Resilience and tanking:

[krasgoth]

Nothing to do with the new resilience changes - How much resilience do you need to be uncrittable in dungeons/raids at the moment?

Thinking of putting together a pvp set for tanking to help on things like Lana'thel, Rotface, or other encounters where "Tanking" is necessary but damage is far better to have rather than avoidance and survivability.

Never done it before so I'm looking it up now, just thought people might have ideas on the "Defense cap" of resilience so you can't get crit.

[Mr_Bojangles]

If you skimp on avoidance stats, you will die. You had a bad idea.

[Nàrcissus]

Resilience has no effect in pve ...period. in tbc it was possible to stack resilience to become uncrittable but I believe it was patch 3.0 that this aspect was removed. Now defense is the only option.

[krasgoth]

Not that I expected you to READ the post, but read it this time.

Here, I'll type it again in case you are physically unable to look up.

For fights like Lana'thel or Rotface, where "Tanking" is required (ie: Kiting a mob around, eating Mirror Shield hits, Saurfang tanking, things that don't require avoidance or ignore it completely), I want to put together this set.

So unless you know the amount needed to be uncrittable, shush :P

Narc - I've seen several prot paladins in full ret pvp sets that have easily tanked HHoR, so the affect hasn't been removed as far as I know, which is why I'm asking.

[rahdek]

Although it would be ill-advised to do so, you need enough resilience to reach 5.6% crit immunity, I don't know what that is off the top of my head, but a full set of off-set gear might do the trick.

What the others have said before me still holds true. You're avoidance will be lacking so much that you still have a high chance of being 2-shot, even though you may not be getting crit in the face.

As I see it, you have 2 options, get a full tank set, and tank, or just hope that you don't get crit if you take a couple hits in your dps gear.

[Devlin1991]

as of 3.3,

yes resilience does make your Crit immune. Why do you think some guilds used Druid tanks in a mix of resilence and tanking gear to make them Crit immune even with the -defence debuff on Thorim hard mode.


The reduction to be Crit from Resilience does work in PvE. the crit reduction and damage reduction dont, as those parts clearly state "from players,pets and minions"

[krasgoth]

Ok, maybe people are misunderstanding what's going on here, heh.

For fights with harsh timers, (even if others don't consider them to be harsh), I want to have an off set of gear. I already have a set of tanking gear, that isn't the issue, here's my alt in all his glory:

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...rd&cn=Kelannar

Now, the issue is, for fights like Lana'thel, where you could easily be off by 200k-300k at the time of enraging but you still need someone to eat the Blood Mirror hits and that extra bit of damage could tip the scales. Now, I either wear my regular prot set, or I sub in a pvp set (which has hitpoints that are just as high to eat blood Mirror hits) but deal a lot more damage in the interim. My avoidance on Lanathel means nothing, my avoidance kiting around a slime on Rotface means nothing, my avoidance on Saurfang means nothing because he hits like a 4 year old girl. But in all those cases, extra damage will help the raid out.

I'll have the exact same amount of hp and in any of those cases, my avoidance means nothing, because I'm not tanking, I'm just a person "taking hits", which doesn't involve the boss hitting me, like in a lot of cases. I could even do this on Blood princes tanking Keleseth.

Devlin - Yeah, that's what I thought, a lot of people are uninformed and quote patch notes that never said things. I wish people would read and verify their facts before posting them :P

[blargh312]

460 Resilience. WoWWiki is hard.

[zox]

You need 5.6% resilience to become uncrittable. (Your resilience and def combined must give you 5.6%)

[krasgoth]

Zox - thanks!

Blargh - That might've been helpful if you weren't trying to be a douche for no reason I guess? Or if you linked the WoWWiki article with the information in it? Or just linked the article? I appreciate it anyways

[luthe]

You list festergut as an example.. but he hits like a truck, if you're really valuing damage (a negligible increase in pvp gear vs say a block set which is still more effective then a resil set, albeit worse then a regular tanking set), get better dps or well, put on a block set.

Resillience sets = all of your avoidance gone, and probably dropping 10-15k health raid buffed depending on your gear.

You'll be a mana sponge and in some cases you could be 1-2 shot in 10man regular.

[blargh312]

Blargh - That might've been helpful if you weren't trying to be a douche for no reason I guess? Or if you linked the WoWWiki article with the information in it? Or just linked the article? I appreciate it anyways

I'm never a douche for no reason. You could have saved yourself a whole hell of a lot of trouble had you taken the time to do a simple google search for resilience crit immunity and clicked on the first link.

