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  1. #41

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Paskgotsheal
    wow we need 1 of each of those.

    BUT yeah you can do good dps as a mangle bitch, look i'm number 1 in the world on blood queen 10 on world of logs (not just ferals either, overall)

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/...7thel/10N/dps/


    Don't think we're having any problems at all, just a simple l2p issue... I even got the festergut25 feral record this week without having my 4pc t10 yet or DBW (doesn't drop) or hysteria or tricks. So it's def a l2play/gear issue.
    you did get ToT'ed 5 times and got 2 hysteria's during blood queen though. I bet hysteria + 100% damage buff from the fight + ToT + berzerk causes some huuuge burst. Still quite an achievement though, wouldnt be able to do the same

  2. #42

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by K-PAX
    Dropping rake? can you please explain more?
    You mean completely ignoring rake?
    I believe this is only viable if your no longer running 2pc T9 and are pushin hard cap ArPen.. But obviously if 4pc T10 u gonna wanna run with rake.

  3. #43

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Arel
    Don't push crit.

    At the crit levels you'll have merely from gear when you Hardcap ArP, Haste becomes so fucking better than the other stats it's embarassing. If you have spare gems, go for that.
    Well i think u misread my post....i am maintaning SOFT cap arpen, by swapping out Arpen gems for agility as my gear progresses until i know i can push past Hard ArPen threshold. But you brought up a good point and prolly gem agility + haste gems for socket bonuses rather than agility + crit gems or purely 20 haste for yellow sockets. (i am hit and expertise cap'd)

    Unfornately to make hard ArPen cap, 1406 from the BiS gear i've looked into, requires almost every gem to be Arpen with 3 or so variances for socket bonuses, and majority of that gear is 277 ilvl....so it's gonna be a while.


  4. #44

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by K-PAX
    Dropping rake? can you please explain more?
    You mean completely ignoring rake?
    I looked at my logs and Shred always has a higher DPE than Rake + Rake dots. Whether it works for you is dependant on gear. I've dropped my T9 2pc and stack ArP to 1200+, Rake doesn't benefit from either. 2pc T9 would make the comparison much closer bringing Rake ahead of Shred DPE-wise.

    On SF and FG I Rake on my 3rd GCD to get a bleed up but that's it, so yeah pretty much ignoring Rake.

  5. #45

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonberry
    If a raid doesn't have an arms warrior, there is a high chance they are missing the 4% physical buff, which is about 2-3k dps for the average raid anyways. (What kind of rogue plays combat anymore? mut is 3 buttons and higher dps.)
    Combat's putting out more DPS at higher gear levels the last I heard.

  6. #46

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by raxin
    Well i think u misread my post....i am maintaning SOFT cap arpen, by swapping out Arpen gems for agility as my gear progresses until i know i can push past Hard ArPen threshold. But you brought up a good point and prolly gem agility + haste gems for socket bonuses rather than agility + crit gems or purely 20 haste for yellow sockets. (i am hit and expertise cap'd)

    Unfornately to make hard ArPen cap, 1406 from the BiS gear i've looked into, requires almost every gem to be Arpen with 3 or so variances for socket bonuses, and majority of that gear is 277 ilvl....so it's gonna be a while.
    Soft-capping ArP, when you're at 70% or more crit raidbuffed, going full Haste is better than going full Agility.
    It comes within 3% DPS than hardcapping ArP.
    Quote Originally Posted by Qieth
    I don't do math, blind assumptions work so much better for me.

  7. #47

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Arel
    Soft-capping ArP, when you're at 70% or more crit raidbuffed, going full Haste is better than going full Agility.
    It comes within 3% DPS than hardcapping ArP.
    Whats the source?

  8. #48

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Biznick
    Whats the source?
    Testing on different models.
    Pick an hard-cap gearset, mark the result on a simulation tool.
    Pick a soft-cap gearset, obviously of comparable item-level, go all out on Haste.

    Compare the dps results. I tried on a model of mine and on RAWR and the results were almost identical. I'll check on Toskk when I have more time.
    We discussed it on a thread in this forum not so long ago. Try to search it, I don't remember the title now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Qieth
    I don't do math, blind assumptions work so much better for me.

  9. #49

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Arel
    Testing on different models.
    Pick an hard-cap gearset, mark the result on a simulation tool.
    Pick a soft-cap gearset, obviously of comparable item-level, go all out on Haste.

    Compare the dps results. I tried on a model of mine and on RAWR and the results were almost identical. I'll check on Toskk when I have more time.
    We discussed it on a thread in this forum not so long ago. Try to search it, I don't remember the title now.
    I will

    It just seems pretty unbelievable.

