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  1. #101

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trucidor
    "Arthas attacked our capitals, let's go kill him!"
    "Wait, a dragon! Let's go kill it."
    "Ok, back to Arth-"
    "Look, an old god! Let's get him!"
    "Alright, now back to Arth-"
    "Oh, Tirion's having a carnival!"
    "Alright, now we'll go kill Arthas."
    "Yay, Arthas is dead!"
    I LOVE IT. Ahahaha
    Quote Originally Posted by Gulo
    Clothes are merely a setback!

  2. #102

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    I think the people are making a mistake comparing BC and WotLK.

    BC honestly did not make a whole lot of sense. The Legion was the threat, all things are agreed. Why are Illidan and Vashj and Kael our enemies? They have nothing to do with the Legion, in fact they are actively opposing the Legion all across Draenor. We kill them though, because they're douches. Those are three of the biggest raids in BC and they just plain don't have a lot to do with the Burning Legion. Yeah, Kara had a demon final boss, but he didn't seem to be doing much up in that tower by himself. Mag made sense, he's providing Illidan with Fel Orcs. Illidan is our enemy for some reason that's not explained other than "awesome raid boss", so I guess that means taking out Mag is strategic. Gruul isn't there for much other than attunement and loot. He's just a big angry monster. He's not really threatening anyone, nor are his sons for that matter. They're not assaulting any settlements or doing anything at all, other than stomp around, look around and then for a nice change of pace, stomp around some more. (And provide the Alliance with an awesome quest to fight alongside a Black Dragon, but I digress)

    Alright, so let's move into Wrath.

    Naxx. Alright, good start. Recycled content, but it's been so long since Naxx was out, and so few people even saw it, that's not even a valid complaint. Good raid, fun, relevant. It's a threat, it's hovering over Wintergarde and messing with the Alliance. Good so far. Sarth? Doesn't have much to do with the Scourge or the Lich King, that's true. Plays heavily towards Cataclysm though, which is cool and shows that Blizzard's thinking ahead already. Check for that too. Malygos? Perfectly understandable. There is no military might being wasted on Malygos. The Argent Crusade and Ebon Blade aren't rolling out to oppose him. It's the Dragons problems, they're dealing with it. The fact that Malygos' tapping of the ley lines is making people crazy and or dead is a real concern, especially since Dragonblight is one of the main staging areas of the war. Summary, he's not relevant on his own to the threat of the Scourge. Alright, let's dig deeper...

    Ulduar. Brann has discovered some pretty serious stuff in both Halls of Stone and Lightning. Enough to cause some concern. So when he finds out that Yogg-Saron is kickin, well, everything else needs to kind of go on hold. Arthas for some reason, isn't very active right now, so again, it's logical, like with Malygos, to target the immediate threat. Yogg goes down, Algalon shows up, same deal. This gets a pass, simply because the old gods are such a huge threat.

    ToC. This is directly relevant towards fighting the Scourge and Arthas. The entire point of the tournament is to train soldiers and weed out the incapable for the assault on Icecrown. Even of the Scourge didn't show up, which they most certainly do, it would still be connected. Call it filler all you like, ToC was very much in line with the Scourge threat.

    ICC. I don't think I need to go over it.

    So, is Arthas the main antagonist of Wrath? Yes. But on the flip side, he's also the biggest HERO in Wrath. That's what makes Wrath, to me at least, more interesting than BC. If it wasn't for that one tortured sliver of Arthas remaining within that body, the world would be over. If Arthas wasn't holding back the Scourge, if he was actively attempting to crush his enemies in the field instead of recruit them to his side, all would've been lost. Either the Scourge would've overwhelmed the attackers and conquered, or we wouldn't have the manpower and time to deal with Algalon and Malygos. So there's your answer. Arthas is the antagonist of Wrath. And he's also the Hero. Take it for what it's worth.

  3. #103
    Does not like cats. Dark Side's Avatar
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    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Regardless of Arthas' deeds, Yogg-Saron is the one...true...evil...king....of.....stuff....
    Arthas killed alot humans you say? well yogg(or other old god) MADE the humans. Untill we get to Sargeras, the old gods will most always be the main antagonist....or protagonist for some

  4. #104
    Stood in the Fire Zulluhead's Avatar
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    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Daginni
    While he was the focus of the expansion. I believe he was a pawn on Ner'Zul (yes, he is killed in the book, but I think Blizzard is actually under the impression Ner'Zul is alive).
    well it did say it was in a DREAm

    and if bliz says he aint dead then he aint dead

  5. #105

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    The two main antagonists of this expansion were Frostmourne and Algalon.

