1. #1

    Confused...not in a gender way

    Hey MMO:Rogue,

    I have been reading this forum for a while now, and figured it was time to make an account to contribute.

    However, amongst all the crit calculators and character sheets, I have managed to only confuse myself. I have done what I can on my own to gear myself (Just joined a guild yesterday). But I cannot decide which spec/gems I need for optimal DPS/performance. First I was told AP and haste, then I was told agility. Which is it? Hopefully I can start raiding soon, ToC 25/ICC etc. but until then I will do what I can. My question for you is basically what you think... I have looked at other rogues' armories on here, most seem to be combat with ICC gear. This is not a luxury to me yet, so what do you think?
    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...&cn=Frodouserk

    Rotation is garrote>SnD>H4B>Mut>Env>Mut to 4+>Env

    On the dummy I pull around 3.8k burst and sustain near 3.6k, the initial amount due to garrote I imagine.

    Where do I go next? Thank you for your time and input!!


  2. #2

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Well you have the rotation pretty perfect however you shouldn't be using a ruptureless cycle yet.

    When you get to 4 x ilvl 245 you drop Rupture (as at this stage your rupture will be doing more DPS then Envenom).
    Currently you're rocking with 4 x ilvl 232 gear.

    As such your rotation should be:

    Garrote, SnD, HfB, Muti > Envenom (to refresh SnD), Muti to 4+, Rupture, Muti to 4+, Envenom/Rupture depending on if either SnD or Rupture is about to expire.



    As for gemming:
    With the poison changes in 3.3, its best to gem for

    AP (+40AP for Red)
    AP/Haste (+20AP/+10Haste)
    AP/Crit (+20AP/+10 Crit)
    AP/Hit (+20AP/+Hit)

    However this is dependant on your stats (Crit cap is very easy to achieve at the moment, so you'll see lots of rogues gemming AP/Hit at the mo, and Muti rogues love their AP/Haste gems as well).


    Other then that, you got it perfect!

  3. #3

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Awesome! Thank you for your reply! I'm assuming since I will be using rupture for the time being, that I should keep my 2 points in the blood spatter? Or does the build need some shifting of points?

    Thanks!

  4. #4

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    I didn't really understand why you 'only' got 3.6k dps on a dummy with this gear, but looking at your spec, I can now understand why

    You really need to respec. You currently miss 10% haste rating from Lightning Reflexes in Combattree. That one is very important!

    Look at the FAQ's for the most standard Mutilate build at the moment. You will see some changes with your build.

  5. #5

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Why would you even have to include that last part, wouldn't confused be good enough of a title?

    Sometimes, I don't get people at all.
    Escargotage - Lvl 80 Restoration Shaman - Thrall US

    Quote Originally Posted by krasgoth
    Hey guys, my guild keeps standing in the fire.

    What should we do about it?

  6. #6

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Keep Blood Spatter (and Glyph for Rupture as well). Also go for the 10% haste from the Combat tree.

    I've seen lots of Rogues (even guild members) running with Ruptureless cycles when they don't have the gear to support it (so you're not alone out there!).

    One of my guildies was still in 4 x T8.5 (which gives a "Rupture can now critical strike" bonus) and was using a ruptureless cycle.
    I had to /facepalm him.

    XD

  7. #7

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Quote Originally Posted by Escargotage
    Why would you even have to include that last part, wouldn't confused be good enough of a title?

    Sometimes, I don't get people at all.
    In this forum, it's better save than sorry.

  8. #8

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Quote Originally Posted by Massiefje
    I didn't really understand why you 'only' got 3.6k dps on a dummy with this gear, but looking at your spec, I can now understand why

    You really need to respec. You currently miss 10% haste rating from Lightning Reflexes in Combattree. That one is very important!

    Look at the FAQ's for the most standard Mutilate build at the moment. You will see some changes with your build.
    Ok! Im going to follow the build for lightning reflexes and see how that works out. I will keep the 2 points in blood spatter.

    Question: Is it really more beneficial to have the 2 "left over" subtlety points in relentless strikes versus Opportunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelticfox
    Keep Blood Spatter (and Glyph for Rupture as well). Also go for the 10% haste from the Combat tree.

    XD
    If I glyph for rupture which of the current ones should I drop H4B, SnD, or Mut

  9. #9

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Keep in mind that many of your talent choices are dependent on what gear you have. Just from browsing around though it looks like unless you're always energy capped (unlikely) then RS is better than Opportunity.
    Quote Originally Posted by Everything Nice View Post
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  10. #10

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanatos912
    Ok! Im going to follow the build for lightning reflexes and see how that works out. I will keep the 2 points in blood spatter.

    Question: Is it really more beneficial to have the 2 "left over" subtlety points in relentless strikes versus Opportunity?

    If I glyph for rupture which of the current ones should I drop H4B, SnD, or Mut
    You should never need glyph of SnD as mutilate as you should be refreshing it long before it ever would drop.

    That being said, I am not sure as to the benefits of keeping rupture up in your rotation, even at your gear levels. As I understand it, with the 3.3 poison change, you can go ruptureless at a lower gear level because maximizing poison damage is key. At any rate, using rupture or not using it should not make a huge difference in DPS in your gear, but try and drop rupture ASAP.

    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Detheroc&n=Smacklepuff

  11. #11

    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Drop the SnD glyph (why would you need the extra few seconds when Envenom refreshes it anyway?).

    You use Rupture before ilvl 245 because it simply does more damage then Envenom. Once you hit 4 x ilvl 245 your base stats are high enough to make the Envenom formulae more powerful then a Rupture.

    As for poisons changes affecting a cycle, it makes no difference. The poison changes were put in place to remove the need to swap weapons.

    Pre 4 x ilvl 245 = SnD > Rupture > Envenom (which also refreshes SnD)
    Post 4 x ilvl 245 = SnD > Envenom

    Obviously you'll refresh HfB when needed. This can cause problems with the required Bleed effect so speak to your friendly hunters and cat druids so you can have a seamless rotation.

  12. #12
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    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    I can't help you cause I'm not a rogue, but the win in the title made me look. It is just awesome
    Quote Originally Posted by Agoonga View Post
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  13. #13
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    Re: Confused...not in a gender way

    Swap your MH and OH. If your weapons are equal in DPS, having the faster one in your mainhand is a slight dps increase. Still put deadly on the faster one.

    As for ruptureless specs, it depends on the content you run. I have problems getting off more than 2-3 envenoms on bosses in 5mans, so even if a spreadsheet showed rupture spec, it wouldn't benefit you whatsoever.

    If you are raiding actively, then trust your spreadsheet on weather or not to use rupture (make sure you change it to a rupture spec and change the glyph/spec appropriately!). If using rupture shows as more damage, then on a boss you'd for sure want to use rupture.

    With the poison damage scaling where it is now, it's completely possible you shouldn't be rupturing.

    Replace your agi/stam gem with a nightmare tear in your helm. The 8 agi bonus is better, and stam doesn't help you as much as a 10str/10agi do.

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