1 badge every 1.5mins ... that's almost double the badge rate if.

Something to keep in mind if your a in a raiding guild and looking to gear up people fast.

[Zao]

@Iosif:
You forget to calculate the time it takes to FIND a decent PUG for Naxx. At least on my server (rather small) we get max 2 Groups for Naxx10 per week. And it might easily take one hour for a (good) group to form.

[Purno]

I never really understand why people want to skip the optional bosses in HoS Heroic. IMO those two optional bosses are pretty easy (especially Maiden of Grief) compared to the Brann event which still causes most wipes. Considering the average DPS queue of 10 minutes (Healer queue somewhere between instant and 2 minutes), those two extra easy bosses don't take that much time, and the loot is always a nice bit of gold (including disenchanted mats) and an extra emblem of triumph which can be used for several goals (if you got plenty of them, get 10 of them for an uncut epic gem which sells for about 150g at the AH at my server).

Summarized, the optional bosses in HoS are the easiest, I don't see how it can be worth skipping them.

[batkat]

I never really understand why people want to skip the optional bosses in HoS Heroic. IMO those two optional bosses are pretty easy (especially Maiden of Grief) compared to the Brann event which still causes most wipes. Considering the average DPS queue of 10 minutes (Healer queue somewhere between instant and 2 minutes), those two extra easy bosses don't take that much time, and the loot is always a nice bit of gold (including disenchanted mats) and an extra emblem of triumph which can be used for several goals (if you got plenty of them, get 10 of them for an uncut epic gem which sells for about 150g at the AH at my server).

Summarized, the optional bosses in HoS are the easiest, I don't see how it can be worth skipping them.

HoS comes across as being one of the most common random dungeons hit up. Its preferable to just skip the 2 bosses in favor of getting out of the dungeon faster. Sure the other two bosses don't take much time to go kill, but it would be time we have to spend in HoS which we don't want to.

[Mothric]

IMO those two optional bosses are pretty easy

For many of us it doesn't even matter how easy they are, it's all about wrapping up the heroic as quickly as possible. Almost all of them can be completed before the dungeon timer is up.
I have 8 80s and I'm not going to full clear every heroic on every toon.

[Aerikaya]

Optional bosses are just that, optional. But from another tank that just does randoms for the frost badges, I have the courtesy to ask the group if they wanna do the optional bosses. Majority rules. The 5 minutes I save not doing optional bosses translates to maybe one extra node mined, one extra herb gathered or 3 extra laps around Dalaran. No big loss to me.

And for those that think just being a jerk because you will never see these people again... I have gotten cross realm players that remembered me(in a good way). So just give it time, you will become known.

[Dregas_Volar]

Optional bosses are just that, optional. But from another tank that just does randoms for the frost badges, I have the courtesy to ask the group if they wanna do the optional bosses. Majority rules. The 5 minutes I save not doing optional bosses translates to maybe one extra node mined, one extra herb gathered or 3 extra laps around Dalaran. No big loss to me.

And for those that think just being a jerk because you will never see these people again... I have gotten cross realm players that remembered me(in a good way). So just give it time, you will become known.

^This.
I always ask if I'm tanking, majority always wins.
If I'm DPSing I just go where the tank goes.

[Frumpy Frumpy Frak]

I always drop group unless it's Occulus or Forge of Souls so yeah...

[DocQuantum]

When I get into the LFG for heroics, I'm just looking to get my Emblems of Frost and hoping to have a little fun with it. As such, I'm pretty easy going. If the group wants to skip optional bosses, that's great: less time spent. If the group doesn't want to skip the optional bosses, that's great too... even if it is just a little extra looted gold.

WoW is a multiplayer game. It goes best when folks are willing to compromise. Guess it just comes down to how folks say it. There's a HUGE difference between "we're skipping the optionals because it's a waste of MY time" and "you guys want to just skip the optionals and get out of here faster?"

[bendak]

I tend to be unlucky and get Old Kingdom a lot... the first thing I ask is if people are up for skipping to the final boss.

If anyone says no, I drop group immediately.

I don't run heroics for fun or for triumphs... I run them to keep up with the status quo. Personally I just wish I could get my 14 frost emblems all in one day for that week and get them over with. :P

[Dapuh]

they do what the tank wants to do, be the tank or get a tank that shares your view.

[Dalien]

The way I see it, running a random heroic is a coop experience and you need to go with what the majority wants. If the group wants to down the optional bosses, and you don't, just find another group.

Me, I only started farming heroics with 3.3 so I'm still enjoying them. I imagine the same is true for a lot of people... 3.3 changed the face of pugging forever and made it extremely accessible.

[Samin]

they do what the tank wants to do, be the tank or get a tank that shares your view.