[krasgoth]

You list festergut as an example.. but he hits like a truck, if you're really valuing damage (a negligible increase in pvp gear vs say a block set which is still more effective then a resil set, albeit worse then a regular tanking set), get better dps or well, put on a block set.

Resillience sets = all of your avoidance gone, and probably dropping 10-15k health raid buffed depending on your gear.

You'll be a mana sponge and in some cases you could be 1-2 shot in 10man regular.

I list *rotface* as an example, silly, not festergut. Rotface I'll be kiting slimes and damaging Rotface when it's down.

[Devlin1991]

...

Resillience sets = all of your avoidance gone, and probably dropping 10-15k health raid buffed depending on your gear.

...

This is incorrect on the HP drop part. A lot of pvp gear is BIS for Effective health if you are going for a pure Hp Pool.

[krasgoth]

You probably wouldn't notice much of a change on the fights except my damage numbers doubling and the enrages not being so stressed.

The pvp gear is, like Devlin said for the most part, better for a pure health pool. I can gem a full set of relentless for strength and have double my strength, but with the same amount of hitpoints (give or take a couple thousand) to soak with, and not have to worry about halving my hp wearing actual dps gear (which yes, would make me a squishy and worthless as a tank)

What I'm trying to do is somewhere in the middle, for harsher enrage timers and such.

[Mr_Bojangles]

I didn't expect you to read my post, but READ it. You had a bad idea.

Blood mirror can't crit because its a spell, kiters don't dps on rotface, saurfang wont hit like a little girl without the avoidance.

On lenathal, go die in a fire. The second person to get bit goes and dies in a fire, then gets rezzed, and that extends the time until enrage enough to make the dps requirement a joke.

Also, I read your origional post a few times, because I was trying to maybe see if I was reading it wrong, and that maybe it wasn't a bad idea.

@devlin: its because druids benefit alot less from defense.

[krasgoth]

*sigh*

Maybe your kiters are useless and don't do dps on rotface, but its really not hard to go and hit rotface while the slime explodes, or there is no slime, or none has spawned yet. Blood mirror was used as an example for hp soaking, I don't care if it crits, I do however care if Saurfang crits, or if I fumble and get hit by a slime on Rotface, or [insert situation here] that I will need to be crit immune and dealing damage for.

Like I said though, if *you* think that enrage timers or requirements are a joke, fantastic, but I don't care, and I want opinions on what I'm trying to do instead

[Mr_Bojangles]

You asked for my opinion, I gave it. I think it is a bad idea. Any resemblance of a benefit is lost to not being able to hold the boss in a panic situation. How much extra dps do you really think you will do? Do you think you will get an extra 1k dps? 2k? Don't paladins already stack the strength? So really all you would be picking up is the crit.

[krasgoth]

Well, that's a more fair opinion and something that I can actually theorycraft on.

Say I'm popping in http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40792 instead of my http://www.wowhead.com/?item=48652

I pick up the 1.7% crit, which is obvious. Gem it for 10 stats instead of 275 health. Pop 2 20 strength gems into it. So on one piece I've picked up (with kings) over 2% crit, 100 attack power, and lost a tiny bit of health.

Lets say I grab http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40884 instead of my boots http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40743

Again, once I gem it with 20 strength, I gain another 40 strength, and 1.5% crit. I actually GAIN hitpoints from what I'm wearing.

On every piece, I'm getting a 30-50% damage upgrade from straight strength, and crit is just a bonus factor on top of that. What i'm losing is... well, nothing. If rotface, Lana'thel, or Saurfang kills our tank, I'm SOL anyways, I could taunt and bubblewall with this gear and have the same result as wearing full tank gear.

[Lifereaver]

Resilience is a PVP stat only... it has been stated in the past but here is a recent post that re-iterates the point.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...99681400&sid=1

Just to clarify, the change to resilience affects ALL player damage. This includes both normal hits and crits. We wanted to keep the proportion of damage coming from hits and crits the same and just reduce damage across the board. Crit damage is lowered twice, but will still contribute the same proportion of damage as it does today.

Dots do receive a slight relative buff since they are no longer taxed more than other forms of damage.
Ghostcrawler
Lead Systems Designer

Resilience doesn't work with NPC's.