    With Rake critting, AP and crit values are going to increase incredibly.

    That being said, I don't see why anyone should stack haste before even hitting crit/exp/hit caps.

    Even after crit/exp/hit and arp caps are achieved, Str seems to be the stat to gem for.

  10. #50

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Biznick
    I will

    It just seems pretty unbelievable.

    With Rake critting, AP and crit values are going to increase incredibly.

    That being said, I don't see why anyone should stack haste before even hitting crit/exp/hit caps.

    Even after crit/exp/hit and arp caps are achieved, Str seems to be the stat to gem for.
    Allow me to clarify. "Comparable item level", means we're talking 264+ gear.
    At that level (granted we cap hit and expertise, but my personal opinion on the matter is that their the first priority) you get, in a raid buffed situation practically 70% or more crit. So you're extremely close to the cap, if not at it.

    It surprised me at first, a lot. I expect no less than it being surprising for you as well. Strength would be best on a first glance, but in truth it's not. Haste extremely boosts white dps, and through it OoC procs and specials.

    The testing seems to push Haste until a very deep level then Strength comes up again, but only later on. What is the trick behind that, it's beyond me. I'm quite good at modeling stuff, but it would take a very long analysis to know what the stat evolution really is.
    I do trust those numbers tho.

    Edit: on a side note, my feral DPS gear, which isn't uber-top, already throws me at 65.7% crit in raids, while gemming ArP. Crit cap is high in theory... but practically not that much.
    Also, I'm trying to fix my gear and go for Haste, for a live-server testing of that. I need some more passive ArP tho before I can do a deep regemming.
    Quote Originally Posted by Qieth
    I don't do math, blind assumptions work so much better for me.

  11. #51

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Please, please, please stop telling people to drop Rake because Rake DPE < Shred DPE, it's completely based off your current raid buffed stats, do yourselves a favor and use whatever website or simulation program you use and check for yourself, my Rake DPE is slightly above my Shred's, and this is with 90%+ passive ARP and no 2P9 (broke it for Putri10 helm)...

    When trying to figure out what is "the best" for your DPS toons in wow, everyone should be basing all their numbers off THEIR OWN STATS, all those numbers you read on EJ are usually based off what is simulated out be the absolute best dps, not based off WHAT YOU'RE CURRENTLY WEARING ON YOUR OWN TOON dot dot dot

  12. #52

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Charo
    Please, please, please stop telling people to drop Rake because Rake DPE < Shred DPE, it's completely based off your current raid buffed stats, do yourselves a favor and use whatever website or simulation program you use and check for yourself, my Rake DPE is slightly above my Shred's, and this is with 90%+ passive ARP and no 2P9 (broke it for Putri10 helm)...

    When trying to figure out what is "the best" for your DPS toons in wow, everyone should be basing all their numbers off THEIR OWN STATS, all those numbers you read on EJ are usually based off what is simulated out be the absolute best dps, not based off WHAT YOU'RE CURRENTLY WEARING ON YOUR OWN TOON dot dot dot
    Eh? Since I was pretty much the only one talking about it, and didn't even advocate it.

    Whether it works for you is dependant on gear.
    While 2 weeks of parses aren't a definitive answer, I'm happy with it.

  13. #53

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Well i am not gonna drop rake anytime soon , i fukt up my rotation on festergut 10m, didn't blow anything special, was drunk, but got 4pc T10.....and was pulling 9.4k dps

  14. #54

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    I got a question how much dps do you guys pull on the training dummies selfed buff? I gotta know if its something im doing wrong or im just lacking buffs in my raids.

  15. #55

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    I tried dropping rake out of my rotation this past week and I was pulling a few hundred dps more than usual. It's also quite a bit easier since there is less to juggle. IMO if you don't have a mangle/trauma bot then give it a shot; you might be surprised.

  16. #56

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryuhou
    I got a question how much dps do you guys pull on the training dummies selfed buff? I gotta know if its something im doing wrong or im just lacking buffs in my raids.
    most i've hit with just motw is 6.2k. Sometimes it's as low as 5.3k. It all depends on RNG and how lucky you get with OoC procs. It's a lot easier with the haste and crit buffs you get in raids.

  17. #57

    Re: Top dps being the mangle bitch

    Quote Originally Posted by raxin
    Well i am not gonna drop rake anytime soon , i fukt up my rotation on festergut 10m, didn't blow anything special, was drunk, but got 4pc T10.....and was pulling 9.4k dps
    6.3-6.8k usually, sometimes hit 7k

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