O RLY? I always thought DPS had most players with bad personalities..but actually it's tanks. "i has 1 sec queue. i r god."
Everything I read is "I only want frost", I get faster triumphs without optionals", "I, I, I".
You know, there are 4 other people in your group.
Let's look at a heroic 5 man pug.
1 has no queue looking for groups.
1 has a quite short queue looking for groups.
3 have a medium to long queue looking for groups.
It was posted earlier that leaving out bosses is only efficient if you have no queue in terms of triumph farming (people who only run for frost shouldn't care and get over it. you could get lucky and join a 4/5 bosses down group).

[Cronic420]

Just because YOUR queing for the "random" doesnt mean others are , unless im mistaken. and if thats the case, chances are your queing with people that actually want to run for triumph not frost.

[Deleted]

Im im tanking i skip them by default, waste of time to do them
If im healing i try to get them to skip them, tho im not always succesful :P

[Malevic]

i only go in for the frost on my main tbh. I have over 200 triumph badges on him and only use them for gems when i need to get new gems. I dont have issues with doing optional bosses, I just go with the group and kill what ever boss they fight too. The extra 30 seconds to a min dosent bother me much cause i would rather take the time to do it than spend another 15-30 min waiting for my que again (or for an alts que).

Most of the instances i go on with the random happen to be with fairly new to heroic toons (not players, just the toons). If I was trying to gear up one of my alts I would like to get the optional bosses for all the badges possible since farming both triumph and frost will yeild a faster route to gearing up in total. While you might not share this view, you are not the only one that plays WoW.

With the exception of CoS, and the 3 ICC instances. All the rest can be done with in 12-15 min with people trying to gear up (this includes the optional bosses).

One of the groups my guildmate was in where he was the group leader had someone like the OP in his group. They got to the final boss then vote kicked him from the group just to deny him the frost badges.

[Magruun]

What is people's obsession with speed these days?
I only run a random heroic for the badges but there's people with lesser geared characters or alts who actually need stuff from the heroics.
I don't see why people kick lesser geared people for content that's actually designed for that level.
and I don't see why people skip bosses without at least everyone agreeing, if someone needs triumph badges or gear you should do it.
this is an MMO, you play -with- other people that means you should not be selfish and help them out while chasing your own goals.

[SPC7R0]

"but mathematically, if clearing to each boss takes say 5 minutes, you can clear 2 bosses and get 2 triumphs + 2 bonus triumphs (4) in 10 minutes, or spend 20 minutes clearing 4 bosses, and get 1+1+1+1+2 (6) triumph. 4/10 > 6/20.

i stopped reading here

[Pascal]

Some people want the reputation gains for their reputation achievements. That gets done rather quickly, though, only takes a few days of constantly running dungeons.

It's cute how few people have fun running heroics. I tank every single random heroic I do on my druid because I obviously don't feel like waiting for 20 minutes. I've done every single heroic ten thousand million times, but I actually enjoy playing the game and I have fun pulling 2-3 packs at a time and tanking shit. I know you all have such busy lives and are oh so bored of such and such instance, but maybe that's a hint that you should be doing something else with your time other than playing a game you don't like.

[Xiangu]

The best emblem/time dungeon at the moment is oculus - you have 5 bosses, your 2 random triumphs and the 2 extra triumphs from the loot-bag -> 9 emblems in less than 20 minutes (yeah I doubt you will spend more than 20 minutes in there)

Now sure.. in dungeons like Azjul-Nerub you can rush through the whole instance in say 10 minutes and have 5 emblems. 5 Emblems in 10 minutes sounds better than 9 emblems in 20 minutes.. however you can't really control where you end up anyway because it's random.

Ok so I got a bit side-tracked just now with the above comparison with 5 emblems in 10 minutes.. you can't really choose which dungeon you will end up anyway but the OP has made a similar comparison by skipping bosses. And in theory that's absolutely correct.
Some people stated that your queue time is very high - and yes that's true too but it has nothing to do with the time spent in the dungeon.

Now let's assume you are finished in 10 minutes with your dungeon and queue again - the queue will then take another 10 minutes and you're at 20 minutes (for 5 emblems).

Assuming you took 20 minutes for 7 emblems. You would still spend another 10 minutes in the queue and would have a sub-total of 7 emblems in 30 minutes.

Ok that all put aside - the real problem with this equasion is that you have a 15 minute debuff when queuing for random heroics. So any run under 15 minutes is completely redundant and unnecessary. You can't queue before this debuff is gone anyway. So if you can manage to squeeze in the extra bosses - by all means do them. And be happy if you end up in Oculus. Due to the extra triumphs it's the best and most time efficient way to farm your emblems (unless you really just want the frost emblems - then you might as well just skip as many bosses as you want because you don't have to requeue anyway - but then don't tell your fellow party members that they gain any advantage from playing like that :P)