    Algalon, without anybody even knowing about it, was only 1 hour away from destroying the entire lifebase of Azeroth , and the worst part about it is that he genuinly thought he was in the right for doing so, and he had already done the exact same thing to countless other planets throughout the universe. THAT constitites serious danger, because A: He from a lore point of view was faaaaar more powerful than Arthas, Eradar or even the Old Gods since he weilded the direct power of the Titans. The fact that we had absolutly no idea of his existance is the crutial part of his sinister nature. He wasn't scheming, evil or hated. He was simply doing his job like it was nothing more important than sending a fax.

    Frostmourne is definatly the real evil behind The Lich King. Once Frostmourne was destroyed, Bolvar had absolutely no problem keeping his sanity and humanity after fusing his mind with Ner'zhul and the helm, unlike Arthas who, because of Frostmournes unquenchable thirst and hunger for power and souls, transfered this craving to Arthas, who simply couldnt stop wanting more power. Without it's influence, Bolvar/Ner'zhul kept their sanity and became a benevolant demi-god. No Frostmourne = Bomb defused.


    Now...the really interesting thing is A: Who will take the blame for Deathwing's rampage and madness, and B: Will the scourge become an ally in a desperate time of need somethime down the line? Smart money says that yes, Bolvar will bend the scourge to become a force of reckoning against foes, but Deathwing...is he STILL being controlled by Old Gods? We already know that he was being manipulated and twisted by more than just one of them...perhaps we'll be dropping in on some of C'thun and Yogg'saron's aunts and uncles sooner than we thought. Personally though I would REALLY like a story arc that didn't end in "Ok I forgive you, you were tripping balls so it's cool." For once can't the enemy be just that? A real down to earth bad guy with no strings attached? If at the end we get to Deathchin and he's all like "Oh but guys the gods made me do ALL OF IT, I'm back to being Neltharion now, see? It's all ok!" I will be SO PEEVED!

  6. #106

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Golemagg the Incinerator
    That works for any expansion.

    "The dark irons are hiding something in molten core lets go explore!"
    "Onxyia tried to ursurp the Stormwind Crown, lets go kill her!"
    "Oh no, Nefarious is preparing to attack us from BWL!."
    "Yay, we're free... oh no GIANT ANTS!"
    "Now we're safe, uh oh Arthas is sending naxx at us!"
    "Alright, now everything is don... WTF the portal opened to outland!"
    "Yadda Yadda..."
    Thats what I liked about Vanilla particularly. There was no "main antagonist" bullcrap that Blizz is trying to do every expansion now. There were hundreds of different stories with many different villains you could choose to combat depending on where you quest. Now its just a roller coaster ride to the main guy sitting on his chair, waiting for something to happen. Nothing will happen any time soon, though, because weve been waiting for HIM to do something. Unlike Onyxia, who endangered the nearbye settlements of the Alliance, manipulated the inner council of Stormwind, killed Marshal Windsor, and was responsible for the long absence of oru king, keeping Stormwind in a weak state for several years.
    Unlike Ragnaros, who fueled the destruction and endangerment of the the dwarven kingdom. Who forced the armies of Iron Forge to retreat from war to defend their turf, further weakening the Alliance and its needed aid across the world. Who was kept at bay only because of the toil between him and Nefarian. He was dispatched of before he could unleash his strength. But now, he advances upon the world Tree, threatening the Night Elves and the world once more. He wont be just sitting in his citadel either.

    And many others. LK was boring. He did nothing to create suspense, or give incentive to kill him. If anything, the horde attacking the alliance throughout NR had more effect than the scourge.

  7. #107

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Scarlet Onslaught = Biggest Bad, Imo.

    The only noobs to actually use their army, Arthas kindly posted all of his undead scourge in patrols right outside strategic places far enough away from eachother so we can lure one guard away then deal with the other guard
    Oh... A Twilight/Wow Cross over RP huh?... Alright, I'll join in, My name is Bae'noukul, I'm a 36,978 year old Demon Warlock. I walk into the room where everything is happening now, and because I need to have one weakness I DIE ON THE SPOT. Three guesses as to what my weakness was.

  8. #108

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    I May be a tad bit Biased since i loved Ulduar much more then any other raid but I'd think Titan's coming to our planet and blowing it up, or an Old god taking control of Azeroth and moving on to countless other planets is a much bigger threat then the Lich King taking over the world and sitting back wondering what to do next.
    I could be wrong about what LK's plans were after he was done with Azeroth, but chances are it wouldnt be as bad as anything involved with titans/old gods.

  9. #109

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Classic had no Main antagonist because Blizzard wanted to introcuce a few major threats probably, Like the Old Gods, Black dragonflight, Maybe even Ragnaros, and the scourge as well.... All of those we have fought/are going to fight in the last 2/next expansion. Without a major antagonist the expansion would seem a bit like a nonstop tangent, although i do like there to be some difference in the enemies we fight... Kinda like Without Ulduar, Wotlk would have been much more boring considering every single raid would be based on Scourge (Actual raid, no ony or vault) it'd get boring quicker

  10. #110

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    I think it's a case of simply there was a lot of bad shit going on in Northrend. You got evil ass old gods bustin out of their tombs, you got twilight dragons plottin on you, you got dragon aspects going insane and wanting to kill shit, and you got the lich king and all his bros getting wild.

    I enjoyed the diversity, I don't think I could have handled 4-6 raids of coldfrosticedeathplagueshadowwinterfreezedarkunholy shit.

  11. #111

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trucidor
    Algalon.

    Seriously. I'd say a guy who was an hour away from completely obliterating our entire planet was a bigger threat than a guy who was just chilling up in his penthouse suite waiting for us to go see him.

    The expansion was Wrath of the Lich King, but I didn't see any Wrath - outside of a small attack against Org and Stormind over a year ago.

    Other than that, the expansion can be summed up as:

    "Arthas attacked our capitals, let's go kill him!"
    "Wait, a dragon! Let's go kill it."
    "Ok, back to Arth-"
    "Look, an old god! Let's get him!"
    "Alright, now back to Arth-"
    "Oh, Tirion's having a carnival!"
    "Alright, now we'll go kill Arthas."
    "Yay, Arthas is dead!"


    RULE!
    this must be quoted on every page for being simply the best response of all time.

  12. #112

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Quote Originally Posted by nightripper5
    global warming is this expansions main antagonist...
    I totally agree. The truth is the day the Gore divorce is officially signed is the day Cataclysm goes live.
    Car suspensions! Om nom nom nom!

  13. #113

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Slightly off-topic, about Ulduar and its ties to Arthas.

    While at first glance Yoggy does not have any direct ties to Arthas himself, he does have his own huge presence within the Northrend continent. First hinted at the dwarven mine in Howling Fjord, followed the corrupted world tree in Grizzly Hills and the disappearance of the protectors in Storm Peaks.
    Heck, I personally believe Yogg and Arthas share a theme: control. All visions in Yogg's brainroom seem to hint at it: Deathwing convincing the other aspects to share their power with him (we all know how it ended), Arthas trying to break the mind of Bolvar, and Garonas assassination of King Llane, which was also achieved by dominating her mind.
    So, again, they might not share an actual bond, but they do share a theme.

    As for Algalon, he could've been thrown it anywhere, since he doesn't just represent the effects of Yogg-saron, he's enforcing his power on entire Azeroth, including the events at AQ. Most likely he's only been properly aware of the events now, now that Ulduar had been under siege.

    Feel free to call me out on bullshit, I'm here to learn

  14. #114

    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    You need to do some lore reading.

    Arthas does not exist anymore, He combined with Nerzul and became the Lich King, neither one nor the other. Do some reading on the matter, it's actually pretty interesting stuff.

  15. #115
    Stood in the Fire Jeer's Avatar
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    Re: Was Arthas really this expansion's main antagonist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Golemagg the Incinerator
    That works for any expansion.

    "The dark irons are hiding something in molten core lets go explore!"
    "Onxyia tried to ursurp the Stormwind Crown, lets go kill her!"
    "Oh no, Nefarious is preparing to attack us from BWL!."
    "Yay, we're free... oh no GIANT ANTS!"
    "Now we're safe, uh oh Arthas is sending naxx at us!"
    "Alright, now everything is don... WTF the portal opened to outland!"
    "Yadda Yadda..."
    thats not the same... wrath had a main bad guy which was arthas vanilla didnt last i checked

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